replacing entire rusted floor.

[Alphacarina]

I’m hesitant to use plywood because resale value is still in the back of my head. I can’t imagine telling a potential buyer the floor is made of wood. Also de lamination, unibody structure and my own pride lead me towords metal.

I’m thinking 16 gauge. And as for corrogated versus flat. Flat just seems simpler. But when I go look at the metal I think that could help me decide

Then I need to decided between spot welding and pop rivers.

Flat, untempered 16 gauge sheet metal will be nothing like the original floor - You could drop a heavy object on it and knock a hole in it. If I was looking to buy it, I'd say a 3/4 plywood floor would lower it's resale value less than what you're thinking of doing, just my opinion

When you use wood, you cover it with 2 part epoxy before you install it. Top, bottom, all the edges - It will never delaminate. They build boats this way. No question in my mind a 3/4 plywood floor would give you a stronger structure than any piece of flat metal, riveted or spot welded together. You can use a few bolts and aircraft nuts in strategic locations in addition to gluing it down with epoxy

But . . . . whatever you do, resale value is going to take a big hit - Any van so rusted out that it required a complete new floor is never going to be looked at as a wise purchase, by anybody

So - Patch it together in the way most suitable to you because it's your van, you're the one doing all the work and you need to have some pride in it so you can feel good about driving it for the next several years - Nothing else is really important, is it?

Don

 

[220629]

...

But . . . . whatever you do, resale value is going to take a big hit - Any van so rusted out that it required a complete new floor is never going to be looked at as a wise purchase, by anybody
...

I agree, except that a T1N is 14 years old at best... or maybe almost 20 years old. (Was model year ever mentioned in the thread?) The rusted out floor means that the value is not great no matter what repair method is selected. It is no longer a cream puff.

... So - Patch it together in the way most suitable to you because it's your van, you're the one doing all the work and you need to have some pride in it so you can feel good about driving it for the next several years - Nothing else is really important, is it?

Don

That is a very appropriate practical comment FWIW.

vic

 

[VAMANOS]

Flat, untempered 16 gauge sheet metal will be nothing like the original floor - You could drop a heavy object on it and knock a hole in it. If I was looking to buy it, I'd say a 3/4 plywood floor would lower it's resale value less than what you're thinking of doing, just my opinion

When you use wood, you cover it with 2 part epoxy before you install it. Top, bottom, all the edges - It will never delaminate. They build boats this way. No question in my mind a 3/4 plywood floor would give you a stronger structure than any piece of flat metal, riveted or spot welded together. You can use a few bolts and aircraft nuts in strategic locations in addition to gluing it down with epoxy

But . . . . whatever you do, resale value is going to take a big hit - Any van so rusted out that it required a complete new floor is never going to be looked at as a wise purchase, by anybody

So - Patch it together in the way most suitable to you because it's your van, you're the one doing all the work and you need to have some pride in it so you can feel good about driving it for the next several years - Nothing else is really important, is it?

Don

Excellent points.

It's worth considering skipping the whole "add metal" thing. A lot of that seems to come from a desire to feel like its similar to original, but I really should only be worried about structural integrity. and you're right, I just want to feel good about what I'm driving. Couldn't stand the feeling of a rusty floor, felt not good.

I've already cut out one of the sections for the floor. and bought some weldable primer and por15 rattle can topcoat.

I'll start considering the plywood idea but the motion is already set for sheet metal, then plywood on top of that

 

[VAMANOS]

I think I'm going to do this since I have access to the tank right now. How to install an auxiliary fuel line in your Sprinter | DIY campervan diesel heater install

is there any reason this is a bad idea?

 

[220629]

Excellent points.

It's worth considering skipping the whole "add metal" thing.
...

Does it need to be an all or nothing approach?

My basic idea is to tie things together. That may not happen with plywood alone. I suppose it could be argued that deck screws driven though the plywood into all of the stringers would accomplish that.

