T1N 647 Engine Water Coolant Pump Replacement

tonydobbs

Member
Thanks to everyone who has contributed to this post, my belt and pump replacement almost went entirely without a hitch thanks to these thorough write-ups.

I just wanted to add a couple of tips I found through error in this process.

1. Look at this video to have a tour of everything you will encounter if you have a 647 engine.

https://youtu.be/1Fqlm9_sw-o

The sound track isn't fantastic but overall I give it a solid B

2. If you touch a hose I would recommend replacing it unless you know it has been replaced. I replaced all hoses but one and the only one I didn't replace had a pinhole in it due to a lame clamp design/hose being bloated and worn out. Had to wait for a new hose to come in from Europarts to be able to go on long drives....

3. The torx on the water-pump pulley are loctited I believe. I strip the head of only one out before blasting the others with a torch. After the torch they all came out easily.

4. Replace the thermostat...mine was pitted on the gasket flange and definitely would have begun to leak soon. Taking the oil filter out and covering with tin foil to pull away the fuel lines makes this simple.

That is it folks, thanks for all the help.
You wouldn't happen to have the part numbers for all the hoses would you? I wanted to do the same, but I'm having some difficulty finding the part numbers for a few of the hoses.
 

220629

Well-known member
You wouldn't happen to have the part numbers for all the hoses would you? I wanted to do the same, but I'm having some difficulty finding the part numbers for a few of the hoses.
For N. American owners Europarts SD should have everything needed.

http://europarts-sd.com/

The part names/description may help others in the world source parts which are more local to them.

Oops. I believe Mr. Dobbs has a 4 banger so Europarts won't help much. Be aware of T1N OM612, OM647, and for the ROW the 4 cylinder engines.

vic

Added:
Now I notice NorCal. That's not across the pond!! That's the place in the USA that all the loose nuts and bolts roll toward. (So says a relative who's a California native.)
 
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tonydobbs

Member
For N. American owners Europarts SD should have everything needed.

http://europarts-sd.com/

The part names/description may help others in the world source parts which are more local to them.

Oops. I believe Mr. Dobbs has a 4 banger so Europarts won't help much. Be aware of T1N OM612, OM647, and for the ROW the 4 cylinder engines.

vic
I had actually added just about every hose Europarts has to my cart, but I feel as if I'm missing a couple. I'll try and match the hoses up later today to validate this.

Oh and I have the OM647 engine :)
 

ko4nrbs

Member
TH,

I talked the other day with Steve from Europarts and he said that he dropped Meyle water pumps and Ina tensioners because of failures. I also replaced 2 Meyles and they leaked after 15k miles or so. Good to hear that they dropped them. I didn't get what brand he replaced them with, but hopefully they are better quality.
They still list Meyle pumps on their web site.
Bill
 
This is a great thread but I'm still looking for guidance on an issue like this I'm having. I recently replaced my fan clutch on my 2004 3500 with 180k miles on it but I'm having disturbing noise /grinding coming from the fan clutch again after driving just a few hundred miles. I opted to buy the fan clutch and have a local shop install it but sourced the part myself. Now my fairly recently replaced serp belt (at 150k) now has a groove on it since it left the shop. I suspect maybe water pump issues but asking on this thread to learn more if anyone can help please. Don't really think bringing it back to the shop will yield good results
Initially my cooling fan had actually come off and was dangling loose and rattling around, barely spinning, but the fan blades are not damaged. I'd hoped the fan clutch replacement would keep me trucking but now this thing sounds horrible again. It actually sounded a little bit grindy leaving the shop but I assumed they would probably wash their hands of it.
The part was
US Motor Works 22328 Heavy Duty Thermal Fan Clutch (2003-2006 Dodge Sprinter Bolt on Design) from Amazon.

What I'm wondering is, what are next steps? I've chatted with other mechanics and I guess this is possibly water pump damage? Try one more fan clutch from a more reputable dealer?

Thanks in advance for all you do, and to you Aqua Puttana for the great writeup here. If push comes to shove I'll attempt this myself, but I know my level of proficiency and I may look for further help with this from a pro, especially if it's a water pump rebuild? Posting here before I have to go bugging Andy directly. Thanks!! - Ben
 

220629

Well-known member
... Now my fairly recently replaced serp belt (at 150k) now has a groove on it since it left the shop. ...
Initially my cooling fan had actually come off and was dangling loose and rattling around, barely spinning, but the fan blades are not damaged. I'd hoped the fan clutch replacement would keep me trucking but now this thing sounds horrible again. It actually sounded a little bit grindy leaving the shop but I assumed they would probably wash their hands of it.
...
Was the fan thoroughly inspected?
Was the tensioner replaced, or at least the condition verified?
Is the belt routed correctly?
With the engine off. Does the fan wobble or seem loose when moved in different directions by hand?

