Sprinter or Transit?

[Polonus]

I was sold on Transit after driving EcoBoost with 10 speed. I wasn't impressed with Sprinter - it is more "truck-like". I don't think I'll ever need a 4WD. I am not planning to go around the world anytime soon. Lock diff plus set of chains in the trunk should get me out from the wet grass if I ever get stuck. And for less then 6K I can get 8 years 150 000 miles extended warranty, zero deductible, which covers also turbocharger. I know, extended warranties usually are good only for those, who sells them, but this is Ford's own and it'll give me peace of mind.

 

[T town]

A four cylinder gas engine in a cargo van converted for camping better stay in the flatland.

Transit AWD has four levels of engagement and will direct 50/50 split power to the front/rear wheels. That's pretty close to 4wd. And if you're a purist, get the Quadvan or Quigley parts added then you can go places in your van that you shouldn't.

Mercedes will only send 40% power to the front wheels and hubs are not locked. If you have ever had a true 4wd vehicle that could shift into 4wd high on the fly and lock the hubs in 4wd low, you will know the difference. Mercedes requires you to stop the van to engage "4wd". Not the best plan when you come to a soft spot and need those front wheels to pull NOW.
And, you're right. Let's not talk about needing to have it worked on. $$$$$ if you can find a dealer with a tech who's trained on the Sprinter.

Can you tell that I think the Sprinter is over-rated? We could always talk about how much flex there is in the Sprinter on uneven ground.

It will do 100% to the front wheels if it has to.

 

[GotDiesel?]

It will do 100% to the front wheels if it has to.

You are referring to the AWD Transit I assume.

 

[T town]

Yes. AWD. BTW, I asked before what makes Sprinter 4WD? Anybody know? Is it just because they call it that?

 

[Kajtek1]

From what I know the only 4WD Mercedes make for private market are G-wagen and Unimogs.
All so-called 4 Matics have all open differentials and only in last 20 years electronic system is using ABS pump to clamp spinning wheel.
That is great help, but with limits. I had 1998 ML320 that I was trying in difficult situations. When on gravel, the system took over a second to clamp spinning wheel. The second + was enough for big wheel to dig the gravel under and the corner was sitting on the axle.
Lot of pickups are commonly called 4WD, when the only thing that help is solid transfer case. That is still leaving you stranded when you have 2 wheels spinning.
I never went to such extreme, but IMHO the only truly off-road vehicles are the mentioned above with 3 lockable differentials.

 

[Polonus]

Talking about AWD... Many moons ago I was working in Krakow, Poland in the trucking company, where we were using Check trucks Tatra as a "balast tractors" - trucks with concrete block attached to the frame behind the cab for better traction. They were used to pull heavy trailers, equipped with 4 axles, 8 wheels per axle. Tatras were truly 6WD, with lockable 3 axles and all differs. One day they bought Russian KrAZ to do the same job. Proud driver washed it in freezing temperature and... when he finished he couldn't move it. 3 wheels, one on each axle, were spinning, but other three where solidly frozen to the flat, concrete place he was at. I am not sure now if he just didn't know how to lock the differentials, or that truck didn't have that option, but then we thought it didn't have it and everybody were laughing at that "military grade Russian vehicle, which is stuck on flat, concrete place.

 

[lindenengineering]

From what I know the only 4WD Mercedes make for private market are G-wagen and Unimogs.
All so-called 4 Matics have all open differentials and only in last 20 years electronic system is using ABS pump to clamp spinning wheel.
That is great help, but with limits. I had 1998 ML320 that I was trying in difficult situations. When on gravel, the system took over a second to clamp spinning wheel. The second + was enough for big wheel to dig the gravel under and the corner was sitting on the axle.
Lot of pickups are commonly called 4WD, when the only thing that help is solid transfer case. That is still leaving you stranded when you have 2 wheels spinning.
I never went to such extreme, but IMHO the only truly off-road vehicles are the mentioned above with 3 lockable differentials.

Don't forget Steyr Pinzgauer that has a very simple yet sophisticated locking mechanism with shift on the fly by a rudimentary in this case hydraulic handle .
In fact since Tatra have some strong original roots with Steyr .
Hence the Tatras have what can only be a big brother version of the Steyr Pinzgauer.
My only thoughts are why can Kamaz continually dominate international off road competitions like the Dakar, when clearly the Tatra has superior chassis/driveline specs?
Now there is something to debate .
If I was running a logging or mining operation in sub Sahara Africa, Kamaz would be one of my short list picks.

