MyOtherCar
Well-known member
Vans still bare, has fudge running off of the Aux battery. Little electric space heater 1200 watts, is enough to keep it moderately warm. It’s about 36deg. 
Leavenworth Wa
- Thread starter MyOtherCar
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gas_sprinter
Well-known member
@MyOtherCar
I have the factory aux battery as well.
My wife is against the fossil fuel burning heater, she doesn't want the unit to accidentally malfunction and kill all our family inside the van, lol.
I'm in the process of gathering the info to have a beefy battery system to accommodate the electric heater.
How long did your 1200w heater run outta the aux battery?
I have the factory aux battery as well.
My wife is against the fossil fuel burning heater, she doesn't want the unit to accidentally malfunction and kill all our family inside the van, lol.
I'm in the process of gathering the info to have a beefy battery system to accommodate the electric heater.
How long did your 1200w heater run outta the aux battery?
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RVBarry
2023 AWD 170 DIY CamperVan
Hi, resistive electric heating is completely impractical in an RV, unless you're on shore power or it's always fairly warm weather.
Get some CO alarms and a proper gasoline Espar or Webasto.
sprint2freedom
2008 NCV3 170ext
You'll get less than an hour before the battery is 100% dead.
Kajtek1
1922 Ford T. No OBD
There are members, who claim they can run AC overnight, when AC takes about the same power what smaller heater.
I am observing those topic (just like EV topic) as there seems to be future in it.
But per last season pricing, you'd have to spend about $15, 000 on batteries to accomplish the task and then additional money to add 2nd alternator, or at least 3 kW solar system.
So at this point $100 Chinese diesel heater beats the above hands down.
But... new generation batteries and solar panels are getting cheaper every season.
I am observing those topic (just like EV topic) as there seems to be future in it.
But per last season pricing, you'd have to spend about $15, 000 on batteries to accomplish the task and then additional money to add 2nd alternator, or at least 3 kW solar system.
So at this point $100 Chinese diesel heater beats the above hands down.
But... new generation batteries and solar panels are getting cheaper every season.
MyOtherCar
Well-known member
I'm still in the final design phase of my van and use my incomplete buildup to try things out.
The heater was on day 2 when it died. It was free when I aquired it 8 yrs ago. The site with hookups was $30 per night at that location. A site at top of Stevens pass with hookups is $85 per night.
I keep going back and forth on the AGM vs Lifpo batteries. They both have pros and cons. I'm not buying cheap equipment based on the cost. (been there done that with the Van Windows Direct sliders). Besides, this isn't a promaster, or some converted freight van with 300k miles on it.
Right now it comes down to system cost, and reliability. I had a Lifeline 200 Ah AGM bank for 20 yrs in my Eurovan. In that time I looked at the battery bank a total of three times. The first time was when I installed the two Group 27 batteries. The second time was a few months later, when one of the batteries wouldn't hold a charge. (replaced under warranty). The third time was 10yrs later when I replaced the bank. I never once needed to check them on an app, or rebalance them because a cell was off by a few hundred millivolts or had to reset a BMS after a low voltage event. They just worked, all the time in any kind of temperature.
Currently I'm planning that my build will have a diesel heater and a 200 "useable" amp hour AGM battery bank. During this last trip my 300 watts of solar panels were yielding a massive 500 milliamps of current throughout the day. (which was expected)
I ran the Aux battery down to 65% in 24hrs using the fridge and was able to bring it up to 80% in 20 min of idle. ( I measured the initial charge rate at 50 amps and I shut the motor off when it hit 5 amps) The system is unmodified from what came with the van.
Eventually the MB Aux battery will only be used for lighting and a B2B charger. The B2B charger will the keep the starter battery topped off. The expected consumers on the starter battery are the MBUX system, and H12 heater. (I'll have an Isotemp water heater, and can use the H12, the engine, or 120vac to make hot water. Maybe all of them at once for a faster recovery rate)
The 400 amp hour house bank will primarily be used for the fridge, heater, microwave and Nespresso machine. Cooking will be with propane. The 400 amp hour battery bank will be connected to the 2nd alternator.
