Complete Rotor Failure - New Rotors, Pads, Seized Slider, and CEL 3130-8 & 2951-8

Pneumo

Member
Hello Again!

Yesterday after spending a few days in the Aspen CO area and crossing some gnarly mountain passes, I came to an abrupt stop at a stop light. As I came to a stop, I heard and felt something mettalic snap. I tentatively pulled away from the light and heard a nasty metal on metal grinding sound. I pulled over and took a look. I found that my passenger side front rotor had seperated around the circumfrence of the radiused collar. I was able to pull over and the homeowner nearest allowed me to work and stay in their driveway. A good samaritan came along and offered to help. He ended up calling a an auto parts store and driving to pick up some new fromt rotors for me. When he got back, we struggled to get the remaining portion of the rotor off, managing only to do so by beating it with a hammer. Similarly, the intact front rotor was significantly more difficult to remove. An hour of bashing later, we were able to remove the now destroyed rotor. Both had excessive amounts of rust on the mating surfaces between the rotors and the hubs. New rotors were installed as were the old pads for the time being.

This morning I drove to the auto parts store who happened to have rear rotors and pads for both the front and rear. I installed the new rotors and pads in the parking lot, finding that the bottom parking brake shoe on both sides missing, and began to add the new pads up front. Unfortunately I found one of the sliders to be completely seized with rust, preventing me from installing the new pads. The boot had failed and allowed the ingress of water and salt. Liberal amounts of penetrant, taps with a hammer, and attempts to move the pin with clamps failed. I reinstalled the old pads with the new rotor and ordered a new caliper and new parking brake shoes and plan to install those tomorrow. Unless anyone has any advice regarding the slider, my life would be much better if I didn't have to swap the whole caliper to rectify the issue.

I have yet to search the forum in depth for information regarding caliper replacement because the situation happened so quickly, but I plan to do so tonight. I am more than a little concerned about being unable to remove and reinstall the new caliper without destroying the brake line fittings. I've started treating the fitting on the caliper with penetrant, hopefully that will help.

Just my luck, a CEL appeared as soon as I started the van after working through these issues. Autel is giving me the following codes "3130-8 MIL ON&Stored" "2951-8 Stored&Current" "2641-8 Stored" "2510-1 Stored" "2089-1 Stored"

I had the 2951 code within the past 2k miles and cleaned the EGR Valve and temp sensor, which resolved the issue. I'm honestly unsure what course of action to take for these codes. Can anybe clarify what the "MIL ON" status signifies? Or is the "current" code the only active one?

Any advice for the caliper swap or codes would be greatly appreciated! If I missed anything major, just ask, its hard to keep my thoughts straight while typing this out on my phone.

Thanks in advance!
-Pneumo
 

sailquik

Well-known member
Re: Complete Rotor Failure - New Rotors, Pads, Seized Slider, and CEL 3130-8 & 2951-8

Where did the rotor that broke come from?
Does it have the original Mercedes Benz part number?
Was the rotor measured the last time the front brakes were repaired to determine if the rotor
was past the mandatory replacement thickness?
Roger
 

Pneumo

Member
Re: Complete Rotor Failure - New Rotors, Pads, Seized Slider, and CEL 3130-8 & 2951-8



As for markings, the van was from Minneapolis and saw more than its fair share of salted roads. Every surface with exception of the braking face is heavily corroded so no maekings are visible.
 
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Zoomyn

Member
Re: Complete Rotor Failure - New Rotors, Pads, Seized Slider, and CEL 3130-8 & 2951-8

That looks like a vehicle that's been parked over dirt a couple or four winters... 130,000 miles is about right, time wise. It's not the ice-melt per say but its the twice-daily dew cycles attracting unlimited fresh moisture from the water vapor pressure boiling out of the ground (think morning // evening fog mists hanging above the ground just not visible) that keeps metal-salts actively consuming raw metals, I had a rotor on my F150 separate in the same fashion and I blame myself buying cheap NAPA rotors many years before and not making it a 4 or 6 month inspection item - it's not the rotor thickness etc. but a too-thin casting of the shoulder that failed. The photo you shared sure looks like a $20 rotor, not OEM or Bendix.

Have a leisurely lay-down and inspect undercarriage & exhaust against other future corrosion events. Also look for rodent chewed wiring. I'd swap out caliper-everything - AND the flex lines running to them but be gentle with fittings. Sorry not to be more help, just sharing things Minnesota with y'all.
 

Pneumo

Member
Re: Complete Rotor Failure - New Rotors, Pads, Seized Slider, and CEL 3130-8 & 2951-8

That looks like a vehicle that's been parked over dirt a couple or four winters... 130,000 miles is about right, time wise. It's not the ice-melt per say but its the twice-daily dew cycles attracting unlimited fresh moisture from the water vapor pressure boiling out of the ground (think morning // evening fog mists hanging above the ground just not visible) that keeps metal-salts actively consuming raw metals, I had a rotor on my F150 separate in the same fashion and I blame myself buying cheap NAPA rotors many years before and not making it a 4 or 6 month inspection item - it's not the rotor thickness etc. but a too-thin casting of the shoulder that failed. The photo you shared sure looks like a $20 rotor, not OEM or Bendix.

Have a leisurely lay-down and inspect undercarriage & exhaust against other future corrosion events. Also look for rodent chewed wiring. I'd swap out caliper-everything - AND the flex lines running to them but be gentle with fittings. Sorry not to be more help, just sharing things Minnesota with y'all.
Much appreciated Zoomyn!

