Cheap Conversion

Diamondsea

New member
IMG_0193.jpgThere seems to be no end of folks looking on this forum for ideas for DIY camper conversions so here is my 2 cents worth. This works for me, but only some ideas may work for others as we all have different needs and expectations. My requirements were for 1 person in a short van that I could park in a normal parking space for a full size car. The most important requirement was that it all be low cost but meet my needs. Use is to be in cooler climates thus no air conditioning. I have limited physical abilities so workmanship is somewhat crude. Resale is important but not as a camper, but to a tradesman. The only body shell penetrations are the 2 roof MaxxAir reversable multi-speed fans, a power inlet, and the lines for the Espar heater installed under the passenger seat.

First Photo: Just behind the driver’s seat a 48 inch kitchen cabinet, SS sink and counter top all one piece (the most expensive thing in the whole rig) (from Home Depot), a 12 volt pump, two 5-gallon water tanks, two 5-gallon gray water tanks, and a 1-gallon 115 VAC, 450 watt water heater. This last item heats the water in about 20 minutes via my power inverter using only about 45 amps out of the house batteries but as it is only for 20 minutes it uses less than 20 amp hours! Enough hot water to shave or do a few dishes. I omit refrigeration as it typically is the biggest user of power. I use the marine grade well insulated cooler shown and in my cooler climate areas ice lasts a long time. When on the road the cooler wedges between the front seats. A Walmart “personal table” about two feet square that folds up like an ironing board is stored on edge just behind the seat.

There are 3 more photos on next postings.
 
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Diamondsea

New member
Here is the second picture.
IMG_0194.JPGI purchased two 30-inch wide 5-foot high 3-shelves per unit steel no-bolts-required shelving units on the internet. By being only 5-feet tall they go quite close to the curved side walls. They (and the sink/water unit) are secured by lashings and ratchet straps to the van’s wall L-track and floor D-rings. Big plastic bins not shown fit under the bed for clothes, extra food, etc. Rope lashings secure all when on the road. Because of the curved wall the bed side is a few inches out which makes it easy to make up and it gives space for arms and legs to hang over the edge!
 

Diamondsea

New member
Here is the third picture.
IMG_0196.JPGThe overhead is insulated with foil faced bubble wrap, fiberglass batts, and another layer of the foil bubble wrap. This system reflects heat from the sun out and helps reflect radiant heat back in when heating at night. The walls were insulated with mostly fiberglass batts but I used foil faced rigid foam in the big areas intended for side windows then reinstalled the gray liners. I did not do any doors. For the rear and sliding door windows I made foil faced bubble wrap faced wood panels held with velcro for insulation and privacy.

The wheel wells were insulated with Damplifier then covered with wood boxes. The boxes are high because they have running down the center a 2 x 4 on edge so substantial weight can be on them with the weight transferred to the ends. They were screwed to cleats screwed to the wood floor (not through the steel) before the tops were installed. As there is no fastening to the van sides I added the ratchet strap to kill some vibration due to the weight of the batteries. The batteries are sealed group 31 AGMs, 105 amp hours each. The AC and DC electrical system is the same as used on a 35-foot motor yacht. It includes an inverter and 3-stage charger as separate units. The yellow and black device at the lower left is an automatic battery combiner to charge the house batteries from the van’s system. I have AC and DC lights. For the AC distribution I used cheap on-sale home depot stuff. For the DC distribution I used a marine fuse distribution panel as it is far cheaper than using marine magnetic/hydraulic switch/breakers. The meter box voltmeter measures house battery voltage or when charging the van’s voltage. The ammeter measures charge current. When it tapers off to under 5 amps I know the batteries are about fully charged.
 

Diamondsea

New member
Here is the last.
I use a bucket toilet with WAG bags. See: thepett.com. I find this much better than dealing with liquid porta-potties. I like the elongated full size household seat. I carry a (not shown) waste basket next to the toilet. Power cords, adapter plugs, and a water hose are carried with room for other junk. The curtain is for privacy when the rigid window covers are not used. The rigid window covers (not shown) store vertically with the lawn chair.

The crosswise bulkhead in front of the toilet is held with two thumb screws on each side. It can be removed to allow carrying long items in the van. Sheet material can be loaded on edge and lashed to the metal shelf assemblies.