To give the stringers some help with stiffness, some light duty sheet metal angle pieces could be installed prior to fitting the plywood. My vision would be a a number of longitudinal angle pieces notched to fit over the "frame" pieces and then plug welded or pop riveted to attach. Easy enough to do and will be quite a bit stronger than just using plywood alone. That avoids needing to tie the plywood to all of the stringers.

Just thinking out loud.

vic

 

[billintomahawk]

Back in the day I got into Melges C scows and the one I had was old school cedar with oak ribs. It was messed up and leaking so out came the epoxy to stitch the cedar planking in the hull back together. Wepatched a pretty big hole with sheetmatal and roofing tar(and a lot of sheet metal screws).

I had to bend and replace oak ribs so I boiled them in a pipe with closed ends in a gigantic oven where I worked. They became noodles.
Wood and epoxy...you can do amazing things and treated plywood is almost forever.

Didn't know a damned thing about sailing or sailboats, we raised the mainsail and went, you could get yourself killed in that Melges.

It's a low boom.

I learned to sail really fast. Next to a catamaran a Melges is one of the fastest sailboats in the world.
Since we were hippies we sailed it naked with a mixed crew, you can't imagine the fun we had.

A scow with dagger boards.

bill

 

[JonnyBoats]

My 2 cents worth

People are correct that plywood sealed with epoxy can be virtually weatherproof. The rub comes the first time you put a screw into it or otherwise destroy the integrity of the epoxy seal. With a hole through the epoxy into the core of the plywood, water may enter and the plywood will rot from the inside out.

Many fiberglass sailboats used to be made with plywood in the deck for rigidity and strength. It is extremely common to find older bats made this way with spongey, rotten decks. This is why better boats are no longer made this way.

https://www.sailmagazine.com/diy/deck-repair-plywood-epoxy-resin

 

[Alphacarina]

Raka.com is a great source of epoxy for wood projects - I've probably bought 10 or 15 gallons of the stuff from them over the past 15 or 20 years. Great product, good prices - I have no affiliation other than being a satisfied customer

A 6 quart kit would be plenty to soak the top, bottom and all the edges of all the plywood it would take to cover a Sprinter floor

Raka, Inc. 772-489-4070

The hardener comes in various 'speeds' so you can order slow for hot climates, regular for most and fast if you're needing to get a cure in cold temperatures. I usually prefer using the slow when dealing with wood because it gives extra time to soak into the wood before it all sets up. It will be rock hard the next morning, whichever speed you choose. Mix small batches at a 2 to 1 ratio using a kitchen scale . . . . large batches generate their own heat and will set up on you before you want. Use disposable paint brushes . . . . buy a box of 25 or 50 of 1 1/2 or 2" brushes and throw them away after each batch use. Acetone will clean up any tools you get epoxy on, *if* you clean them before it sets up. If you need to make an epoxy paste to glue your wood to the floor stringers, they sell various thickeners. Collodial Silica works well as a thickener - Mix it up to the consistency of peanut butter, put a thin bead on the stringer and carefully lay the plywood on top. An 8 ounce container of silica will make a LOT of paste, because it weighs literally nothing

Fumed Silica

Raka, Epoxy, Resin, Fiberglass, Kevlar, Marine Epoxy, Boat Building, Marine Fiberglass, Boat Building Tools

store.raka.com

When the plywood is butted up against the metal sides of the van, seal the metal to the wood using fiberglass tape - a few yards of 3" tape would work well . . . . an inch and a half on the floor and an inch and a half up the wall. Paint a coat of epoxy where the tape will go, stick the tape into the wet epoxy and then cover the top of the tape with more wet epoxy. It will not only make the floor and the walls into a 'unibody' but it will also make everything waterproof - This epoxy sticks to everything. When finished, paint it whatever color works for you and it will probably look better than an old van with an OEM floor, and for sure it will be LOTS stronger than an old van with a rusty floor

Raka, Inc. 772-489-4070

It will take some work, but not nearly as much as building a wooden boat from scratch and I've done three different small boats - 8 to 10 feet.

