Properly Seat Your Oil Filter

Aqua Puttana

Poly - Thread Finder
Changing the oil and filter on a T1N 2.7L 5 cylinder diesel engine is relatively straight-forward, but proper oil filter seating on the drain sealing stem is critical. It has been reported that an improperly seated oil filter element can lead to a lack of oil supply to the engine. I am reminded of proper filter element seating every time I change my oil. I think that I have set the filter on all the way, then I push a bit more and sure enough there is a snap as it seats further down. On my filters it takes a bit of pressure to properly seat.

Changing the oil is fairly simple. You need a 13mm hex socket or hex wrench for the pan plug. An oil filter cap wrench (74.5 mm size). A large oil catch container (at least 12 quart... even bigger for NCV3, but this is the T1N section). Some cardboard if you're sloppy like I can be. An oil filter and 9 quarts of MB approved engine oil (it calls for 9.5, but don't overfill it because there is a high oil level warning which will trigger if you put too much in). I start the oil draining underneath and then immediately go up and remove the oil filter cap assembly until it sits loosely on the housing. I'm told that helps to drain more oil out. One gotcha is that the oil really shoots out of the drain plug so have the catch container wall positioned so it is far enough away that it doesn't overshoot. (The catch pan should probably not be centered to the drain.)

Righty tighty, lefty loosey works to remove and re-install the black plastic oil filter cap. For those who need a torque value "The closing torque of 25 n-m is in raised lettering on the cap." per TH43. (19 foot pounds = 25.8 N-m)

A more formal description without the colloquialism.

The cover is a right-hand thread, so clockwise tightens it, anti-clockwise loosens it.

--dick
Here's some pictures of what I find works to assure the filter is pressed all the way onto the drain sealing stem. Sorry for the poor picture quality. I didn't look at the pictures until the oil change was complete. I wasn't going to change my filter again to get better pictures. :rolleyes:

I use two hands to squeeze the filter down into position. I needed one for the camera, so you need to use your imagination.

SeatUsingBothHands.jpg


Look for the ridge to be in this position.

FilterRidgePosition.jpg


The large O-ring goes in the top groove. (At least that's where mine has always been.) Verify that the O-ring is uniformly seated in the groove. Always lube the O-ring with a bit of engine oil or Vaseline before installation.

FilterLargeOring.jpg

Edit:

My 2006 oil filter cap has only one groove which the O-ring fits. It appears the design is changed since 2004.

2006FilterCapSm1.jpg


Another thing to double check is that the cap is fully seated. Even if you use a torque wrench visually verify that it is seated. There should be no gap between the aluminum housing and the filter cap.

OilFilterCapSeated.jpg

It seems like basic stuff, but there have been comments that if the oil filter is not properly seated it can reduce oil flow and have serious consequences with the engine not getting enough oil pressure. FWIW. vic

Some oil filter brands discussion is here.

Oil Filter Comparison Hengst (german), STP & Mobile 1 brands
Info Thread :thumbup:
https://sprinter-source.com/forums/showthread.php?t=22896


******************
The Hengst E11H D57 oil filters don't "snap".

Today I used my first Hengst filter. The Hengst filter slips right on with no "snap". In fact, the lower end of the Hengst filter is quite loose and sloppy. It appears that the felt like washer is used to hold the Hengst filter into place once the oil filter cap/spike is fully seated.

...

To be clear, I see no real problem with the the Hengst filter. The main reason I mention all this is for Hengst users to know that they will not have as much problem with the Hengst filter seating home. There is no distinct "snap" needed. (Maybe that is an advantage?)

View attachment 81521

Some pictures of the various oil filters can be found in this thread.
https://sprinter-source.com/forums/showthread.php?t=22896
******************

CAUTION

If the filter drain sealing stem breaks off do not install the filter without addressing the problem. Having no drain sealing stem may lead to low oil pressure and engine damage.


...

In my unit, that tip [drain sealing stem with O-ring] was broken off and apparently discarded, and then the oil filter reinstalled. Without that tip and O-ring, there is catastrophically low oil pressure. But why? What the heck is going on down there?

McMalakai
I have not found any data.

After pondering the system design a bit I believe that I have the answer.