 

[Kajtek1]

I had to relearn geography again last month as I was buying Sprinter from seller who come from Moldavia.
The country did not exist when I was at schools
Anyway, historically speaking - Tatra was manufactured in former Czechoslovakia, who is relatively small country (1/2 size of California) and mostly mountain, hard surface country, while former Soviet Union had huge and muddy terrain for testing Kamaz.
So comparing the huge volume difference of trucks on those different markets, why Kamaz is struggling catching with Tatra?
Not even saying that SU was always famous for stealing technology from other nations.

 

[Wind]

Over the last few days I flip-flopped about what to do. I was sure I'll go with Transit, then I visited couple of Mercedes dealers and sow a beautiful Mercedes with 10 inches nav screen, then someone bought it. Later I test drove Mercedes and it remained me of old Żuk van I drove in Poland in the seventies. Every pothole, every rough surface rattled the body panels. I know, it would go away after putting insulation on it, but still... Then I went to Ford dealer and test drove a Transit with the EcoBoost engine - and... Wow! Suddenly I knew it will be my next van. That thing flies! And is solid as a brick, even when I drive it over rough RR crossing. I am ordering it this Tuesday.



??? Where did you get this number from? For me price is very similar. You cannot compare them exactly, since some options are available on one, not on the other, But I couldn't save anything going for the Sprinter.



Thx. I checked it out and he had one 170" for 42K and many 144's for about 38K, but those vans have almost no options. With no options I can have Sprinter with that wonderful EsoBoost engine for about the same money.



Mercedes turbo gas? Friends in Europe tell me it is a terrible motor and quite weak comparing to EcoBoost. And I'll go for a limited slip differential. With better tires and set of chains in the "garage" no need for AWD, or 4WD.

I went ahead and installed this the other day. Plenty of power now. The only downside is that I have to haul a 20 foot tanker trailer to make it to the grocery store.

 

[lindenengineering]

I had to relearn geography again last month as I was buying Sprinter from seller who come from Moldavia.
The country did not exist when I was at schools
Anyway, historically speaking - Tatra was manufactured in former Czechoslovakia, who is relatively small country (1/2 size of California) and mostly mountain, hard surface country, while former Soviet Union had huge and muddy terrain for testing Kamaz.
So comparing the huge volume difference of trucks on those different markets, why Kamaz is struggling catching with Tatra?
Not even saying that SU was always famous for stealing technology from other nations.

Well stealing technology from other countries and competitors is as age old as espionage --it happens all the time.
What is not so easy to copy and reduce the price of the construction is the unique pivot axle drive line of the Tatra AND the Pinzgauer.
Sharing some common features it allows shift on the fly without with the associated gear pinon clash that often goes with it .
I was introduced to the drive-line when the UK county I worked for in 1971, purchased 6 off 6x6 Pinzgauers for specialty operations in land/field maintenance.
Consequently I got to attend some very unique tech courses on that Styer product at their plant in Gratz.
I came away from that experience as totally convinced of the drive line application and its superior expediency for specialist vehicles.
Even today I/We still repair & service ex Swiss & Austrian army Pinzgauers for customers, & I have two units in the shop at present for extensive repairs.
Here are some shots of the Tatra and Pinzgauer drive line features.
Dennis

diagram Tatra drive line - Google Search

 

[SMARTrides]

I think both gas engines should have similar MPG figures. Sprinter's is smaller, but has to work harder.

Can you explain the "fun to drive" part? I thought Sprinter drives like a luxury car, when Transit has to be a "work horse" of the vans. My test drive at the MB dealer is scheduled for Wednesday. I drove Ford and RAM, didn't like either, but it was very short drive around the block. My Volvo VNL, 18-wheeler, rides better. (just kidding, but not really).

The sprinter drives like anything but luxury. Its made for commercial use so it’s made rough. All the insides are hard plastic and no insulation or sound deadening material at all. The inside of cab is loud especially over 65 mph. I have a 2019 2500 diesel. I do love it but it is definitely not a luxury car

 

[Graphite Dave]

"Fun to drive" is acceleration and handling. Ecoboost makes it fun. Better suspension and more rigid body provides better handling. My 2008 Sprinter drove more like a truck and the 2015 Transit drives more like a car. Sprinter will get better mpg but has higher maintenance costs, higher fuel cost/gallon and less service locations. So far my Transit has been significantly more reliable. Transit has zero prestige.

Both have advantages and disadvantages.

 

[solovam]

I have had 2019 Transit (130", medium roof) and switched to high roof 4x4 144" Sprinter. I like driving Sprinter much better. The steering is a lot more precise and less tiring at high speed, fewer corrections required. It feels more secure on interstates at 70-85mph. The Mercedes has amazing brakes. I love those brakes. Brakes tend to be tricky for car makers, Sprinter brakes are better than any cars I have owned.

