Opinions Wanted- Older simpler 2004-2008 vs Newer Models with DEF Systems

[220629]

See my reply in your previous thread.

Thanks.
I merged the duplicate threads.

For general information.
Please do not create duplicate threads. It clutters the forum and as is evidenced by Elemental's response, creates disjointed discussions.

vic

 

[Deleted member 50714]

Thank you, you appreciation is appreciated.

I don't know where it came from but it sounds like something Henry Ford would say.

 

[Deleted member 50714]

Not when plastics start to deteriorate around.
I was still considering buying W126 coupe just for fun and lot of them are still daily drivers in California, but even the "garage kept" have seat, dashboard and steering wheels covers. There is no way you can restore them to original spec even when money is no object.
Few years ago, spending quality time on Junk Yard, I salvaged cast-aluminium gear shiftier cover plate. Guess what year it was before MB switched to plastic?

My excellent Benz bother, the 21st century term is "POLYMER" the great great great grandson of PLASTIC.

 

[Deleted member 50714]

I'm going to have to disagree on this one, especially for recreational vehicles. I will grant that Uber/Lyft make a lot of sense in many use cases. But I'm not going to take one to drive 100 miles, and won't want to have the trip take all day on public transportation either. I think there will always be a need for personal ownership, maybe down from two per family to one, in many areas of the country. Lots of people recently have decided that maybe living in a densely packed city is not the best thing.

For recreational vehicles, especially for those on these forums, I expect that a generic (cheapest they can put together) recreational vehicle just won't cut it. Many on here have highly customized their vehicles to meet their lifestyle and use cases. I installed 400Ah of Lithium batteries and hundreds of watts of solar panels so we can boondock and not have to hook up to power or use a generator. I don't see that in rentals. They all are spewing fumes during the non quiet hours and are built on the cheapest chassis that are unstable on the road and get 10 mpg.

Regards,

Mark

Niche markets like RVs will linger but eventually replaced with immersive television.

 

[220629]

... Guess what year it was before MB switched to plastic?

Did I miss the answer? My guess would be 1980's.

vic

 

[Kajtek1]

Did I miss the answer? My guess would be 1980's.

vic

All W123 I have seen had plastic gear shiftier covers and they come on the market in 1976.
The aluminium cover I keep as souvenir come from earlier model, that did not have W number at the time.
So late 1960's / early 1970's

 

[Deleted member 50714]

And... maybe someday we can be 3-D printed at desired destination with polymer skeleton and updated firmware.

 

[Deleted member 50714]

So what's the consensus of the best year?

 

[Deleted member 50714]

I call a vote!?

 

[Deleted member 50714]

2018

 

[Kajtek1]

I consider OM651 engine real technological marvel, so any year you can get with this engine is excelent IMHO, even if down the road you will have to spend $1000 on DPF or $2400 on new DEF tank (I hope aftermarket will come with substitutes before I will need 1).
Mercedes makes what seems even better OM654 engine, but I don't see it in Sprinters, or actually any MB model available in America.

 

[tom2turbo]

Our 24 month San Diego area search for suitable base van included 2004-2008 with no preference. No NCV3 examples came available that we could timely view and offer on. So the 2006 T1N 140 with 215,000 miles is my project that is mainly rust free and in good mechanical condition.

 

[Vanman2004b]

I had a 2004. It was totaled in 2008 when I was rear ended by a Hyundia. Bought a 2008 the same day. The 2004 had 190K miles at the time and the 2008 has 400K now. I will not buy another one. They are far to complicated and expensive to repair. The room and high roof are very nice for a work van.

The 2004 got much better fuel mileage and maintenance items like the fuel filter and battery are much easier to get to, as well as the HVAC blower. The 2004 seemed to be designed as a truck with maintenance at least thought of while the 2008 seems more like a car with comfort trumping access to maintenance items. I also liked the truck style interior better. The V6 is smoother than the I5.

If I had to choose between a 2004 and a 2008 in the same condition there would be no contest, the 2008 would win.

At one time I considered a newer model but DEF convinced me not to get one.