Happy gluing!

Don

 

[Alphacarina]

If you want to make a waterproof connection with plywood using bolts or screws, drill the bolt holes where you need them, then put some masking tape on the bottom covering the hole. Fill the hole with liquid epoxy and it will wick it's way into the wood. When it sets up, drill the hole again, same size, same place and your wood will be completely sealed around the bolt hole. Or . . . . skip all that, because you're not building a boat which would be exposed to water 24/7. True, as JonnyBoats said, if it gets wet enough, often enough it will eventually rot the wood around the bolt, but that will take many years and your van will probably be in a recycling yard long before then

Don

 

[GeorgeRa]

I would consider polyurethane foam glass fiber composite. 1/2" to 3/4" could do, using polyurethane adhesive for permanent bond. This material is used as a structural element in boat building. Not inexpensive. I have 1/4" floor over factory passenger van floor. http://www.spaceagesynthetics.com/

 

[Midwestdrifter]

With sufficient bond area, and a good peal strength flooring, you could use body urethane adhesive instead of welding. And even replace the metal with another material.

The issue is getting enough bond area around the suspension mounts and other high load areas.

 

[220629]

Since cost seems to not be a concern, graphite epoxy composite, carbon fiber, titanium metal... all trimmed with gold leaf to not tarnish will make a fine job.

This is a rusted out T1N Sprinter. It is not a spacecraft. It is not a boat. It is not a collector car.



vic

 

[trc.rhubarb]

Every time you guys talk about using plywood for the floor, I can't help but envision something like this:

 

[Nautamaran]

Yikes!
Okay... I need to quickly flush that image from my brain, so here’s the sort of thing I think of:

 

[JonnyBoats]

Perhaps a boat-Sprinter fusion?

 

[220629]

Whatever floats your boats.

The OP may be best off starting a new thread to let us know what repairs he actually used on his Sprinter.

vic

 

[monoloco]

You could create a grid by welding in sections of square or rectangular steel tubing, then fasten either a sheet metal or plywood floor to that.

 

[billintomahawk]

Yikes!
Okay... I need to quickly flush that image from my brain, so here’s the sort of thing I think of:
View attachment 145831

Sponsons, rarely do I see sponsons, beautiful sponsons.

Better than naked ladies.

bill

 

[VAMANOS]

Back in the day I got into Melges C scows and the one I had was old school cedar with oak ribs. It was messed up and leaking so out came the epoxy to stitch the cedar planking in the hull back together. Wepatched a pretty big hole with sheetmatal and roofing tar(and a lot of sheet metal screws).

I had to bend and replace oak ribs so I boiled them in a pipe with closed ends in a gigantic oven where I worked. They became noodles.
Wood and epoxy...you can do amazing things and treated plywood is almost forever.

Didn't know a damned thing about sailing or sailboats, we raised the mainsail and went, you could get yourself killed in that Melges.

It's a low boom.

I learned to sail really fast. Next to a catamaran a Melges is one of the fastest sailboats in the world.
Since we were hippies we sailed it naked with a mixed crew, you can't imagine the fun we had.

A scow with dagger boards.

bill

Bill. You’re awesome. Thanks for sharing your nude hippy adventure story

This is undeniably entertaining for me. Loving these memes. Images. And arguments over plywood and sealant.

In other news. Here’s my progress so far. Decided to go ahead with plan sheet metal. It’s going to be covered with plywood anyways, and I want to learn to weld! Hahaha

 

[billintomahawk]

Good on you Vamanos.
Looking fine.

Got another resurrection project in mind for the coming weeks.

I'm hoping that long haired Jesus shows up to help jack and shovel for a day or two.

I could use a miracle..

Frikkin vans(anybody got an engine).

bill