My extended snow camping plan when hookups are not available is to utilize the dual alternators to charge bulk charge the batteries. Utilizing a high idle and both alternators I should be able to achieve upto 320 amps of charge current while making hot water for a shower.
My entire BMS will consist of 2 BRPM fuses, my app will be a trail map. Provided that the inverter isn't maxed out I should be able to charge the batteries, while running the inverter.
I haven't seen how this could be done in a cost effective manner using Lithium technology.
If I decide to add AC, I may use a standalone unit where hookups are available. Or have the Van Autostart when the battery bank needs charging.
MyOtherCar
Well-known member
Do you heat your house with a electric furnace or heatpump? If you have a gas furnace in your house you may point that out to her that the same could happen at home.
So how to mitigate the chance of getting killed by your heater? Typically that is done with a risk assessment, which considers, mean time to dangerous failure, the exposure level, and the severity of injury. This is a CE requirement that I had to deal with when exporting equipment to the EU. Each of these three factors is assigned a number.
Mean time to failure, is the time it takes for a dangerous failure to occur in each component of the system. TUV in Germany, mandates that the heater cores of these heaters are replaced after ten years. (someone determined that the failure rate starts going up after that) It's not a cheap maintenance item, and is why you will find plenty of functional used heaters on Ebay.de.
The exposure level to the potential risk, is how often you use the heater and for how long. That varies depending on your use.
The severity of the injury in the event of a failure, in this case it could be death.
Anything that can result in death need to be mitigated before it can obtain a CE approval.
That is done as follows
1) You reduce your risk by by selecting components with a very low failure rate. (This probably excludes chineese heater made here today, gone tomorrow manufacturers)
2) Reducing your exposure, (in this instance you can't change that)
3) Detecting a failure before it becomes a threat. (Add a quality carbon monoxide detector to your van.)
That setup is what you will find in most homes. Hopefully that lets her sleep better, and lets her wake up in the morning as well.
gas_sprinter
Well-known member
We have Mitsubishi heatpump, based on my research Mitsubishi hyper-heat is the best in the market at this time, which requires no backup furnace.
Appreciate sharing the game plans on your van. I'm new to this whole van-life, so learning tons from here.
We all have the different travel plans and etc, I don't believe we will be boondocking out of nowhere and won't be traveling in the winter wonderlands, if we ever do it will be with the electric hookup site, there will be no issues for us to bring our portable heaters and being cozy.
Appreciate sharing the game plans on your van. I'm new to this whole van-life, so learning tons from here.
We all have the different travel plans and etc, I don't believe we will be boondocking out of nowhere and won't be traveling in the winter wonderlands, if we ever do it will be with the electric hookup site, there will be no issues for us to bring our portable heaters and being cozy.
gas_sprinter
Well-known member
@MyOtherCar
BTW, which site was this at Leavenworth? $30 night hookup site sounds much better than the SleepingLady where we usually go during the winter months prior to purchasing our van.
BTW, which site was this at Leavenworth? $30 night hookup site sounds much better than the SleepingLady where we usually go during the winter months prior to purchasing our van.
gas_sprinter
Well-known member
Kajtek1
1922 Ford T. No OBD
My brother moved there as he had high allergies in California.
He is having very nice house with view on Bridal Veil Falls, but our father kept on joking that the weather in CA and WA is almost the same
"in CA you have rain average 20 days a year, in WA you have no rain average 20 days a year"
He is having very nice house with view on Bridal Veil Falls, but our father kept on joking that the weather in CA and WA is almost the same
"in CA you have rain average 20 days a year, in WA you have no rain average 20 days a year"
MyOtherCar
Well-known member
Yes in Leavenworth. Its within walking distance of the town, which was great parking was a mess, and traffic was going slower than walking speed.
MyOtherCar
Well-known member
Good thing he's not allergic to moss and mold! Our summers are short and precious. And you really don't need AC up here the weather is mild.
