EGR valve cleaning w/ pictures.

T.J.T

Member
After taking my 2008 2500 dodge sprinter in and having a EGR valve positioning error and reading about how the valve can be cleaned I was able to take it apart this weekend and clean it up a bit. I pulled as much info off these forums as I could find and it went pretty smooth. I Took some pictures for amusment and also if anyone else feels they want to tackle this maybe it can help.

I pulled the valve off and original found a nice coating on everything. I wiggled it out as it got stuck a couple time but some gentle wiggling back and forth helped it come out. I did have to loosen the oil cap "neck" as it was in the way but it was one bolt then I was able to turn it so the egr would clear coming out.

My initial reaction was it was black(duh). It wasn't as bad as I imagined, but the actual "valve" on the bottom was very dirty and at first i was not able to turn it.

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/857/20120415134931.jpg/

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/204/20120415134936.jpg/

I found when I did turn it, it would not reset back too the closed position. That would probably be why I was getting a position error and a jerking or stall when I was at low rpms trying to accelerate after being on the highway. The valve would probably open during high speeds then try to close when i slowed down, but the carbon wouldn't allow it so it would choke the engine out. At least in my simple mind that how it worked...

The cleaning went well. I bought some brushes but they were a bit too big to get in there so I had to spray it with the carb cleaner I bought. It seemed to get almost all of the carbon out of the body of the egr valve. The bottom cleaned up very nice with a brush and it moved 1000% better then when i first tried to operate it by hand.

I took a picture after I cleaned the bottom of the valve.

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/40/20120415134944.jpg/

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/850/20120415134952.jpg/

I took a couple pictures of the spot the egr sits in, this area had carbon but I didn't clean it as I didn't know if that was a good or bad idea. Just cleaned off the area for the gasket and replaced the valve with the torque wrench at 124 in/lb as I read thats what the T1N EGR should be torqued too. I hope this is the same with the NCV3

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/850/20120415134959.jpg/

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/820/20120415135019.jpg/

I had the dealer tell me there was a "o-ring" for this part, I couldn't not find a O-ring and I found a post on here saying there was NO O-RING(I think from Doc-A) so that something to note. This job was pretty easy and the 20 minute drive home I couldn't get it to do what it was doing before. Time will tell but from what i observed the valve should move much better then before.

probably not the best write up, but it gives new people like me some idea of what it all looks like. I hope I didnt do too many things wrong :crazy:
 
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jdcaples

Not Suitable w/220v Gen
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dukepilot

Custom Spooling USA
Just downstream of the EGR valve is an elbow pipe that connects the EGR housing to the intake manifold. When cleaning/servicing the EGR valve, you might want to consider removing this pipe and cleaning it. Also clean the EGR temperature sensor. I found the elbow pipe on my sprinter to be partially coked up with black crap. Removing and remounting this pipe will require 2 new gaskets, Dodge part number 05175695AA
 

blade625

Diesel-dumb...
Thanks for the helpful post T.J.T.
My van is an '07 2500 Cargo, with 58,000 miles when I performed this cleaning.

For whatever it's worth, it was throwing these generic codes on my scan gauge II: P 0404 [EGR pos sensor rationality] and this morning it decided to throw P 0401 [EGR system failure] The latter code was what lit the fire under my arse....

I had boxed myself into a corner, as I have been procrastinating/neglecting this issue and had run out of time to get to a dealer [headed to NJ this weekend for racing, need van to haul bikes]

So, I decided to give the cleaning a try. It was even easier than I had expected, the whole process taking about 1.5 hours including a quick trip to Autozone to pick up a #10 star socket.

Mine was suck solidly shut [see pic]

A few additional tips for those who follow:

I disconnected the coolant lines, so I could work on it anywhere but under the hood. You only lose about a cup of coolant from the hoses.

My valve required a fair amount of careful/light tapping left and right to free it enough to pull it from the manifold. The word here is patience. I would resist the urge to go it it with a pry bar or screwdriver to speed things up.

After soaking the base in carb cleaner, and scrubbing it w/ wire brush, I filled a small cup w/cleaner, immersed the valve base, and took it next door to a guy who has an ultrasonic cleaner. 5 minutes and more scrubbing made it look nearly new.

The valve "propeller" seems to have a spring assist in closing, mine would only return to about 80% closed. Whether this is by design, or wear/defect I can't say...just something I noted.

Oh, and I also noticed that the 6mm bolt holding the oil filler neck was just sitting in it's hole. It wasn't long enough to reach the captured nut on the bracket.....I can't say if it it was delivered this way, or during some dealer service two similar bolts [of different lengths] got switched in location. Mine only had 15mm of thread and needs 20 minimum. At any rate, the filler neck had never moved [until I moved it out of the way]

After reassembly, I took it for a 30 mile drive [all freeway 70+ mph]. It ran great, and no check engine light or trouble codes re-surfaced. 5-6 hours of driving this weekend will be the better test.