USE CAUTION AROUND SPINNING PARTS.
While the belt is spinning is it running nice and straight or wobbling?
Does the fan look like it is wobbly?

...The part was
US Motor Works 22328 Heavy Duty Thermal Fan Clutch (2003-2006 Dodge Sprinter Bolt on Design) from Amazon.
...
:idunno:
2 ea. different Sprinter parts offered, no reviews positive or negative.
https://smile.amazon.com/Motor-Works-22328-2003-2006-Sprinter/dp/B004A7TINO

I find that Europarts SD has good reviews and quality parts. That said, I don't only shop one place either.

...What I'm wondering is, what are next steps? I've chatted with other mechanics and I guess this is possibly water pump damage? Try one more fan clutch from a more reputable dealer?
... - Ben
Don't try to out guess the experienced pros. If you find a good shop let them diagnose and repair it. It seems that you've already been burned once.

:2cents: vic
 

04Sprinter

New member
I found on my 04 sprinter that the fan needs to be replaced when you replace the fan clutch and water pump etc. If one part is out of balance it throws everything off. I had replaced water pump and fan clutch, only to have the water pump go out prematurely. Also replaced all the pulleys the second time around. From researching online replacing; water pump, fan clutch and fan seems to have some validity.
 

Ciprian

Spark Plugs not allowed!
Stop replacing parts just for the heck of it. Find out what is broken (probably the water pump in this case) and replace that. Why would you replace the fan? A fan does not magically becomes off balance, unless a chunk of it is missing. My 2004 with 790k miles still has the original fan and clutch. I replaced the pump twice though.
 

O6sprinter

New member
Thinks Vic, great job with that write-up.

My 06 with 161k just learned a new trick, Coolant leak I'm hoping it's the water pump. With all the information in this thread I think that's something that I can handle in the driveway. Before I pull the trigger on the parts maybe someone can help verify that it is the water pump and not a head gasket.

Roughly 25k miles ago I noticed a very small amount of oil in the Reservoir. I bought a coolant tester with a white hose, when I pulled the tester out of the reservoir I noticed a small amount of oil on the White tube\ hose. Of course I totally freaked out. I had a long conversation with Captain Morgan as I researched the Forum. I came across the thread where Dennis was talking about using the dishwashing detergent capsules to clean out the cooling system. After I ran the van through the dishwasher I haven't noticed any more oil in the cooling system. The van has been running fine for the last 25k. 200 miles ago the coolant level light came on. I added approximately 30 oz of water, it was raining too hard to really look into it. When I got it home Thursday night I could see coolant dripping off the oil pan. Topped it off Friday morning before my ride to work, approximately 50 miles I couldn't see any coolant leaking after that. And drove it home and couldn't find any leaks. I couldn't tell where it was leaking from. Can a water pump leak intermittently? Joel ( million-mile Sprinter ) informed me it could also be the thermostat cover. My intent is to buy the kits he sells and replace everything when I'm in there. I just want to verify it's not the head gasket before I pull the trigger. I did the rubber glove test, when I brought the RPM up to around 2k I could see the rubber glove was actually sucking in / vacuum. ( slightly )not blowing up like I saw in the videos. Also there's no evidence of coolant in the oil.

I pulled the carfax report on this when I purchased it over a year ago. It was a fleet vehicle up until me. It was purchased and maintained by the Dodge dealership in Naples Florida. There was nothing showing its had the water pump replaced. I'm degreasing the bottom of the engine hoping to get a better look.

What do you guys think 160k maybe just the water pump that let go?
 
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O6sprinter

New member
Of course when you want it leak it won't, i took it for a drive trying to get look. Had to bring the rpm up to 3k for a while to get it leaking. I took some pics, i can't see ware its leeking from. Its dripping off the bottom of the oil pan right next to the alternator. Maybe somebody that's dealt with leaky water pumps would know if this is common or not.

