2 Kw. or 4Kw. Planar heater, I can't decide.

[Zundfolge]

you’ll be surprised how much heat a 2d putts out..

I have a 140" high roof so my application is different, and I have a webasto airtop 2000stc (the 2d equivalent), but when that thing is on high and I'm in somewhat cold temps (15°F or so) it makes the van almost too hot to sleep.

I could imagine it being nicely sized for a larger van that didn't spend a lot of time in sub-zero temps.

 

[sunride_tribe]

Hmm well now I'm not sure what to do. My wife has been on my ass since returning home to get this ordered because of all the supply chain madness. When I didn't see any responses here we talked it over and went ahead to order the 44D, just yesterday.

I would highly highly doubt we would ever be running that thing on high. Will that cause issues with the unit? It hasn't shipped yet, should I cancel my order and get the 2D?

 

[Andrew_T]

I have a D2 under driver seat. THinsulate + thermzite insulation, window covers, and altitude compensation on the D2. I regret not getting the larger D4 for the quieter operation at higher airflow vs the D2 running on high all night. Plus, we have run into really cold temps more frequently than one might think (-15 an colder).

Noise aside, it’s a better idea to run it on high than on low, unless you like to service it every 250-500 hours.
I find the D2 to put out a LOT of heat but it needs a little planning to get maximum efficiency out of it.
The conventional under the seat method unfortunately is not very good especially for long vans . Takes a lot to heat up the back where the bed is. Plus, it’s just one duct.

A way better approach is to mount it mid van on the fuel tank side if possible, get a ring connector from 2.5” to 3” and install 3” ducting . Have a Y connector direct the heat to 2 outlets one pointing to the front and one to the side or back.
Also take note where you install your temperature sensor or controller that has one built in. If it reads the temp next to where the air comes out of the heater...it’ll stop sooner than it has to.
I’ve been told all this by Cliff at AMC Cliffv’s marine in Seattle.
The guy knows his stuff...

 

[Wrinkledpants]

If you use the heater a lot year round, it’s good to service it annually. I stopped caring about low vs high operation, and have just started getting into the habit of running it on high overnight when I’m not in it. Usually one night when the van is back in it’s home parking spot after a trip is enough. This keeps the combustion chamber clean. The carbon buildup on the screen that causes smokey starts happens no matter how good your habits are. We’ve been doing this for 4 years now at Denver elevations and up. Combustion chamber is always clean and I do a complete service before each winter season, regardless of hours.

 

[sunride_tribe]

Noise aside, it’s a better idea to run it on high than on low, unless you like to service it every 250-500 hours.
I find the D2 to put out a LOT of heat but it needs a little planning to get maximum efficiency out of it.
The conventional under the seat method unfortunately is not very good especially for long vans . Takes a lot to heat up the back where the bed is. Plus, it’s just one duct.

A way better approach is to mount it mid van on the fuel tank side if possible, get a ring connector from 2.5” to 3” and install 3” ducting . Have a Y connector direct the heat to 2 outlets one pointing to the front and one to the side or back.
Also take note where you install your temperature sensor or controller that has one built in. If it reads the temp next to where the air comes out of the heater...it’ll stop sooner than it has to.
I’ve been told all this by Cliff at AMC Cliffv’s marine in Seattle.
The guy knows his stuff...

Yeah after crawling under the van and taking a look at all the junk mounted under there I figured installing it on the driver side may be easier for running the fuel line. My only hang up there is now I have to drill through the floor, subfloor and metal van for the bottom.

I do like the idea of a Y connector though!!

 

[Andrew_T]

Yeah after crawling under the van and taking a look at all the junk mounted under there I figured installing it on the driver side may be easier for running the fuel line. My only hang up there is now I have to drill through the floor, subfloor and metal van for the bottom.

I do like the idea of a Y connector though!!

That’s fine,
Drill a 4” or larger hole with a hole saw through the entire floor , then mount the heater on it’s rectangle metal mounting plate.
You’ll be able to attach the exhaust and intake from underneath . If the floor is too thick, cut a 2ft or so extension of exhaust and intake piping, mount it on the heater and drop it through the floor and attach the rest from underneath.
Seal the gap between the 4 inch hole you just made and the mounting plate with high temp RTV sealant from underneath.
Seal the gap between mounting metal plate and van floor with Sikaflex construction sealant from the top.
DONE.
That’s how I’ve done mine and it’s way easier with thicker or uneven floors.

