Sound deadening and floor insulation

ForestGrump

Grand FVanale
Good info on sound deadening & insulation- but since I am working on a new van without an existing floor, I assume the way to do it would be to glue furring strips to the metal floor in order to attach (new) plywood flooring, then install sound deadening & insulation in between?
 

ForestGrump

Grand FVanale
Probably no. The sound reading material should be directly applied to the metal.

placed between the furring strips it would be on the metal. But I doubt if I can glue the furring strips over the top of the sound deadening. How else can i insulate the floor besides using furring strips?
 

hein

Van Guru
Our Minicell kits are very popular for floor insulation. Minicell is pretty good for reducing noise and does not require furring. It can be used over sound deadening if desired. Some customers are using Thinsulate AU4002-5 under floors and best practice is to do some furring around the perimeter of the floor in that case.

Experience has shown that it is not necessary to apply additional sound deadening to floors when using Minicell or Thinsulate. The metal floor is not really an unsupported panel that is prone to resonance and normally has plenty of stuff on top of it (thereby constraining it) when the build is complete. An area rug or mat is great for comfort and to further reduce noise (if needed).

We just received our first shipment of 3M's new Engineered Damping Material which is roughly half the weight of other stick on mass loading materials. We believe Thinsulate SM600L on its own (in walls and roof) is sufficient for resonance control, noise absorption and thermal insulation but some folks want to take it further. Saving weight in a van is important and we believe this material serves that need very well.

All the best,
Hein
DIYvan

 
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RVBarry

2023 AWD 170 DIY CamperVan
placed between the furring strips it would be on the metal. But I doubt if I can glue the furring strips over the top of the sound deadening. How else can i insulate the floor besides using furring strips?
I don't think anything needs to be glued as long as the floor is properly bolted in.
 

ForestGrump

Grand FVanale
Our Minicell kits are very popular for floor insulation. Minicell is pretty good for reducing noise and does not require furring. It can be used over sound deadening if desired. Some customers are using Thinsulate AU4002-5 under floors and best practice is to do some furring around the perimeter of the floor in that case.

Experience has shown that it is not necessary to apply additional sound deadening to floors when using Minicell or Thinsulate. The metal floor is not really an unsupported panel that is prone to resonance and normally has plenty of stuff on top of it (thereby constraining it) when the build is complete. An area rug or mat is great for comfort and to further reduce noise (if needed).

We just received our first shipment of 3M's new Engineered Damping Material which is roughly half the weight of other stick on mass loading materials. We believe Thinsulate SM600L on its own (in walls and roof) is sufficient for resonance control, noise absorption and thermal insulation but some folks want to take it further. Saving weight in a van is important and we believe this material serves that need very well.

All the best,
Hein
DIYvan

thanks for info! Just followed your page links for the 8020 & realized I bought my 3M 600 wall & ceiling insulation on eBay from you (ebay name ‘thingsfromafar’) ! I’ll call tomorrow to get the flooring material & 8020 !!!
 

ForestGrump

Grand FVanale
I don't think anything needs to be glued as long as the floor is properly bolted in.
ok... trying to figure out the best way to do this. Saw a dyi build on YouTube where they glued wooden furring strips so they would not have to put screws into the metal floor. And in between the furring they put the insulation, then they screwed the subfloor to the wooden furring. Seemed reasonable to me, but maybe that’s not the best way to do it.
 

sms

Member
Appreciate the write up and Youtube videos.

We did the sound deadening and floor installation as described above about a month ago. Pretty easy (not technical) install. Hardest parts were probably getting the rear seat out of the van as well as the floor (just awkward). Found the D rings to be a bit more work than anticipated.

We split the install over two days and took our time. No divorce proceedings were initiated during the process. Probably took six hours total. We did not do anything to the front. Separately, when I did Scopema swivel seats last weekend, it looked like the fronts had some factory sound deadening already. And with the battery under the floor in the driver's side, it felt like anything up there was going to be more in the way than helpful, so I have decided against that for the time being.