I do not have seat swivels but have reversed the passenger seat to face the back. I have an Eclipse shade for the windshield and curtains for the front windows.IMG_0195.JPG
 

d_bertko

Active member
Plenty of good ideas on a budget.

I have a Portapotti in my DIY and would have used the wagbag instead if I wasn't married. We already use a 5 gal bucket for our PowerShower. It's a battery-powered shower wand that along with shower curtains and a $4 HD mortar tub allows for an inside aisle shower. We mostly use ours off the back doors inside a homesewn "shower sock" tent that slips over poles that extend off the roof rack.

If it were me, I'd rebuild those wheelwell enclosures to hide the batteries and electricals. My four agms are inside the van but if I did it again I would install some or all of them on the underside to reclaim the space. The agms don't care about orientation and the lack of maintenance need means you really can bury them. I did not appreciate that enough when I designed them into a topside electrical box. I had an industrial electrician friend who helped me with the electricals and he wisely disabused me of any attempt to attach anything without vibration-resistance fittings or with any possible shock hazards.

We do like our propane locker a lot. It's a plumber supply item for a van and holds a 20, 30, or 40 lb portable tank. We keep a 20 lb bbq tank in it and use the rest of the metal cabinet for valuables lockup. It does require floor and side vents and is gasketed. We also use an Espar furnace so the bbq tanks lasts a long time for just outdoor cooking. It does the heavy btu lifting for our hot water or cooking.

We've used a magnetic induction cooktop in our stickhouse for 20 years. If you have enough power for a microwave you might consider a portable Sunpentown 1200w (or less---ten levels) mag burner. Very compact, ultrasafe and efficient. Ours attends a lot of brunches since it is so portable.

Isn't L-track great? I use many swivel rings everywhere but the threaded studs are irreplaceable for bombproof securement.

Pix of my interior:
http://danbertko.smugmug.com/gallery/3439165_jwwnp#P-4-15
 

ehallspqr

Member
Very nice conversion, and again lots of great budget ideas. Installations looks very neat and totally functional. By the sound of it you can strip everything out of there to carry cargo or if you where to sell the van. Do you have pics of your Espar heater install?
 

maxextz

Rollin Rollin Rollin.....
congratulations thats a very neat job:hmmm: also some great ideas thanks for the pics.:thumbup:

max........
 

Diamondsea

New member
To answer the question about the Espar install see the "Espar Installation" I just made on the general talk part of this forum.
 
Do you ever have problems with the batteries outgassing while they charge? Is it noticeable enough to bother you when you sleep?
 

Diamondsea

New member
The batteries are sealed AGMs (absorbed glass mat). As such they are not vented; there is no outgassing; the "caps" atop each cell are pressure valves. They open only in the event of extreme overcharging. I have used AGMs and Gel Cell batteries for decades on boats and have never had any outgassing.
 

Cpt B

New member
Here is the third picture.
View attachment 14438
The yellow and black device at the lower left is an automatic battery combiner to charge the house batteries from the van’s system.
I just bought a Blue Sea ACR for my aux battery install and I see you placed yours in the rear of the van close to the house batteries. What size cable did you run from the start battery back to the ACR? I assume you are charging the house battery bank with engine alt while driving. The other question I had for you is what size and type of fuse did you use from start battery to ACR and from house battery to ACR?

BTW I first learned the KISS principle by way of an old sailor from Alaska who actually named his boat that!
 

Diamondsea

New member
I put an 80 amp fuse on a spare location on the fuse block at the positive terminal of the van's battery under the drivers feet with a very heavy wire to a manual high amp switch under the seat below the parking brake so I can turn it off and on. I ran a #10 wire from the switch about a total of 16 feet to the Blue Sea ACR. This wire acts as a surge limiter as it causes a voltage drop to limit the initial high surge. I then have a 30 amp fuse and #10 wire a total of just about 3 feet to the house battery off-1-both-2 switch. Large wires go from the battery selector switch to the batteries and to the inverter and to the chassis ground. For ground I mounted a stud and bus bar near the batteries on the van's rear door frame. Thus there is essentially no resistance in the ground circuit.
 

Diamondsea

New member
The ACR itself must be grounded but a small wire can be used here. It does not carry any significant current; it is just to establish a reference for voltage sensing for the ACR's operation.
 