Transit, perhaps due to its short wheel base was doing bucking motion on a concrete paved road, like i-25 north of Denver. After 50 miles my lower back would start hurting. It was so bad, I had to avoid this stretch and take back roads. Sprinter seems to be doing fine there.

I had the most basic large 3.6 engine in the Transit, lots of power. The engine in Sprinter is of course slightly weird with its late turbo pickup. I do not care about the engine much though. Seems to have enough power to pass somebody doing 70 on a two lane road, what else would I want?

I preferred the cab ergonomics in Transit. Better visibility, light interior, better elbow support. For a van owner, Sprinter is nicer to get between back and the driver seat. All the electronics in Sprinter I would rather not have. Just give me traditional parking brake and gear shifter. Electronics scares me, reliability wise.

All in all, in my opinion Sprinter is a better driver.

Talking about 4x4 vs RWD is probably not fair, but it is a necessity, in my opinion. If you plan to ever take the van off pavement, even on an occasional dry dirt road, summer or winter, AWD/4x4 is a necessity. I think front wheel drive (RAM) probably would have been acceptable, but RWD is just no good. In winter, no tires, even studs solve the RWD problem.

I love the ground clearance in 4x4 Sprinter (although not for getting in and out!).The AWD Transit has the same clearance as RWD. I totally get now why Ford did that, it's a real feat of engineering. But for those of us that want to take the van off pavement, even just to pull off a side of a dirt road to camp on forest service land, the ground clearance is very important. MB 4x4 system is insane, why do I need to fiddle to engage 4x4? Just make it work with a button or a shifter, seriously!

I do think that Sprinter is a better quality build than the Ford. I would describe Ford build as a "budget lawn mower". The paint is better in MB (significantly!). The parts fit better. The spot welding inside is better. The Sprinter does not cut corners on things like wheel well liners, mud flaps or any other things you would expect in a modern vehicle. Less crappy plastic under the hood.

Transit feels like Ford left out anything that would not contribute to driveability for however long the van is typically leased by a commercial outfit. If a part does not affect speed, it's left out. This is not to say that MB build quality is good either. Sprinter is not a Honda or a Subaru, but still much better than Transit.

 

[Polonus]

The sprinter drives like anything but luxury. Its made for commercial use so it’s made rough. All the insides are hard plastic and no insulation or sound deadening material at all. The inside of cab is loud especially over 65 mph. I have a 2019 2500 diesel. I do love it but it is definitely not a luxury car

"Fun to drive" is acceleration and handling. Ecoboost makes it fun. Better suspension and more rigid body provides better handling. My 2008 Sprinter drove more like a truck and the 2015 Transit drives more like a car. Sprinter will get better mpg but has higher maintenance costs, higher fuel cost/gallon and less service locations. So far my Transit has been significantly more reliable. Transit has zero prestige.

Both have advantages and disadvantages.

I have had 2019 Transit (130", medium roof) and switched to high roof 4x4 144" Sprinter. I like driving Sprinter much better. The steering is a lot more precise and less tiring at high speed, fewer corrections required. It feels more secure on interstates at 70-85mph. The Mercedes has amazing brakes. I love those brakes. Brakes tend to be tricky for car makers, Sprinter brakes are better than any cars I have owned.
[...]

All in all, in my opinion Sprinter is a better driver.

[...]

Transit feels like Ford left out anything that would not contribute to driveability for however long the van is typically leased by a commercial outfit. If a part does not affect speed, it's left out. This is not to say that MB build quality is good either. Sprinter is not a Honda or a Subaru, but still much better than Transit.

I thing you all are right. Both vans have "positive and negative pluses". That's why some people chose Ford, some Mercedes and even some chose RAM. In 2015 there was interesting test done by Car and Driver, vans with diesel engines. They say:

"The Ram ProMaster, a Fiat Ducato with ram-head logos, is a detestable, shovel-faced thing that appears to have been cobbled together from spare parts. Too harsh? No, not really. The ProMaster itself is an insult. It is the only vehicle in any comparison test in memory to receive zero points in a subjective category from one of our voters."

"Sprinter doesn’t force its driver and passenger to basically stand up while driving. Its seating position is high, of course, but it’s comfortable and the steering wheel is within easy reach. The ergonomics are not nearly as haphazard as those of the Ram, either. And the stereo actually sounds surprisingly decent. It’s the steering, though, that really shocks.
Somehow, Mercedes must have accidentally bolted in the steering from a nicely tuned sedan. Strike that—the steering in the Sprinter is actually better and offers more feel than virtually any current Mercedes sedan. Does that matter in a cargo van? Yes it does, if you’re the one who has to drive it all day."