One of my Customers flew up here from El Segundo for buying off some equipment. Ironically every time he came up it snowed. Those were the only days it snowed that year. He hated it, and as a result thinks it always snows up here.
MyOtherCar
Well-known member
There's and advantage to this. The most desired parks have almost no druck or disorderly campers. Turns out those type of people can't plan ahead very far, and don't ever get reservations.
Kajtek1
1922 Ford T. No OBD
well.... when it was year 2019, I found cancelation in middle of the summer 3 days before my arrival
TrackSprinter
2016 Motovan Boondocker
Lots of holdouts remaining for the diehard AGM users. AGM has/had a place in the world. The rest of us have moved on. To each, his own.
I just gave a buddy my 4year old Renogy lithiums to replace the Optima AGM's (that he swears by) in his used purchase RV. He went out for an event and I received a single text from him which read, "fucking bitchin". Apparently, he was impressed to not run his generator how many times a day.
I rolled the dice how many years ago with the Renogy brand. Maybe I was lucky with the success...?
Im rolling the dice again this time with Power Queen Mini's (was able to up capacity from 200 to 300Ah in the same space).
Same pouch technology. Great customer service btw they took a return no questions asked very responsive. Its been a month so far. Fingers crossed...
I charged them all up to capacity, thought a WHOLE LOT on how/where to parallel them, and flipped the switch. I dont look at my system (except after a days heavy useage, out of curiosity) it just works. Heavy consumers are diesel heater, Starlink/laptop, fulltime cooler, microwave and a once/day keurig. Winter solstice is always problematic however, absolutely no concerns the other three seasons.
A dual alternator is a great means to quickly recharge your large bank, until it isnt. Counter-intuitive youre hesitant about lithium technology but seemingly have no reservation to dive head first into a dual alternator. I will not attempt to dissuade you from doing this, there are many out there with functioning dual alternator systems. But its a rabbit hole. Wish you success on it. Another option would be to up the capacity of your solitary alternator and use one or more DC-DC chargers. You could still use a hi-idle device - Agile is now advertising a (new?) offering.
Lastly, "cost effective" is a relative term. If there is an award for a cheap-ass, I will always be in the running! That being said, the term "buy once, cry once" comes to mind. Like when I ditched the $terling60 for a Victron30, and still getting better bang for the buck. Putting it another way, youre going to invest the time/effort/cost to go dual alternator but youre considering to charge AGMs with that complex system - everyone has an opinion and I think its a loss of potential. Lithium is a one-time cost versus the lifetime of its available usage over AGM.
I would go (2) 200Ah lithium batteries in parallel for ease of maintenance and troubleshooting. A single 400Ah battery is smaller and much more simple but more expensive - however, if there is ever a problem you could be without power!
Cost is always a consideration for me. Takes me awhile to justify these big purchases. Im seeing 200Ah for $470 ads popping into my feed. The market is currently on your side. I was able to purchase 3x 100Ah for $600. For reference, my 100Ah Renogy's were $800ea on SALE when I purchased them years ago. Whats done is done, no turning back. Wish me luck.
Good luck with your build! Fun stuff - (and get that diesel heater).
edit: spy tech is always watching... another add popped directly into my feed: 1-300Ah $712
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Kajtek1
1922 Ford T. No OBD
You are twisting the situation around.
I have cheap, Golf Cart batteries in my cabin, who I purchased last fall and build the system from scratch this summer.
Initially I had 200 Ah batteries and 3 - 100W solar panels. That made me running generator to recharge the batteries at night almost every day. (5-6 hr of big screen use)
Adding 100 Ah battery and another panel made using generator not necessary, unless I use chops saw for firewood.
Whole system, including 3kW inverter cost me about $700, although I did have some components already.
MyOtherCar
Well-known member
A dual alternator system utilizing a Wakespeed regulator is not complex.
Add up the costs of ALL the components needed to operate a lithium system then compare the to an AGM system. Lithium batteries have a lot of overhead that you don’t account for in your cost comparison. It more than just the price of the battery.