Cpt B

New member
I put an 80 amp fuse on a spare location on the fuse block at the positive terminal of the van's battery under the drivers feet with a very heavy wire to a manual high amp switch under the seat below the parking brake so I can turn it off and on. I ran a #10 wire from the switch about a total of 16 feet to the Blue Sea ACR. This wire acts as a surge limiter as it causes a voltage drop to limit the initial high surge. I then have a 30 amp fuse and #10 wire a total of just about 3 feet to the house battery off-1-both-2 switch. Large wires go from the battery selector switch to the batteries and to the inverter and to the chassis ground. For ground I mounted a stud and bus bar near the batteries on the van's rear door frame. Thus there is essentially no resistance in the ground circuit.
Thanks for the details of your wiring Diamondsea. One thing that's got me a bit confessed is the 16' run of #10 wire as a surge limiter. I don't believe I have read anyone else on this forum doing this and I would have to say that from reading just about every post on the subject most people say to use heavy Gage wire for charging loads. I'm not criticizing your method here just trying to figure it all out so I may avoid any possible mistakes.

From what I have gathered and depending on the length of your run it is recommended to use heavy #4 wire from engine battery to isolator and again from isolator to aux battery so you can get the aux battery charged quickly. I would think by using #10 wire you are going to slow down the rate your aux battery will be recharged.

I am planning on using the van's engine to do most of the work in my system but I may add a solar panel to help out when I am parked for longer periods. My 12v need will be very minimal with just a refer and small inverter for laptop.
I've got an older sprinter so I will have a short run from the engine battery to the ACR mounted under driver seat then from there to the aux battery under the passenger seat. This is the factory method and it uses 25m wire for these runs so I think #4 wire for me will be close enough.

I've got new Koni front shocks to install next on my list then I can get started on the aux battery. I like the use of 5 gal containers for sink water and waste, so I think that is the way I will go also. I'm going to keep everything KISS.
 

Diamondsea

New member
You are correct that conventional thinking is to use heavy wire for the charging, and it sounds as if that is the way you should go as your runs are short from van battery to ACR to auxiliary house battery. You will not need any surge limiter, and I assume that your house battery is smaller than 200 amp hours. I went the other way for a couple of reasons. First, as an experienced electrical engineer I could figure the resistance of a smaller wire and its voltage drop at various currents and the internal resistance of a battery being charged. Secondly, I wanted to avoid any initial surges that could possibly damage the high-tech regulator on my 2009 NCV3 alternator system and possible warranty issues if I had problems. Third I wanted to run a small wire under some metal trim pieces and not pinch it to cause a short circuit. Lastly, big wire is expensive! I do not use any solar as most of my camping is in the northern US and eastern Canada where sun angles are low, and I most often park under trees when camping.
 

220629

Well-known member
Diamondsea,
That looks like a very practical, usable and good looking design for a low cost. Add my +1 with d_bertko that the L-track is a good item to incorporate into van design. Good thinking to lash stuff in rather than permanent fasteners. d_bertko does that well too. I read a post somewhere that suggested they were going to use L-track on the roof. That sounded interesting to me.

FWIW our local Harbor Freight store had L-track eyes on clearance for like $2.50 each. I was ready to buy a bunch, but the peg was empty. Thanks for your pictures and explanations. AP/vic
 
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Diamondsea

New member
A comment re my lashings. Where I used ratchet straps that came with the van and similar I had no problems as those are made with a very low stretch material. Lashings I did with line I used low stretch products and I am familiar with those through experience with different line materials from sailing. Even though, I had to tighten up lashings at 500, 1000, and 2000 miles as the lashings stretched some and things would start to vibrate or squeak, or move. After 2000 miles all stretch seemed to be taken up. When doing lashings I used trucker's hitches and other line tying "tricks" to get mechanical advantage as I tightened and tied.
 

68protour

07 D 144 high rebadged MB
Re: Cheap Conversion - Electrical questions (not so cheap in fact)

I put an 80 amp fuse on a spare location on the fuse block at the positive terminal of the van's battery under the drivers feet with a very heavy wire to a manual high amp switch under the seat below the parking brake so I can turn it off and on. I ran a #10 wire from the switch about a total of 16 feet to the Blue Sea ACR. This wire acts as a surge limiter as it causes a voltage drop to limit the initial high surge. I then have a 30 amp fuse and #10 wire a total of just about 3 feet to the house battery off-1-both-2 switch. Large wires go from the battery selector switch to the batteries and to the inverter and to the chassis ground. For ground I mounted a stud and bus bar near the batteries on the van's rear door frame. Thus there is essentially no resistance in the ground circuit.
Hello DiamondSea,

I appreciate all the detail you provided in this thread. Your comments prompted a few questions concerning planning out our system, as the setup and physical location are similar to your setup.

