Sprinter-Forum    
 

Go Back   Sprinter-Forum > Sprinter-Based RV's & Conversions > Sprinter-Based RV Brands > Advanced RV


 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 05-25-2019, 12:35 AM   #51
Boxster1971
2012 Sprinter 3500 Ext
 
Boxster1971's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Laurel, MD
Posts: 1,781
Thanks: 632
Thanked 814 Times in 563 Posts
Default Re: Is Advanced-RV now offering the shorter 2500 Sprinter 144" wheelbase?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert-NE View Post
Can you explain this 7,400lb upfitted weight limit? Is this due to some external factor such as workshop lift capacity or vehicle transportation trail weight limit?
The limit is established by Mercedes, known as curb weight limit. It is the maximum weight allowed before adding passengers and cargo. Master Upfitters must meet this requirement when doing initial modification on a Sprinter. Attaching the page from latest Body Equipment Guideline (BEG).
Attached Images
File Type: jpg IMG_0535.jpg (55.2 KB, 56 views)
__________________
-- Mike
2012 Sprinter 3500 EXT Airstream Interstate
Boxster1971 is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Boxster1971 For This Useful Post:
Robert-NE (05-27-2019)
Old 05-25-2019, 01:33 PM   #52
Davydd
 
Davydd's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 1,035
Thanks: 26
Thanked 488 Times in 310 Posts
Default Re: Is Advanced-RV now offering the shorter 2500 Sprinter 144" wheelbase?

The disappointing thing I found out in the process of our design was a SuperSingle at 9990 GVWR was still limited to 7400 curb weight though it starts out heavier thus leaving less upfitter improvements.

In going through the design process I wonder how they keep Roadtrek Agiles and Pleasureway Ascents below 7400 lbs. curb weight. Does anyone know if they do?
Davydd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-25-2019, 11:43 PM   #53
Boxster1971
2012 Sprinter 3500 Ext
 
Boxster1971's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Laurel, MD
Posts: 1,781
Thanks: 632
Thanked 814 Times in 563 Posts
Default Re: Is Advanced-RV now offering the shorter 2500 Sprinter 144" wheelbase?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Davydd View Post
The disappointing thing I found out in the process of our design was a SuperSingle at 9990 GVWR was still limited to 7400 curb weight though it starts out heavier thus leaving less upfitter improvements.

In going through the design process I wonder how they keep Roadtrek Agiles and Pleasureway Ascents below 7400 lbs. curb weight. Does anyone know if they do?
I checked the Roadtrek Agile webpage and they claim a cargo capacity of 1500 lbs. Subtracting that from 8,550 GVWR gives a curb weight of 7,050 lbs.

https://www.roadtrek.com/models/ss-agile/

Could not find any cargo or empty weight for the Pleasure Way Ascent. Only reference to the required label for OCCUPANT AND CARGO CARRYING CAPACITY (OCCC). Same for the Winnebago Revel, could find no specific listing of cargo capacity - only reference to the OCCC labels. So one would have to see an actual van with label to know their OCCC that is based on their curb weight.

But as I posted earlier if Airstream can get the empty weight down to 7,346 lbs, then I'd imagine others can do it.

Looking forward to see how your new build works out. One thing for sure the cabinets that ARV builds are solidly made and top quality, but they are heavy.
__________________
-- Mike
2012 Sprinter 3500 EXT Airstream Interstate
Boxster1971 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-26-2019, 08:15 AM   #54
GeorgeRa
2013 Sprinter DIY 144WB
 
GeorgeRa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 4,309
Thanks: 1,213
Thanked 2,409 Times in 1,558 Posts
Default Re: Is Advanced-RV now offering the shorter 2500 Sprinter 144" wheelbase?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Boxster1971 View Post
.....................One thing for sure the cabinets that ARV builds are solidly made and top quality, but they are heavy.
It is interesting that only a few companies embark on aluminum framing cabinetry to reduce weight. I think Sportsmobile has a model with 1” square tubing used for framing which was designed in Germany, as far as I remember. Aluminum frames, cladded in not structural decorative covers either wood or plastic are good choices if weight is a concern. My loaded 144" van is 1,000 lbs below max fully loaded.
__________________
George.

https://goo.gl/photos/2NCR3teXLSwNYSwN8
GeorgeRa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-2019, 01:04 PM   #55
Davydd
 
Davydd's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 1,035
Thanks: 26
Thanked 488 Times in 310 Posts
Default Re: Is Advanced-RV now offering the shorter 2500 Sprinter 144" wheelbase?