 

[mkeys]

I've been really impressed at how well the little 12vdc bunk warmers work. We have the one from ElectroWarmth. Even on low that thing usually has me ready to turn it off after a few hours. I see the conversation in this thread includes some extreme cold climates and I can't speak to those. But I can't imagine that I will find myself in a location that our 2k Espar + that bunk warmer doesn't do the trick for us.

 

[sunride_tribe]

Hey everyone I'm back with another question. Finally starting this install, got the hole cut but started losing light so back at it tomorrow.

I'm just wondering how everyone ran the power cord to the fuel pump? Did you drill an additional hole through the floor, or??

There doesn't seem to be enough room to run it through the mounting plate without pinching the wires, but before I go drilling yet another hole in my van I wanted to see what the consensus was. This is going in the cargo area, I didn't have room under the seat, so no access ports for it.

 

[mkeys]

There is a wire pass between the two seats, under the floor mats. I ran mine through that passthrough, and then out the bottom of the drivers seat base, there is a rubber 'boot' with many other wires running through the floor of the van. You've probably seen the boot under the drivers seat while installing your heater. I mounted the fuel pump pretty near that boot as well.

 

[forlexinotme]

You already made your choice, but just to add to the thread for other's reference... I have a 170WB extended. I put in a Webasto Evo 40, equivalent to the 44D (ish). I have 1" foam under the floor, thinsulate walls and ceiling. At 20F the heater will raise the temperature inside the van to over 80F in about 30 minutes. It mostly runs on very low power. I have a smart controller with altitude compensation, but this is still not ideal for clean operation. As others have discussed, running it hot routinely will help keep it clean. I have not utilized it enough to know if this will be an issue. On a month long ski trip last year and so far this year I have had no issues and have not serviced the unit.

 

[sunride_tribe]

There is a wire pass between the two seats, under the floor mats. I ran mine through that passthrough, and then out the bottom of the drivers seat base, there is a rubber 'boot' with many other wires running through the floor of the van. You've probably seen the boot under the drivers seat while installing your heater. I mounted the fuel pump pretty near that boot as well.

Thanks. My install is about 2 feet rear of the drivers seat, but I do know the boot you speak of. I'll have to see if the wiring harness is long enough to reach around, because that would be the easiest for sure.

You already made your choice, but just to add to the thread for other's reference... I have a 170WB extended. I put in a Webasto Evo 40, equivalent to the 44D (ish). I have 1" foam under the floor, thinsulate walls and ceiling. At 20F the heater will raise the temperature inside the van to over 80F in about 30 minutes. It mostly runs on very low power. I have a smart controller with altitude compensation, but this is still not ideal for clean operation. As others have discussed, running it hot routinely will help keep it clean. I have not utilized it enough to know if this will be an issue. On a month long ski trip last year and so far this year I have had no issues and have not serviced the unit.

Honestly we went with the 44D because it was only a little bit more price-wise than the smaller unit. I'm sure it will be overkill for us, but I'd rather have more heat than not enough, especially considering our last few weeks on the road. Our floor is very minimally insulated, we do have Havelock wool in the walls, nooks and crannies and Rtech foam in the ceiling, because it was already there. We were pretty miserable in the evenings and mornings when it got down into the 20s. I suppose we can always run it on high every so often with the door open! Time will tell!

 

[Lama231245]

The 44D is overkill 95% of the time. The Problem is, this will result in running it on low mode most of the time. That will break the heater quite fast.

I would suggest using the 2D and if you need more output, get a second 2D. This way you also have some redundancy in these really low temperatures.

 

[elemental]

Honestly we went with the 44D because it was only a little bit more price-wise than the smaller unit. I'm sure it will be overkill for us, but I'd rather have more heat than not enough, especially considering our last few weeks on the road.

The oversized component approach works well in some situations, but not in others. Air conditioning and multi-speed diesel heaters are two examples of system components that should not be oversized. Oversized air conditioning short-cycles and doesn't dehumidify the air properly (dehumidification aids in the overall effectiveness of the system). Oversized diesel heaters coke up because they don't run high enough/long enough to self-clean.