All said and done, I think this is an easy maintenance job. I honestly think, now that I'm familiar with the procedure, I could do it in under a half hour. Given the cost of a new EGR valve for "out-of-warranty" vehicles [not to mention the time/hassle of scheduling a dealer service] I'd like to keep this one functioning as long as possible. If this indeed helps, I'm going to pull it again for service in 10,000 miles and see how it looks. I'll post another pic then.

 

jdcaples

Not Suitable w/220v Gen
<snip>
After soaking the base in carb cleaner, and scrubbing it w/ wire brush, I filled a small cup w/cleaner, immersed the valve base, and took it next door to a guy who has an ultrasonic cleaner. 5 minutes and more scrubbing made it look nearly new.
<snip>
I'm looking forward to reading about the longevity of your home-repair cleaning.

Which ultra sonic cleaner does your neighbor use? I've been considering purchasing one to support a hobby, but it'd be nice if an ultra-sonic cleaner I purchase isn't just a one trick pony.

-Jon
 

blade625

Diesel-dumb...
Hi Jon, I just walked down the hall and took a look for you.

His is a Branson B52H [looks to be a few, well used, years old, couldn't find it online]. It's in an industrial gear shop where they make "elliptical and non-circular" gears.

Anyway, this is their current equivalent based on his tank dimensions. His is heated
http://www.cleanosonic.com/bransonic-b5510.html

Obviously depending on what you're going to put in it, other sizes/alternatives are available. My Mom was a goldsmith, and always had a small ultra running in her shop, but I can't recall what make she favored.
 

Dingo

New member
to help remove the black junk on egr valves , i use carb cleaner & an old tooth brush to GENTLY clean the muck off it really strips the crap away . Less chance of damage being caused & it gets into all the places you cannot reach
 

blade625

Diesel-dumb...
I put 400 miles on it this weekend with nary a hiccup. No lights, no codes, seems to have fixed my EGR valve problem :thumbup:

We'll see how it does longer-term. I'll update in 10,000 mi. when I pull it again for inspection.
 

T.J.T

Member
after 20,000km yesterday I could tell it was acting up again. I put it off and today it was horrible. Limp mode all day, I could tell it was the EGR valve. It finaly threw a engine light mid way through my work day.

I pulled it out after my day and it was very dirty covered with fine soot and the valve wouldnt even open. So i sprayed it down cleaned it up, now it moves really nice. Took it for a 30 minute drive, not a problem.

Its nice to know it took 15 minutes to clean and I could pin point my problem. It concerns me how dirty it was in such a short time. I am running the proper oil with NO idling and a decent amount of highway driving each day. Ive been using the premium shell diesel with the HOWES diesel conditioner, count either of those be an issue?
 

72chevy4x4

Well-known member
that's ridiculous that the part is not functional-having to clean it in order for proper operation to occur is sad. I've been getting the occasional jerking (or stumble) which has become more frequent. A long trip on the highway had cleared it up for 3 wks, but then it has crept back.

For a 2008 with 63k, does the MB warranty still cover the EGR?
 

220629

Well-known member
after 20,000km yesterday I could tell it was acting up again. ...
That's good news for those of us that have 2004 and up EGR's of similar design. The thought was that cleaning didn't work on the "tulip" newer style valves. That's probably true for the pros, but using your experience it shows that it's worth a try for a DIY type.

I'm including most all your pictures from the first post here. I've seen where pics on other servers can disappear leaving us with less information. Thanks for the follow-up. :thumbup: vic

20120415134931.jpg

20120415134936-2.jpg

20120415134944-3.jpg

20120415134952-4.jpg

20120415134959-5.jpg
 
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johnshmit

Well-known member
EGR_FIX.jpg

Very small accumulation in highlighted area will act as a brake pad in a drum based parking brake system. It will create enough resistance to overcome motor and return spring and cause egr valve malfunction. Replacing EGR valve will not fix this problem since it will have the same design flaw. Cleaning just that area with a pocket screwdriver will fix the issue for awhile. I will permanently fix this issue when my new milling machine arrives sometimes next week.:rolleyes:
 

talkinghorse43

Well-known member
The thought was that cleaning didn't work on the "tulip" style valves.
I've seen the good Doktor refer to the OM612 EGR valve as a "tulip" style valve, but don't know why since it's just like a normal intake or exhaust valve. Maybe two lips - opening and closing like a mouth? The OM612 valve can most definitely be cleaned.
 

johnshmit

Well-known member
Older valves have a controller circuit board sitting on top and they fail from overheating.
My 2010 valve seems to be just a stepper motor and valve itself so cleaning works
 

T.J.T

Member
after another day its like its brand new. No problems, engine light went out on its own when i started it up this morning.