Planning 2-27 or 31 group AGM deep cycle (~100 AH capacity each), most likely from West Marine for convenience if any warranty issues.

We have the factory 180 AH alternator, plan to install a 300Amp dual sensing VSR by BEP Marine. http://www.bepmarine.com/300Amp-Voltage-Sensitive-Relay-(VSR)-166-1470.html It has a manual override switch that will "electrically" separate batteries as well as a switch to manually parallel them, so that might eliminate the need for the battery switch you installed.

The inverter we ordered Freedom SW 2000 has all kinds of "protection" features - copied and pasted below from product literature. http://www.xantrex.com/web/id/302/p/1/pt/7/product.asp

A couple of questions we are still trying to resolve concerning protecting the equipment -

- Will the factory voltage regulator do what we need?
- Do the protection features on the Freedom inverter (see list below) address the issues that you addressed concerning protecting your alternator/regulator from surges? (It is not clear to me based on my limited learning what surge you are concerned with?)
- Also looking at additional protective equipment for the shorepower setup, such as a power management system from Progressive Industries (EMS-HW30c Surge Protector with Voltage Protection to be hardwired in - http://www.progressiveindustries.net/ems_hw30c.htm), and trying to determine if that is redundant. Seems as though its only function is to monitor the shore power and protect the rest of the system from problems with the shore power, but would do nothing for any other problems in the system, but I don't know.

Any help would be appreciated.

The Freedom SW 2000 provides the following protection features:
• ambient over temperature shutdown,
• high and low battery voltage protection,
• battery temperature sensor (BTS) failure/battery temperature out-ofrange
fault protection,
• bad battery fault protection6,
• DC output over voltage protection during charge mode,
• AC transfer relay failure protection,
• AC output overload and short circuit protection during invert mode,
• AC backfeed 7protection,
• locked8 or disconnected fan protection,
• short circuit protection for the BTS and communication connector
ports including protection from incorrectly inserting the remote panel
communication cable plug into the BTS port and vice versa, and
• battery reverse polarity protection.
 

68protour

07 D 144 high rebadged MB
I put an 80 amp fuse on a spare location on the fuse block at the positive terminal of the van's battery under the drivers feet with a very heavy wire to a manual high amp switch under the seat below the parking brake so I can turn it off and on. I ran a #10 wire from the switch about a total of 16 feet to the Blue Sea ACR. This wire acts as a surge limiter as it causes a voltage drop to limit the initial high surge. I then have a 30 amp fuse and #10 wire a total of just about 3 feet to the house battery off-1-both-2 switch. Large wires go from the battery selector switch to the batteries and to the inverter and to the chassis ground. For ground I mounted a stud and bus bar near the batteries on the van's rear door frame. Thus there is essentially no resistance in the ground circuit.
Hello DiamondSea,

Looking at your fuse sizings and trying to size our system - what size alternator do you have? Size battery bank? Size inverter?

I asked in another lengthy post, but did you do anything different with the factory regulator/alternator?

Thanks!
 

Oldfartt

Active member
Hi 68Protour,

The smaller cable that diamondsea has used is merited in his installation because he has a manual switch in the circuit and the inrush current to a completely flattened house battery needs to be managed. This is done so that the alternator peak current cannot be exceeded by using a wire whose resistance limits the maximum current flow. Careful maths is required. :thumbup:

In your proposed installation, the use of a voltage controlled relay allows the engine battery to be charged first and then to charge the house battery, by which time the output current from the alternator is shared with the house battery and the voltage difference between the two batteries and the alternator will determine (along with the resistance of any wiring) the maximum current flowing to the house battery.
By my experience, this current is never likely to be anywhere near the peak output of the alternator.

So... In your installation you can safely use the largest cable practical to keep the resistance as low as possible. Remember, no part of your installation should have more than 0.36volts drop from power source to any appliance.

Hope this makes sense.

Cheers

Ross
 

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