T1N Harmonic Balancer Failure

skill3

2006 Dodge T1N 2500 118"
I removed my HB today and some forum members wanted me to show photos of the balancer. This process started because I had an intermittent noise coming from the lower part of the front of the engine. The noise sounded like an additional diesel engine noise. Kind of like the engine noise went to stereo. I know that sounds stupid, but that is the best way I can explain it. I hope the photos help others before they experience a failure. This is off my 2006 118" 2500 SHC with 180,000 miles. The harmonic balancer is dated 2005.
 

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vanven

New member
I removed my HB today and some forum members wanted me to show photos of the balancer. This process started because I had an intermittent noise coming from the lower part of the front of the engine. The noise sounded like an additional diesel engine noise. Kind of like the engine noise went to stereo. I know that sounds stupid, but that is the best way I can explain it. I hope the photos help others before they experience a failure.
How many miles on your T1N? These photos are very helpful!
 

Aqua Puttana

Poly - Thread Finder
On a positive note, the spokes look great. No sign of fracture.

Thanks for taking the time to snap the pictures and post them. :thumbup: vic

Added:

Some other condensed information is here.

Harmonic Balancer Information
https://sprinter-source.com/forums/showthread.php?t=51858

Added: From another thread.

A possible method for getting the needed degree turns on the HB bolt.

...
Pulling the seal with the fan in the way requires a low profile tool: I used a Lisle 58430, and you won’t have room for a cheater pipe from underneath, so have something planned to brace against to get the last 1/4 turn of bolt.
Maybe the factory tire jack, or even a floor jack under the ratchet or breaker bar handle? At that point the specification is degrees, not torque.

vic
 
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jackbombay

Well-known member
Hmmm, I have had an extra noise from the front end lately, while under moderate throttle, when the van is not fully warmed up, it sounds like a bit of an exhaust leak, but does somewhat go away (but not completely) when the van is fully warmed up. I will be looking at the HB when the rain stops...
 

glasseye

Well-known member
Skill3, do you have rear AC?
 

smcguyer

Active member
I am wondering if you should have the new harmonic balancer shot-peened before you install it.

Shot-peening compresses the outside skin of the metal, and can help reduce stress risers. Perhaps reducing the liklihood of a fracture. Shot peening used to be a common treatment for racing connecting rods, etc.... components subjected to high stress loads "running" on the surface of metal. Many performance machine shops can do it.

It begs the question: Are MB or Dorman harmonic balancers already shot-peened from the factory?
 

ohlsonmh

Grumpy Member
Hmmm, I have had an extra noise from the front end lately, while under moderate throttle, when the van is not fully warmed up, it sounds like a bit of an exhaust leak, but does somewhat go away (but not completely) when the van is fully warmed up. I will be looking at the HB when the rain stops...
Hmmm... My 2004 Sprinter [66,000 miles] has "always" sounded rougher for the first several miles of a run.

Is this ANOTHER big problem coming up?

No way this 75 year old is going to replace this thing :frown::idunno:

-Oly
 

glasseye

Well-known member
I've never seen a harmonic balancer for real. Is that a layer of some kind of elastic material that's failed? Looks like rubber in the pix. (which are excellent, btw)

I asked about rear AC because it seems like the HB failure is common to those installations. I don't have rear AC and assumed that Frito would be immune to this disease. Wrong assumption, I guess. :idunno:
 

bad_assr

New member
I'm not an expert but I'm not sure shot peening the steel would help since it's the rubber that is seperating.

I just replaced my HB also, I've seen several pix from owners removing the radiator to replace it which is not necessary. The HB is easily removed without disassembling anything. I purchased the Dodge seal installation tool #8936 (MB#611 589 00 14 00) which now supersedes to #8936A and the crankshaft lock #8932 (MB#601 589 02 40 00). The tools are much cheaper from a Mercedes dealer. I modified the seal installation tool so it could be used to press the seal in using the original bolt and washer from the HB. I think the original tool was designed that way but the superseded # is a "driver" so I just cut the end off enabling the original bolt and washer to be used to install the seal. I recommend purchasing the crankshaft lock as it makes it a very simple job. I didn't use the flywheel puller #8940 (MB#613 589 00 33 00) but it would have been handy if my HB wouldn't have come off as easy as it did. Also it is necessary to replace the crankshaft bolt that holds the HB in, part #05073696AA since it is a torque to yield bolt and the seal, part #05073675AB.

The service manual says to remove the key from the keyway and reinstall it in the keyway with gease to hold it in place but mine was held in place by the timing gear on the crankshaft. The most difficult part is the 90 degrees after you torque the bolt to 240 ft lbs. I use a square and marked the 90 degrees on the HB pully using the leading edge of my ratchet as a reference point then tightened the bolt the remaining 90deg.

I forgot to mention mine is a 2006 with 171,000 miles without rear air.