The only suggestion that I would have that might be a bit different than the video is how to lay the sound deadening. I moved back to front. And started so that one full piece of sound deadening mat butted the drivers side wheel well. I think this reduced the number of cuts necessary. Plus it was easier to work some of the smaller leftovers around the wheel wells and seat brackets. Pretty minor as the material was very easy to work with and relatively forgiving. I missed the D rings that are toward the rear, middle and easily went back and pulled enough material out to clear the space.

No real issues otherwise. Raised the floor a bit so have bigger gaps on the sliding door, rear door, and around the edges. Bought some round found stock from Grainger and inserted as a non permanent solution (3/8" and 1/2" seemed to fit best, although 1/4" around the wheel wells). It is also a touch crowned since the D rings seem to tighten the edges with no corresponding force in the middle

Biggest issue was I decided to try to black out the silver trim pieces with bed liner, since virtually everything else in the van is black. That's not adhering to the trim as well as I would have thought and is chipping a bit as we drag coolers etc in and out of the van. I touched it up once, but might have to figure something else out.
 

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hilld

Well-known member
Appreciate the write up and Youtube videos.

We did the sound deadening and floor installation as described above about a month ago. Pretty easy (not technical) install. Hardest parts were probably getting the rear seat out of the van as well as the floor (just awkward). Found the D rings to be a bit more work than anticipated.

We split the install over two days and took our time. No divorce proceedings were initiated during the process. Probably took six hours total. We did not do anything to the front. Separately, when I did Scopema swivel seats last weekend, it looked like the fronts had some factory sound deadening already. And with the battery under the floor in the driver's side, it felt like anything up there was going to be more in the way than helpful, so I have decided against that for the time being.

The only suggestion that I would have that might be a bit different than the video is how to lay the sound deadening. I moved back to front. And started so that one full piece of sound deadening mat butted the drivers side wheel well. I think this reduced the number of cuts necessary. Plus it was easier to work some of the smaller leftovers around the wheel wells and seat brackets. Pretty minor as the material was very easy to work with and relatively forgiving. I missed the D rings that are toward the rear, middle and easily went back and pulled enough material out to clear the space.

No real issues otherwise. Raised the floor a bit so have bigger gaps on the sliding door, rear door, and around the edges. Bought some round found stock from Grainger and inserted as a non permanent solution (3/8" and 1/2" seemed to fit best, although 1/4" around the wheel wells). It is also a touch crowned since the D rings seem to tighten the edges with no corresponding force in the middle

Biggest issue was I decided to try to black out the silver trim pieces with bed liner, since virtually everything else in the van is black. That's not adhering to the trim as well as I would have thought and is chipping a bit as we drag coolers etc in and out of the van. I touched it up once, but might have to figure something else out.
What were the before and after sound differences just driving around?
 

sms

Member
What were the before and after sound differences just driving around?
There definitely a difference, but I don't want to oversell it. Sitting in the driver / passenger area, I think we're still getting a lot of road noise from the doors and front (another project). However, road noise is reduced (especially rear tire). The biggest difference is probably reduced resonance. A lot less tin canny noises on bumps and so forth. I also want to take a crack at the rear doors as well.
 

wquek

Work in progress
There definitely a difference, but I don't want to oversell it. Sitting in the driver / passenger area, I think we're still getting a lot of road noise from the doors and front (another project). However, road noise is reduced (especially rear tire). The biggest difference is probably reduced resonance. A lot less tin canny noises on bumps and so forth. I also want to take a crack at the rear doors as well.
We installed Thinsulate and 95++% hushmat on our floor recently and I concur with this observation.
 

Smitty73

New member
Jumping in on this older thread as the previously mentioned plan is exactly what I was planning to do on my new 170 4x4 and I'd like any input. In my situation I need to raise my subfloor slightly (3/4") to allow for water lines between the galley and wet head (on opposite walls). So, as previously mentioned, I'm thinking about 1x2 furring strips using adhesive across the ribs (width-wise all on high spots), 3M Thinsulate sm400 in all the pockets, water lines over the Thinsulate, 1/2" birch flooring over the top with screws into the furring strips, no screw penetrations through the metal floor. Descent R-Value for a floor and only losing 3/4" in headroom. Thoughts? Any additional material between the furring strips and subfloor to eliminate noise or squeaking?
 