The bottom oil seal is a simple drain plug. The German engineers didn't want anyone to need to wait for oil to drain out of the oil canister when changing the filter.

When the drain sealing stem is removed it opens a passage down to the sump to allow the filter canister to drain freely.

Without that drain sealing stem/plug in place some (too much) of your oil pressure was returning to the sump rather than going out to where it is needed.

Assuming that my theory is correct (I believe that it is) you would think that Mother Mercedes would publish some cautions about the need for that filter drain sealing stem to be intact. A small bleed orifice might be a better solution. :idunno:

:2cents: vic

Added:
I posted from the original question. Afterward I came upon Dick's post. We were both thinking along the same line. I'm convinced the lower O-ring just plugs a drain. IT DOES!!

Added 2:
A somewhat related thread.

https://sprinter-source.com/forums/showthread.php?p=160116
 
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pfflyer

Well-known member
Clean hands for just changing the oil. Any tips on that. I use disposable gloves but still manage to get the hands, arms and cloths dirty.
 

Aqua Puttana

Poly - Thread Finder
Clean hands for just changing the oil. Any tips on that. I use disposable gloves but still manage to get the hands, arms and cloths dirty.
Dealership.


:lol:

:cheers: vic
 

Aqua Puttana

Poly - Thread Finder
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bc339

New member
As an added bonus, the large O ring can be cleaned and repurposed as Sprinter bracelets.

Sell them at the Sprinterfests to help offset the price of the oil change.

Bruce
 

hayduke

2005/2006 leisure travel
How do you get the old O rings off ?
I settled for reusing the old ones
 

Aqua Puttana

Poly - Thread Finder
How do you get the old O rings off ?
I settled for reusing the old ones
I generally use my thumb and forefinger to push the O-ring sideways so it sort of bubbles out to allow me to grab it. I find that I can then remove the seals without damaging them.

Alternatively a small screwdriver or pick tool can be used. Using a tool can increase the chance of damaging the O-ring. Be careful around the plastic seal seat grooves when using any tools.

Here's a Harbor Freight option.

http://www.harborfreight.com/4-piece-pick-and-hook-set-66836.html

Not that anyone asked...

Personally I wouldn't be afraid to reuse the undisturbed O-rings one time. Continuing to use them after that may be pushing it though. :2cents:

vic
 
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autostaretx

Erratic Member
To avoid scratching the groove when picking out the old O-ring,
the simple trick is to use a tool made of softer plastic than the MB part.

For example, I frequently use the tip of a small-sized nylon cable tie.
It's flexible, so it's easy to slip under the O-ring, and then the cable tie is happy to curl up (following the groove's wall) and appear on the other side.
Then just grab the two ends of the cable tie and pull/walk the O-ring out... kind'a like walking the bead of a tire off (or on to) the rim.

The cable tie tip can be whittled to an even thinner (and more flexible) shape.

--dick
 

Paul_E_D

New member
I just did my first oil change. Thanks for the tips. I got a mobil filter, that it sat right down on the housing with no problem. It came with 5 orings! lol. I had a hard time getting the filter cap fully seated by hand, but I'm short and weight 128 lbs! My hand calibration told me it took a lot more than 25 Nm to get it fully seated.

I also annealed the copper drain bolt washer as it was quite grooved and bowed from use. after 6000 miles, the oil came out black as crude, but didn't seem too broken down, and there was a full 9.5 quarts remaining in there.

Checked my cabin air fiter while I was in there. FILTHY! I slapped and vacuumed it out, but I need a new one. re-installing it was a bitch.

Thanks again for the tips.
 

Aqua Puttana

Poly - Thread Finder
Previous to recently buying 8 ea. Hengst E11H D57 oil filters I had used OEM Dodge branded, Purolator #L25536, or Mann HU718/1K oil filters. The last three brand filters always appeared to be identical. They all needed to "snap" into place on the oil filter cap drain sealing stem.

Today I used my first Hengst filter. The Hengst filter slips right on with no "snap". In fact, the lower end of the Hengst filter is quite loose and sloppy. It appears that the felt like washer is used to hold the Hengst filter into place once the oil filter cap/drain sealing stem is fully seated.