I hope this helps cut down on the time replacing the HB, also feel free to correct me if I have mispoken.
 
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skill3

2006 Dodge T1N 2500 118"
I just finished the HB install yesterday. I just removed the fan with clutch and the serpentine belt. The HB bolt was really hard to break loose, but I had a younger, stronger helper do that. Even though I had the correct HB puller, the HB slid right off. The seal popped out easily. I installed the new seal, I wish I had the proper installation tool, but it went flat and flush. The fun part comes when you torque the HB center bolt. That's 240 FOOT/POUNDS plus 90 degrees. Luckily I had access to a 3/4" torque wrench that was 36" long and the stronger helper. I did have the proper flywheel locking tool which is a must. For anyone that needs the HB puller and flywheel lock tool, I'm trying to figure out a loan system for forum members. Let me know what you think. Send me a PM.
 

Sgt Ret

2005 ,2500 SHC
Is the new HB made different heavier duty or the same as the old one?
 

skill3

2006 Dodge T1N 2500 118"
Is the new HB made different heavier duty or the same as the old one?
It looks exactly the same except for the date of manufacture which was 05/13. I hope they have improved on the quality. I did order it from Berry Dodge, so it should be OEM Mopar. All of the stampings on the 2013 HB looked just like the stampings on the 2005 HB that failed.
 

Sgt Ret

2005 ,2500 SHC
Let me know what you decide on the loan program. My HB does not look bad now but it is getting old so I will keep an eye on it.(2005-2500) Did you have any special tools to get the fan off? Were you able to find a DAD scanner I think we were both looking for one a while back. I ended up buying the OBD-II Scan Tool from Auto Enginuity it seems to work ok I have had no real problems yet so we will see. Thanks for the pictures they were a great help.:thumbup:
 

bad_assr

New member
It isn't necessary to remove the fan unless you are concerned about breaking it maybe but I found there's plenty of clearance with the fan on. How many miles do you have?
 

Aqua Puttana

Poly - Thread Finder
Let me know what you decide on the loan program. My HB does not look bad now but it is getting old so I will keep an eye on it.(2005-2500) ...
Same situation for me.

Skill3,

Nice of you to consider taking the effort to offer a loan program. :thumbup::thumbup:

Not that you asked...

Make certain to get a deposit before shipping which will allow you to replace the tools with no cost to you. I'd like to think that people are basically honest, but sh*t happens. vic
 
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skill3

2006 Dodge T1N 2500 118"
Let me know what you decide on the loan program. My HB does not look bad now but it is getting old so I will keep an eye on it.(2005-2500) Did you have any special tools to get the fan off? Were you able to find a DAD scanner I think we were both looking for one a while back. I ended up buying the OBD-II Scan Tool from Auto Enginuity it seems to work ok I have had no real problems yet so we will see. Thanks for the pictures they were a great help.:thumbup:
I bought the special tools to remove the fan that the forum member makes and sells. They work great. The other thing I did was to make the fan shroud a two piece unit. Once this is done, access to the fan is much easier. I did a write-up on this in T1N Write-Ups. I did get a DAD unit from another forum member. I'm still trying to figure it out. I'll let you know when I figure out the "loan program".
 

skill3

2006 Dodge T1N 2500 118"
It isn't necessary to remove the fan unless you are concerned about breaking it maybe but I found there's plenty of clearance with the fan on. How many miles do you have?
I removed the fan so I could take advantage off the 3 foot long 3/4" torque wrench. I needed the working room from the top. Using a torque wrench that long from the bottom was very awkward and limited.
 

marquimarl

Member
I'm not an expert but I'm not sure shot peening the steel would help since it's the rubber that is seperating.


The service manual says to remove the key from the keyway and reinstall it in the keyway with gease to hold it in place but mine was held in place by the timing gear on the crankshaft. The most difficult part is the 90 degrees after you torque the bolt to 240 ft lbs. I use a square and marked the 90 degrees on the HB pully using the leading edge of my ratchet as a reference point then tightened the bolt the remaining 90deg.

I forgot to mention mine is a 2006 with 171,000 miles without rear air.

.
Could you please tell how you removed the Key from the timing gear without removing the timing chain cover?
My 2004 TIN has dual air and it looks like the HB was replaced once before I bought it.
Now after me driving it for less than 4 years I am replacing it again. What can we do to make sure it doesn't fall off again?
 

bad_assr

New member
My Key did not come out, that was the point I was trying to make, the manual says to "align parallel key, fix in place with grease. Turn to ensure the slot is aligned with the parallel key in crankshaft". My key never came out due to the fact that it was still in place with the timing gear.

Did you use an OEM HB or after market. Everone that has posted on here states the Dorman or any other aftermarket are a waste of money and have a high failure rate. I'm sold on OEM parts. If it the original lasted 170,000 why try anything other than OEM. You know they will fit exactly as designed.
 

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