I have put 10k on the van since purchasing it at 129k. The only wiring issue I've experienced was a brake wear sensor lead being rubbed through along the rear axle, I spliced the wires and the issue was resolved. As you guessed, the exhaust had rusted through on the back end of the flex pipe, I had this fixed as well.

By swap out caliper-everything, you mean just the problem caliper I hope? The flex hoses look good all around, there is no cracking and they all appear to be decently pliable. Unfortunately I'm in a situation where I needed to use parts store brand parts instead of OEM.... Hopefully this isn't the worst thing I could have done....

My concern at the moment is being able to source appropriate brake fluid. I hate to mix manufacturers, but I'm not confident what was used in the vehicle prior to me purchasing it. There are no dodge or mercedes dealerships within ~70 miles and I don't have an address to mail parts to. If I can find a local source for DOT 4+, will I be okay using that? I realize the "+" designation is not an actual spec denotion.

Additionally, the two rear steel lines do have an amount of surface rust, I think I should consider replacing those as well, but I wouldn't know where to begin on that.
 

Pneumo

Member
Re: Complete Rotor Failure - New Rotors, Pads, Seized Slider, and CEL 3130-8 & 2951-8

OK let me be a bit more specific.

Quite often problems occur by the inexperienced AND experienced where air finds it way due to a component like a master cylinder being changed. In many cases air tends to be trapped in the ABS control unit (commonly call a brick) ! Even after correct bleeding procedures, trapped air pockets can often only be purged out by artificially cycling the ABS unit by using a scanner as it might operate under a skid or traction control situation. Failure to do this procedure will often leave the brake system with excessive travel on the first application and requiring a "pedal pump" to get a good pedal.

Another situation with ABS braking systems is the tendency for repair people and DIY'rs alike to force compress the caliper pistons back into the caliper cylinder when overhauling brakes. The caliper is subjected to heat from braking which is a source of heat degradation and carbonizing up of the fluid which dwells in the caliper. Equally being the lowest point on the system moisture which forms naturally in the system (brake fluid is hygroscopic) tends to flow down into the caliper pistons where it will boil under harsh braking, form corrosion patches and degrade, hence the reason to flush this all out periodically. Vehicles which are left for extended periods tend to suffer from brake fluid moisture dilution more than those used everyday.
It explains why Mil vehicles which tend to be stored for excessive periods use silicon brake fluid.
By the way don't be tempted to mix this fluid in your brake system; it is not compatible with ordinary brake fluid and it does not accept instant brake compressibility which is the reason why its isn't used in civilian vehicle brake systems for the most part.

When servicing foundation brakes and where caliper piston compression is required the individual caliper should be isolated from the system usually by using a clamp on the brake hose, opening the bleed screw and compressing the caliper piston. This will expel the fluid and any contaminants dwelling inside the caliper hydraulic cavity. Failure to do this and you risk forcing the contaminants up into the ABS brick during piston compressive displacement where the often end up under the control valves in the ABS unit (brick) which might be the culprit of excessive pedal travel, and further ABS faults.

If you suck out the fluid with a suitable tool from the reservoir the only fluid left in the system will be that held in the master cylinder and down to the caliper. By sucking out the reservoir you will draw out any contaminants and by refilling with fresh fluid you will be ready to purge the rest out by a conventional bleed operation by pumping the pedal progressively.
Obviously you MUST ensure the system doesn't run dry or you might end up with air trapped in the system.
Hope that helps you understanding whats going on.
Dennis
I found this as well as some other useful information on another thread.

I fear I did exactly as Dennis outlined, being inexperienced, I compressed the calipers without pinching the lines and opening the bleeders. Inevitably, I likely forced fouled fluid into the brick. The best I can do is bleed to the best to the best of my ability, try to engage the abs a few times, bleed again, and repeat. HOPEFULLY that will be enough to correct my mistakes....

Could anyone tell me the bleed order for the brake system? Logically I'd assume rear passenger, rear driver, front passenger, and finallaly front driver. But I won't work off of those assumptions.

Aa for the codes, any insight would be awesome. I recall being told that there were two sensors in the EGR system that are assesible, I cleaned the front most one near the EGR valve last time. Could anyone point me to where the other one is? I've had no luck finding it myself. Is it on the cooelr perhaps?

Again, thanks everyone.
 

Pneumo

Member
Re: Complete Rotor Failure - New Rotors, Pads, Seized Slider, and CEL 3130-8 & 2951-8

All four rotors, all pads, and one caliper have been replaced. Brake fluid was discolored, but did not have any suspended particles. I was able to find some pentosin super dot 4 fluid for the flush and had great luck with the bleed process.

Now with that sorted, I have two questions remaining. It appears as though the previous CEL codes I had related to the EGR have reemerged. I pulled the forward most temp sensor and cleaned it, which in conjunction with cleaning the EGR valve resolved my issue last time. This time however it hasn’t solved the problem.

Can anyone direct me on what info to look for specifically on my Aurelia? I admit that I don’t really know what I’m doing with it. I can find the fault codes after navigating through the Sprinter specific scan feature. But knowing what is truly causing my problem is a mystery to me.
 

Bobnoxious

Deplorable and adorable.
Re: Complete Rotor Failure - New Rotors, Pads, Seized Slider, and CEL 3130-8 & 2951-8

Considering the extent of corrosion might be prudent to inspect all metal brake lines.
 

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