Another interesting thing I could hear when I knew the valve was "stuck" and before cleaning. After I turned my Van off I think it goes through some self testing or maybe its checking its range because I usualy hear a high pitch "whine" and some "clicking" when the valve is working properly. Yesterday before i cleaned it I had to move my van and pulled the key out of the ignition. The whine was noticebly stressing(lower tone), and it lacked any clicking sound.

To me this indicated the valve was stuck(witch was confirmed) and it might be something to note for people who question if they are going through the same problems.

Of course this could all be false I am only speaking on what I experienced, I have no technical background to say for sure or not.
 

220629

Well-known member
I've seen the good Doktor refer to the OM612 EGR valve as a "tulip" style valve, but don't know why since it's just like a normal intake or exhaust valve. Maybe two lips - opening and closing like a mouth? The OM612 valve can most definitely be cleaned.
I probably mixed the terms. I changed my post to say "newer". Recalling other posts, I know for certain (as you indicated) that it is the older OM612 valves that respond to periodic cleaning and the newer style didn't seem to. "Tulip" stuck in my mind, but I don't see why that descriptive term either. It's still good news for 2004+ owners that a DIY cleaning may extend the EGR valve life, return performance, and avoid replacement cost. The newer style look like tulip petals don't they? :idunno: Sorry for any confusion. vic

after another day its like its brand new. No problems, engine light went out on its own when i started it up this morning.

Another interesting thing I could hear when I knew the valve was "stuck" and before cleaning. After I turned my Van off I think it goes through some self testing or maybe its checking its range because I usualy hear a high pitch "whine" and some "clicking" when the valve is working properly. Yesterday before i cleaned it I had to move my van and pulled the key out of the ignition. The whine was noticebly stressing(lower tone), and it lacked any clicking sound.

...
I believe there is an automated cleaning cycle designed into the programming. I suspect that is what you hear after shutdown. vic
 
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unimog

Active member
EGR valves are covered under the 100,000 miles emissions warranty. Had mine replaced recent at no cost at 73,000 miles on the 2008 sprinter by Sun Motors Mechanicsburg, PA. Similarly Glowplug failures are also covered under the emissions warranty. So far I have had 2 EGR Valve failures and 2 glowplug failures all covered under warranty
 

BigBlueBus

Member
EGR valves are covered under the 100,000 miles emissions warranty. Had mine replaced recent at no cost at 73,000 miles on the 2008 sprinter by Sun Motors Mechanicsburg, PA. Similarly Glowplug failures are also covered under the emissions warranty. So far I have had 2 EGR Valve failures and 2 glowplug failures all covered under warranty
:bash: I was told by my local dealer that glow plug failures was NOT covered under the emissions warranty. Is there a reference you could point to that I can use to contradict this dealer?

Although I already replaced the glowplug myself, I'd like to be prepared for when the next one fails.
 

unimog

Active member
My dealer Sun Motor in PA has replaced two glowplugs under the emissions warranty with no charge. Sugest you ask more questions of ther dealer and have them check with MB or change dealership.
 

jdcaples

Not Suitable w/220v Gen
I was told by my local dealer that glow plug failures was NOT covered under the emissions warranty.

Is there a reference you could point to that I can use to contradict this dealer?

<snip>
It's in the original warranty booklet (pdf attached if you don't the hard copy)

Page 27
MANUFACTURER'S WARRANTY COVERAGE
For 5 years or 100,000 miles, whichever first
occurs:
1. If an emission-related part on your vehicle is defective,
the part will be repaired or replaced by DCMC.
This is your SHORT-TERM EMISSION CONTROL
SYSTEM DEFECTS WARRANTY.
Page 28
SHORT-TERM EMISSION-RELATED PARTS:
I. Fuel Metering System:
High pressure injection pump
Fuel injector
Electronic accelerator value sensor
Fuel tank pressure valve (incld. in rail)
Fuel rail pressure sensor
Fuel temperature sensor
II. Glow System:
Glow control unit
Glow plug

III. Air Intake System:
Intercooler
IV. Exhaust Gas Recirculation System
EGR valve
EGR cooler
Page 29
V. Exhaust:
Turbocharger
Boost pressure actuator (part of turbocharger)
Oxidation catalyst (serviced w/muffler)
Diesel particulate filter
VI. Engine Emission Control System:
Camshaft position sensor
Crankshaft position / RPM sensor
Electronic control module
Engine coolant temperature sensor
Lambda sensor
Intake air pressure sensor
Manifold air pressure sensor
Intake air temperature sensor, ingrt. w/MAF
Manifold air temperature sensor
Mass airflow sensor (MAF)
Instrument cluster
 

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