"[Transit] With its easy step-in height, relative immunity to side winds, strong brakes, and generally big-car demeanor, the Transit feels like an extra-large Ford Flex. That’s a good thing in our book. We’d still make our sweet custom van out of a ’60s Dodge A100, but the Transit surely drives a hell of a lot better. And it certainly carries more beer."

Final Results
Vehicle	Rank Max Pts. Available	1 2015 Ford Transit 150 Power Stroke	2 2015 Mercedes-Benz Sprinter 2500 BlueTec	3 2014 Ram ProMaster 1500 EcoDiesel
Driver Comfort	10	8	8	4
Ergonomics	10	9	8	6
Cargo Space*	5	3	5	3
Towing Capacity*	5	4	5	5
Features/Amenities*	10	10	10	10
Fit and Finish	10	8	8	4
Interior Styling	10	8	7	5
Exterior Styling	10	7	6	4
Rebates/Extras*	5	0	0	1
As-tested Price*	20	18	18	20
Subtotal	95	75	75	62
Powertrain
1/4-mile Acceleration*	20	20	18	11
Flexibility*	5	4	2	2
Fuel Economy*	10	9	9	10
Engine NVH	10	8	8	5
Transmission	10	8	8	1
Subtotal	55	49	45	29
Chassis
Performance*	20	20	19	18
Steering Feel	10	7	9	4
Brake Feel	10	8	8	5
Handling	10	8	7	5
Ride	10	8	6	5
Subtotal	60	51	49	37
Experience
Fun to Drive	25	13	11	7
Grand Total	235	188	180	135

https://www.caranddriver.com/review...-benz-sprinter-ram-promaster-comparison-test/

That test was with diesel engines, but C&D tested also EcoBoost van, with 6 speed AT:

"Dubbed EcoBoost in Ford parlance, the forced-induction engine pulled the 5423-pound cargo van to 60 mph in just 6.8 seconds, and the big brown box jumped past the quarter-mile pole after 15.3 seconds at 90 mph. Of more importance to cargo-van consumers, though, is the engine’s 400 lb-ft of torque that comes on at 2500 rpm and works with the standard six-speed automatic transmission to blast the Transit 350 from 30 to 50 mph and from 50 to 70 mph in just 3.8 and 4.8 seconds. Coming to a halt from 70 mph took only 171 feet. Impressively, the Transit 350’s acceleration and braking figures compare favorably with those of the last Kia Optima SX 2.0T we tested."

I know, it is not a race car, but driving underpowered vehicle is not fun. Plus dealers network, cost of maintenance and servicing tip the scale into the Transit direction.

Mine is scheduled to go into production October 5th and, hopefully, it will be delivered before the year ends.

 

[autostaretx]

... but none of the three currently makes one available in the US with my short wheelbase ...
(and 16 foot 6 inch (including step bumper) body length)

--dick

 

[Graphite Dave]

... but none of the three currently makes one available in the US with my short wheelbase ...
(and 16 foot 6 inch (including step bumper) body length)

--dick

Transit does have a 130" WB. Transit length is 219.9" Sprinter 118 WB is 197" long so short WB Transit is 23" longer.

 

[ENMeyer]

The Mercedes has amazing brakes. I love those brakes. Brakes tend to be tricky for car makers, Sprinter brakes are better than any cars I have owned.

I must have something wrong with my van's brakes, or maybe I'm spoiled with real brakes on my other cars (german sports sedans), because I think the Sprinter brakes leave a lot to be desired.

 

[Polonus]

On the test in Car and Driver both Transit and Sprinter received 8 out of 10 in "brake feel" category, RAM got only 5. From my short test drives in both vans I didn't feel any difference between those two and I had no complains. I had M3 and now I have 328i, both have excellent brakes, but I also drive on regular basis 51 Cadillac, 88 Fiat 126, 72 Cougar, 99 Mercedes S320 and an 18-wheeler, and neither one of them has better brakes then Transit or Sprinter.

 

[ENMeyer]

I might bleed my sprinter brakes. Fairly soft pedal feel and not as confidence inspiring as any BMW that we've owned (M3s, X3, 5-series, etc. etc. etc.)

 

[Kajtek1]

In my years of driving I did have RV who were like "push the brake pedal as far as you can and see what will happen"
Than I had older Mercedes sedan, who had BAS (Brake assist program) and when it took me 5 years to "test it" I was really glad it worked.
Sprinter is heavy and tall van, so you can't expect the tire will give you the same braking traction you will get on any sedan, but coming from Ford Superduty it is crispy feeling.
Talking about chart above, I am always very skeptic about statistics and reviews without additional information.
The chart above give 9 for fuel economy for both - Sprinter and Ford
My Sprinter makes 22-25 mpg, so what is Ford getting to get the same score?
In another words, do I sense BS ?