Kim_Marcus

Kim Possible 2004 2500 SR
Our Minicell kits are very popular for floor insulation. Minicell is pretty good for reducing noise and does not require furring. It can be used over sound deadening if desired. Some customers are using Thinsulate AU4002-5 under floors and best practice is to do some furring around the perimeter of the floor in that case.

Experience has shown that it is not necessary to apply additional sound deadening to floors when using Minicell or Thinsulate. The metal floor is not really an unsupported panel that is prone to resonance and normally has plenty of stuff on top of it (thereby constraining it) when the build is complete. An area rug or mat is great for comfort and to further reduce noise (if needed).

We just received our first shipment of 3M's new Engineered Damping Material which is roughly half the weight of other stick on mass loading materials. We believe Thinsulate SM600L on its own (in walls and roof) is sufficient for resonance control, noise absorption and thermal insulation but some folks want to take it further. Saving weight in a van is important and we believe this material serves that need very well.

All the best,
Hein
DIYvan

Hein, I am starting my build. My van came partially built out. It has very little to no rust. It is a 2004 Sprinter...the flooring is the stick down puzzle coin floor look. EVA foam or similar. I need to decide if I am taking it up and putting in new floor or simply cleaning this floor or possibly adding vinyl over this floor. I removed the 2nd row of seats and need to address the area where they are attached. What would you suggest?
 

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glasseye

Well-known member
I gotta jump in here and preach my horse stall mats sermon. What‘s the absolute best sound blocker? Sheet lead.

Mass-loaded vinyl hung in sheets between stud walls is popular with architectural installs for the same reason. MLV simulates sheet lead.

Your three best friends in sound blocking are mass, mass and mass.

Horse stall mats are cheap, easy to install, durable and very effective. Esthetics are their only point of contention. For me, it’s not an issue. YMMV.
 

nbw

2020 3500HD, 170Ex 4x4
I gotta jump in here and preach my horse stall mats sermon. What‘s the absolute best sound blocker? Sheet lead.

Mass-loaded vinyl hung in sheets between stud walls is popular with architectural installs for the same reason. MLV simulates sheet lead.

Your three best friends in sound blocking are mass, mass and mass.

Horse stall mats are cheap, easy to install, durable and very effective. Esthetics are their only point of contention. For me, it’s not an issue. YMMV.
OHH I am so glad you said this!, I just said this to my wife and said "I will look at the forum to see if anyone else knows this" Haha! SCORE
 

glasseye

Well-known member
Does it smell bad?
I'm assuming you're talking to me about the horse stall mats? :hmmm:

If so: yes, they did smell horrible when I cut the wheel well cutouts with my jigsaw. Once the smoke cleared, they were fine. There was a tiny bit of rubber smell on my very first trip, but that was in Death Valley where it was 100F. Since then, nothing. Including several more trips to DVNP.

The only disadvantage I've noticed is that they expand and contract with temperature changes. My whole floor is just three pieces and I notice that the two joints open up about about 1/16th inch in cold weather. Not an issue for me, since I have a decorative (small, cheap) area rug. The rug is a lot warmer on bare feet than the bare rubber.

The smooth pebbled rubber surface is easy to sweep or vacuum and scrubs clean easily if you spill chili on it. :doh:

My initial build, including the horse stall mats install is documented here:

 

slamit

www.cacampervan.com
Use Dynamat and 2nd skin audio open cell foam product to work under a stock floor with very good results, better than the 3m. Then cover it with Infinity interwoven vinyl...superior result for a stock floor when you have to think about adding height with seat rails. The materials however are not cheap, but the result in the end is very good.
IMG_6063.jpgIMG_6067.jpgIMG_6030.jpg

IMG_6075.jpg
 

Kim_Marcus

Kim Possible 2004 2500 SR
Use Dynamat and 2nd skin audio open cell foam product to work under a stock floor with very good results, better than the 3m. Then cover it with Infinity interwoven vinyl...superior result for a stock floor when you have to think about adding height with seat rails. The materials however are not cheap, but the result in the end is very good.
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View attachment 175184
Is this flooring from a marine store? Does it have cushion, repel water, wear really well? If yes, how did you install it.
 

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