 

[Deleted member 50714]

You quoted my father favorite comment about speed bumps.
My father extensively traveled around the World several times and he hates speed bumps he is having a lot in his hometown California.
His comment is that speed bumps are necessary only in Africa, where car owner can break the law in the city - only to vanish in the jungle for months to come.
In civilized places we do have licence plates and LE who has tons of technological gadgets to catch law-breaking drivers.
Yet we do have speed bumps.

I was quite a whippersnapper I was... living on a dirt road near orange orchards and having morons routinely do brodie's and such, I invented the inverse speedbump known as the "Speed trench".

Nice good 18-inch wide, 12 inch deep RUT strategically positioned parallel and common to north east property corner and obscured with giant oleander bushes.

On afternoon, saw a lowered, 64 Impala make the turn, do to a giant dust producing brody, accelerate and BAM!!! SONABITCH! I heard him yell. He he he.

 

[Kajtek1]

You bad Bob.
I live next to desert, so lot of youngsters would park on short block for marijuana puff, or beer drinking.
Somehow today's culture require to leave lunch trash on the center of the street, when all glass bottles have to be smack against the curb.
In my case $7 dummy camera solved the problem.
Hang it on street light pole and few months later neighbor ask me to install another one on her corner.

 

[Deleted member 50714]

You Bad to the Bone Bob.

Fixed!

 

[Wrinkledpants]

Hello again Sprinter Peeps- The last time I asked this the conversation went completely off-topic and didn't answer my questions.
So, I'm looking for a decent shell to build a camper, have a limited budget, and am looking at minimum a 158 wheelbase. I'm handy but not a mechanic. Do I buy the well-liked 2006 year? Is there a strong reason to go 2007-2009?

Thanks in advance....

My choice would always be for a newer vehicle. I've spent my entire adult life owning older German cars, and while it's always felt rewarding knowing them inside and out, it can be exhausting maintaining them. I feel like people over react about the DEF system. If driven with an understanding how diesels work (not just MB's, but Ford, Cummins, etc), it's not hard to get good reliability from them.

That said, you're buying a used van with higher miles (assuming you're doing the same with newer vans). If you're sticking with the NCV3, you don't have any features that feel non-negotiable to you, then here's how I'd shop for a van:

1. Ignore DEF vs non-DEF, condition will be the most important
2. Remove any van from the running that's been owned in a salt state
3. Require documentation. A history of consistent service at reputable shops (not oil changes at Jiffy)
4. Visual condition should match a good history. Doesn't need to be show-room quality, but no major body damage, an interior that looks like it's kept somewhat tidy, and an engine compartment that see's some cleaning.

Figure spending $500 to $2000 to baseline any used van. Catching up overdue maintenance, refreshing some parts showing age (belt tensioners, control arms, etc). I would almost say ignore mileage as what TYPE of mileage will be WAY more important. Was it low mileage, but delivering around a city? Does it have 300K miles from a mid-west road warrior? I would almost say that 300K motor will be healthier than a 100K motor that's seen mostly city life.

DEF system is like a fuel system - it has parts that can fail, but with some care, attention, and understanding - you'll likely be in the camp who experiences minimal issues.

 

[douglassprints]

No experience with the DEF system. But the 2008 170, 2500, at 245k had one DPF replaced before I bought it and is ready for another.

 

[Kajtek1]

I feel like people over react about the DEF system. If driven with an understanding how diesels work (not just MB's, but Ford, Cummins, etc), it's not hard to get good reliability from them.

knowledge is the power.
When first DPF hit the market, there was no monitoring system available. Manufacturers were learning new trade as well, so manual gave 0 recommendations how to use new system.
So when a guy who did mostly city driving and had 1 DPF replaced during warranty and 2nd short time after warranty expired was facing the cost - he got rid of the car and gave it bad reviews.
Bottom feeder who got good car for fraction of its original cost come to the forum Bi***ng "why I have to spend $4000 on new DPF on car that I bought for $6000?"
Now times changed. All smart diesel owners drive with monitoring system and know to not abort regenerations.