I believe that Jon Talkinghorse43 commented that he didn't really like the Hengst felt washer design. I tend to agree with not liking that feature. The OEM, Mann, and Purolator seem to just fit better.

Will I not use the 8 Hengst filters which I bought? Nope. Plenty of people use Hengst filters on Sprinters with no problem so I will use what I have. Will I buy Hengst brand in the future? At this point probably not. I will look for the type which will give me a snap fit.

To be clear, I see no real problem with the the Hengst filter. The main reason I mention all this is for Hengst users to know that they will not have any problem with the Hengst filter seating home. There is no definite "snap" needed. (Maybe that is an advantage?)

Hengst Oil Filter.jpg

Some pictures of the various oil filters can be found in this thread.
https://sprinter-source.com/forums/showthread.php?t=22896

:cheers: vic

Added:

Zaxxon said:
P.S.: Had to look at that subject line twice before it clicked..."Mann or Hengst?", translated into English: "Man or Stud?" ROTFL!!!
http://www.benzworld.org/forums/w140-s-class/1508235-mann-hengst.html


http://translation.babylon-software.com/german/to-english/Mann./ (3rd Reich Dictionary??)

http://dictionary.reverso.net/german-english/Hengst
 
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Aqua Puttana

Poly - Thread Finder
A reminder.

CAUTION

If the filter drain sealing stem breaks off do not install the filter without addressing the problem. Having no drain sealing stem may will lead to low oil pressure and engine damage.

...

In my unit, that tip [drain sealing stem with O-ring] was broken off and apparently discarded, and then the oil filter reinstalled. Without that tip and O-ring, there is catastrophically low oil pressure. But why? What the heck is going on down there?

McMalakai
I have not found any data.

After pondering the system design a bit I believe that I have the answer.

The bottom oil seal is a simple drain plug. The German engineers didn't want anyone to need to wait for oil to drain out of the oil canister when changing the filter.

When the drain sealing stem is removed it opens a passage down to the sump to allow the filter canister to drain freely.

Without that drain sealing stem/plug in place some (too much) of your oil pressure was returning to the sump rather than going out to where it is needed.

Assuming that my theory is correct (I believe that it is) you would think that Mother Mercedes would publish some cautions about the need for that filter stem to be intact. A small bleed orifice might be a better solution. :idunno:

:2cents: vic

Added:
I posted from the original question. Afterward I came upon Dick's post. We were both thinking along the same line. I'm convinced the lower O-ring just plugs a drain.

Added 2:
A somewhat related thread.

https://sprinter-source.com/forums/showthread.php?p=160116
Added:
This OM611 oil diagram mostly verifies the lowest O-ring seals a drain.

OM611 Oil circuit diagram.jpg
 
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gpavlov

New member
Bit of a silly question, but since my preferred oil change location is not flat is there any harm, or benefit, to having the van at a slight tilt? If slant is ok/beneficial then nose up/down, listing to port/starboard? Looks to me that a slight tilt towards the driver's side could be ok or even a good thing...
 

Aqua Puttana

Poly - Thread Finder
Bit of a silly question, but since my preferred oil change location is not flat is there any harm, or benefit, to having the van at a slight tilt? If slant is ok/beneficial then nose up/down, listing to port/starboard? Looks to me that a slight tilt towards the driver's side could be ok or even a good thing...
It may have some effect, but my personal opinion is that the net result is in an area of diminishing returns.

Many people seem to view leftover used oil in a crankcase like it is toxic acid or completely detrimental to the next fluid being added. If a proper OCI schedule is being followed the drained oil is actually good serviceable product.

Think about it.

:2cents: vic

Added for clarity:
But this thread is not about oil quality. Take that discussion somewhere else.

If a proper OCI is used the oil is drained long before it no longer is within spec. A cup of old oil left here and there in the engine is not toxic. Assuming no evidence of sludge is found in the pan/sump, I feel that any methods employed to try and flush, wash, or otherwise fully remove the leftover oil (except extra drain time) has more potential for engine harm than does leaving a bit of leftover still serviceable and in spec used oil.

Just my opinion. Copy and paste to another thread if you wish to discuss/refute.
 
