Metal fragment (arc) in 722.683 transmission pan. What's next?

green eggs

New member
Hello, I found a fragment of a metal ring in the transmission pan. I intend to have a photo attached. At the moment the transmission remains drained. I'm not sure what the next step should be: a) remove the transmission & have it rebuilt, b) remove & replace, c) tow the sprinter in with the transmission empty, d) fill the transmission w/cheap fluid and drive it in, e) other. Tips?

Background: I was changing the transmission fluid on a 314K mile 2008 Sprinter that I bought used from a transit authority fleet. We started to notice a rumble strip noise seemingly somewhere behind the cabin. As an example, at 80mph on cruise control, the rumble noise would begin about every 10 seconds and last for about 1.5 seconds. The RPMS would also rise around that 1.5 second rumble. It didn't just happen on cruise control. It did not happen when coasting. The time between noise was longer as our speed decreased and became hard to notice less than 60 mph or so. The same happened during manual speed control.
About me: I don't mind doing work and pushing through some reasonable technical challenges, but recognize that there's a line of diminishing returns and increasing risks for DIY. I've removed a transmission before to change a clutch on an SUV, so have some experience, but have never been a professional mechanic.

According to truckstar.com's info from the VIN, the transmission is described as:
Automatic 5-speed transmission
W 5 A 380
722.683
(2008 Dodge Sprinter II 2500, extended, tall)

Thanks for guidance
 

Attachments

Kajtek1

2015 long/tall limo RV 2.1l
Go to benzworld.org and contact member handle MAVA.
He is rebuilding those transmissions and doesn't shy sharing the experience.
 

Midwestdrifter

Engineer In Residence
Is that piece very thin (less than 1mm?). What is its approximate diameter? If its the output shaft shim, you may not need to tear down the trans, as its not going to cause catastrophic failure.

My first impression of the photo is that its one of the teflon sealing rings from the output shaft K3/b2/b3 section. But its just a guess from the low res photo.
 

green eggs

New member
Can you get a better resolution photo? Are you certain its metal? Is it magnetic? Looks more like a sealing ring to me.
Good questions. It's very rigid like metal. It is not magnetic based on a test with a Neodymium magnet in the attached photo. Side A is flat, but side B has some beveling on the inner and outer edge of the ring. Also in the photo is a brass house key for scale and color.

(Sorry if this is a repeat. I may have not pressed Submit earlier)
 

Attachments

Midwestdrifter

Engineer In Residence
Hmm I don't recognize it. The color indicates that it was heated to over 500F at some point. I will review the photos of my trans when I rebuilt it so see where it came from.

The size is about right for the thrust bearing between the input and output shafts, but the bevel doesn't match.
 

smiller

2008 View J (2007 NCV3 3500)
Personally I would wonder how it got that hot since it sure didn't happen sitting in the oil pan. Of course for all you know it's possible that it has been sitting in the pan for the last 200k miles. Does the transmission operate normally in all respects other than the rumble noise? (which may or may be be related to the transmission itself.)

Worst case, swapping for a rebuilt unit may not be a bad idea as with 314k miles you're probably getting near the service life of the unit anyway (if you have not already reached it ;)
 

green eggs

New member
Is that piece very thin (less than 1mm?). What is its approximate diameter? If its the output shaft shim, you may not need to tear down the trans, as its not going to cause catastrophic failure.

My first impression of the photo is that its one of the teflon sealing rings from the output shaft K3/b2/b3 section. But its just a guess from the low res photo.
It is very thin. The dimensions are roughly:
Thickness: between 0.2 and 0.3mm
Width: between 2.7 and 2.8mm
Inner diameter between 23 and 24 mm (based on overlaying on circles in Paint app)
Outer diameter ~(23.5+2*2.75) = 29mm +/-
 

green eggs

New member
Hmm I don't recognize it. The color indicates that it was heated to over 500F at some point. I will review the photos of my trans when I rebuilt it so see where it came from.

The size is about right for the thrust bearing between the input and output shafts, but the bevel doesn't match.
Thanks for that nice offer to review.
 

Midwestdrifter

Engineer In Residence
You need to check the output yoke. With the driveshaft unbolted. Try spinning the yoke in park. If it moves relative to the nut, the shims are gone. If I have a chance I will pull my parts trans out to have a look.
 

green eggs

New member
Personally I would wonder how it got that hot since it sure didn't happen sitting in the oil pan. Of course for all you know it's possible that it has been sitting in the pan for the last 200k miles. Does the transmission operate normally in all respects other than the rumble noise? (which may or may be be related to the transmission itself.)

Worst case, swapping for a rebuilt unit may not be a bad idea as with 314k miles you're probably getting near the service life of the unit anyway (if you have not already reached it ;)
Yes, the transmission seemed to operate normally in all respects. I'm not sure it's related, but 83 mph seemed to have become the top speed whether the road was flat or downhill, with the pedal to the floor. That top speed was not hard to reach, just seemingly impossible to exceed.

Right, I don't know how long that piece has been sitting there, or where the 2nd half is, or even if the transmission has been previously rebuilt.

I did not know there was a service life. I may need to consider that seriously. Thanks for your info.
 

green eggs

New member
You need to check the output yoke. With the driveshaft unbolted. Try spinning the yoke in park. If it moves relative to the nut, the shims are gone. If I have a chance I will pull my parts trans out to have a look.
Okay, that's interesting. I'll look for an opportunity to do that.
 

smiller

2008 View J (2007 NCV3 3500)
Yes, the transmission seemed to operate normally in all respects. I'm not sure it's related, but 83 mph seemed to have become the top speed whether the road was flat or downhill, with the pedal to the floor. That top speed was not hard to reach, just seemingly impossible to exceed.
That is a programmed speed limit frequently found in Sprinter commercial vans.
 

72chevy4x4

Active member
82/83 is the governed speed limit.

After dealing with the rumble strip noise for 2+ years/60k miles, I replaced the recommended parts and have has no issues for 5k miles.

Iirc the service included the OD solenoid and an electrical part (?). Drives like a charm now.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

green eggs

New member
82/83 is the governed speed limit.

After dealing with the rumble strip noise for 2+ years/60k miles, I replaced the recommended parts and have has no issues for 5k miles.

Iirc the service included the OD solenoid and an electrical part (?). Drives like a charm now.
Okay, so I think I'm reading that the governed speed is the expected behavior, so I can remove that as a concern. That seems to fit.
Based on your successful repair after 60K miles, I'm also interpreting that the rumble sound (if it's the same) is also not an urgent concern.
Thanks for the information. I hope I didn't read too much into it.

Now that my transmission is still drained, would you recommend I do the above-mentioned fix as a matter of principle that the project is still open, or is it still highly involved? I think I should do the electrical plug for that reason.
 
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