I just got a new phone, can't post pics I'll try later.
 

tomd4s

Member
My 06 water pump only lasted about 120,000 miles. It started as a small drip, then progressed to leaving a puddle of coolant running down a customers driveway. I replaced with a NAPA.
 
Just noticed this write up. Great job! fortunately I didn't need this info when my pump shredded. Turns out when I had my AC worked on at the dodge dealer in south Atlanta (certified sprinter tech) somehow mysteriously one of the nuts fell into an open cooling hose and somehow made its way to the waterpump. Fortunately it shelled as soon as I started it in the write up area and guess who had to buy me a new pump? That dealership screwed up every single repair they did on my T1N. Note to self!
 

parkgt

2007 Great West Van on 2006 2500 T1N
Getting prepared for this job on my 06 RV with only 59K. Bought used two years ago with no maintenance history.

Wondered why my coolant tank was low last month with the light on. Topped off and didn't worry about it too much. Last night noticed a small puddle. Inspection shows antifreeze on front of block running down to the alternator; so assuming WP time is here.

Thinking of doing the whole 9 yards WP, pulleys, thermostat, belt ,fan and clutch and associated hoses. Anything else critical while in that deep?

Who to buy from MMSprinter (kits) or Europarts - thoughts?

Last questions; Torque values, after reading comment about stripping bolts, should I buy a 3/8" torque wrench or go buy feel?
And where to get the various torque values?

Thanks and thanks to all that have contributed to this thread!
 

220629

Well-known member
... should I buy a 3/8" torque wrench or go buy feel?
...
Do you feel lucky??

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Xjr2hnOHiM

How good is your feel?

I use a torque wrench on fasteners like head bolts and where there is a specific procedure such as TTY stretch fasteners. Other than that the torque wrenches usually stay in storage.

There can be fastener disasters related to incorrect/misinterpreted torque values, tool calibration issues, etc. so using a torque wrench is of itself no guarantee.

It is important to keep in mind that threads in aluminum are less tolerant of over torque stresses than are threads in steel. Many of the steel fasteners holding the parts that you plan to replace are threaded into aluminum, and expensive aluminum assemblies at that.

Good luck.

:cheers: vic
 

parkgt

2007 Great West Van on 2006 2500 T1N
It is important to keep in mind that threads in aluminum are less tolerant of over torque stresses than are threads in steel. Many of the steel fasteners holding the parts that you plan to replace are threaded into aluminum, and expensive aluminum assemblies at that.

Good luck.

:cheers: vic
Where does one get the torque specs for the different fasteners?
 

parkgt

2007 Great West Van on 2006 2500 T1N
Well I made the mistake of ordering from millionmilesprinter. Ordered the water pump kit and the hose kit and at first things seemed ok. Received tracking on order complete. Opened two boxes to find no packing slip and no water pump or lower radiator.

Three emails later received an email telling me two shipment had been sent and my parts would arrive in the second. Joel obviously didn't read the emails where I stated I had gotten two boxes, missing the parts. Had asked for a call - no call.

Then an email "Ah yes. I see that we were out of stock on those two items but they were shipped out already. UPS tracking says they will arrive Friday"
Still no call -no sorry for the confusion.

Over the weekend I got an email with excuses for the issue, again no call, no sorry.

Opened the box this morning after tearing everything down to find that there is still no lower radiator hose, of course no packing slips. More emails all day with no reply and no call.

I ordered the hose from another source and will not rely on or be burned by Joel at millionmilesprinter again!

Will be sitting here with a van down for another week due to incompetence and poor communication.

Timely communication of issues would have gone a long way!
 

parkgt

2007 Great West Van on 2006 2500 T1N
The job went pretty well all things considered. I did not swing the radiator. I removed headlights, grill, support bar, fan and shroud and had enough room to work without issue. Actually replacing some of the nine hoses was worse than the pump. Did the pump with the manifold attached. Nice not to worry for awhile about hoses, fan, idlers, belt and pump!

One thing I did that I hadn't seen mentioned is that I put a layer of gorilla tape over the top, sharp edge of the radiator. After scraping my forearms up for a bit the light went on and the tape made a big difference during the rest of the work.

Still waiting on the missing hose that I ordered from a different supplier to come in. I also could not get to one of the bolts on the thermostat with the tools I had. So I yet need to get a long handled T27 key wrench.

As always this forum is indispensable for the DIY guys. Feels good to know that it was done right (I hope) while saving some money.

Thanks to all that contributed, wouldn't have done it without the info available here.
 
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