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CJPJ

2008 3500 170"ext. 3.0 V6 OM642.993
:hmmm: thought about it! And .. it's comparable to rinse and wash your diner plate between meals.
:2cents:
 
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terra_firma

New member
Hey ive only used the Hengst filters ever, so i cant comment on the other brands "snapping" but i definitely notice that the filter needs a little hand pressure to fully seat and there is a big difference between just putting the filter on, and fully seating it. It feels like its on there nice and good, but whenever i go to change it 8-12k later the filter falls right off the stalk when removing the filter housing for an oil change. I guess that felt washer doesnt stay stiff for a whole year
 
Australian 4 cylinder 313 T1N .
So far I haven't actually changed the oil and filter myself. However, there probably will come a time when it becomes necessary that I do so.
I have a mobile mechanic who has been servicing all my vehicles for many years. He was originally a Volvo specialist, but is one of those guys that can do pretty much anything, and takes pride in his work. My confidence in him was confirmed when he easily diagnosed and fixed a problem with one of my Tarago's that had eluded 2 different Toyota dealerships. Anyhow, back to Sprinter oil filters ..... if I have the time, I can watch him work, as he doesn't mind, and likes to chat. I noticed he always smears some substance on the new O rings before the final installation. I always just assumed it was some secret magic substance that was used in the trade. I asked him one day, he said it was just ordinary Petroleum Jelly. He said he always uses it on oil filter O rings, as it makes them seat properly without any twisting or stress on the new O ring. I have heard of instances of people having leaking oil after having an oil and filter change. I think it results from incorrect seating of the O rings. When the day comes that I have to do my own oil changes, I think I'll make sure that I have a jar of Petroleum Jelly on hand. I am interested on the thoughts of others.
 

Aqua Puttana

Poly - Thread Finder
Hey ive only used the Hengst filters ever, so i cant comment on the other brands "snapping" but i definitely notice that the filter needs a little hand pressure to fully seat and there is a big difference between just putting the filter on, and fully seating it. It feels like its on there nice and good, but whenever i go to change it 8-12k later the filter falls right off the stalk when removing the filter housing for an oil change. I guess that felt washer doesnt stay stiff for a whole year
I just changed the oil and filter on my 2006 today. I always pull the filter cap/drain sealing stem assembly, "hook" it to suspend on the side, and let it drain for a time. That saves some dripping upon removal. My other filters always stayed on the drain sealing stem. Today the Hengst filter fell off into the filter cavity. Not really a big deal.

The Hengst filter I installed today did require a bit of snap to get into place. It was from the same shrink plastic packed batch that I received where the last one was a bit loose. Quality control issues? Pirate product? :idunno:

Just some information FWIW.

... When the day comes that I have to do my own oil changes, I think I'll make sure that I have a jar of Petroleum Jelly on hand. I am interested on the thoughts of others.
Up to this point I have just used engine oil. I like the idea of Petroleum Jelly better. :thumbup:

vic
 
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I just did my first oil change. Thanks for the tips. I got a mobil filter, that it sat right down on the housing with no problem. It came with 5 orings! lol. I had a hard time getting the filter cap fully seated by hand, but I'm short and weight 128 lbs! My hand calibration told me it took a lot more than 25 Nm to get it fully seated.

I also annealed the copper drain bolt washer as it was quite grooved and bowed from use. after 6000 miles, the oil came out black as crude, but didn't seem too broken down, and there was a full 9.5 quarts remaining in there.

Checked my cabin air fiter while I was in there. FILTHY! I slapped and vacuumed it out, but I need a new one. re-installing it was a bitch.

Thanks again for the tips.
Did my oil and cabin filter today, yes, the filter is a real bitch to get back in so the cover snaps on properly!
 

altide8

Member
I recently removed my oil filter to get to some fuel hoses that needed replacing. I noticed my middle o ring was broken so I replaced it with a Mobil 1 ring. As well as the top ring. Now I have an oil leak coming from somewhere. It’s about a 3in diameter spot on the drive way. My question is could a flaw in the seat of the oil filter be causing this leak? I don’t see any signs of the leak from the front of the oil filter cap
 

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