Quote:
Originally Posted by GeorgeRa View Post
It is interesting that only a few companies embark on aluminum framing cabinetry to reduce weight. I think Sportsmobile has a model with 1” square tubing used for framing which was designed in Germany, as far as I remember. Aluminum frames, cladded in not structural decorative covers either wood or plastic are good choices if weight is a concern. My loaded 144" van is 1,000 lbs below max fully loaded.
Is that below curb weight or GVWR? My proposed van will be at least 1,650 lbs. below GVWR or probably at 1,000 lbs. below “fully loaded” after we occupy it. ARV has explored 80/20 framing and they build a variety of lightweight core paneling since most paneling they use is plastic laminate because of the curvature design they utilize extensively. ARV did not get enough savings in weight to justify 80/20 without compromising their designs. I requested they explore it since my design will not have much curvature. I have a detailed spreadsheet list of everything they install with actual or estimated weights to stay below 7,400 lbs. curb weight per MB. Right now I am 33 lbs. below. I have the cabinets I want which are much more extensive than any 144 Sprinter RV I know of.

ARV said in their extensive retrofitting business of air conditioners, levelers, and VB air suspensions, bull bars, etc. on other vans that they feel many vans are overloaded on curb weight. They didn’t say which. Interestingly, after I take possession I too could then turn around and add their VB Air Suspension (135 lbs) and levelers (175 lbs) if I want. In a way it is a blessing that I can take possession, experience, and drive the van to determine if I really want them. I have plenty to work with with 1,650 lbs. I could go full mounty Aluminess accessories if I wanted to. ;)
Davydd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-2019, 06:19 PM   #56
GeorgeRa
2013 Sprinter DIY 144WB
 
GeorgeRa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 4,309
Thanks: 1,213
Thanked 2,409 Times in 1,558 Posts
Default Re: Is Advanced-RV now offering the shorter 2500 Sprinter 144" wheelbase?

Our fully loaded camper, means trip ready with both of us, weight was 7600 lbs. including the loaded Stowaway 2 with the swing hitch. An estimate weight of the Stowaway/hitch is about 300 lbs. which makes our trip ready van about 1250 lbs. less than GVWR of 8550 lbs. as we no longer use the Stowaway.

Without detailed, item by item comparison it would be difficult to compare your planned van with my DIY one. At the beginning of my conversion I kept weights for added components, but in time I dropped it knowing I will be OK in van’s weight. Here are weights in lbs. for some of my components:

Upholstered sofa bed - 233.05
Galley frame - 44.85
Grey water tank - 32.55
Fresh water tank with brackets - 42.30
Hot water tank - 21.30
Awning - 61.60
Electrical cabinet complete - 113.95
2 x Fullriver batteries group 31 - 144.20
Thinsulate - 30.00
Left overhead cabinet 113 in long - 63.45
Right overhead cabinet 61.5 in long - 35.57
Housed Thetford cassette toilet in 80/20 cabinet - 70.00

Aluminum framing has many options from welded frames to assembly using fasteners. One German company and Sportsmobile are using 1” square tubing with flanges, called by 80/20 a Quick Frame, for their very modular design, great solution for low weight, fast assembly using plastic fasteners but not so good for redoing. Some folks could object to plastic corner fasteners.

There is a gamut of 80/20 profiles with T-slots to match required strength from 20 – 0.79 in, 10 or 20 ~ 1 in, 30 – 1.18 in, 15 – 1.5 in and some more, so many options.

Here is an example of my complete galley frame (22.5"Dx36in.Wx34.5"H) based on heavy 15 series with drawers and floor mounts versus a cube built from 5/8” or ¾” marine plywood. Plywood options are from 62 – 105% heavier. With combination of 10 and 15 series it could be even more, so just on galley frame savings in weight could be 28 to 47 lbs., that is not negligent.

For me the choice between aluminum frame or plywood was easy, I built the first and the last conversion, didn’t have expertise with plywood/wood cabinetry nor with aluminum framing, so weight savings prevailed. Assembly was also simplified as all extrusions were cut at the factory and HDPE fronts and filler panels were CNCed.

For high volume manufacturing I would likely choose aluminum framing either welded or Quick Frame. With low cost sensitivity T-slotted combination of different profiles would be my choice. For folks objecting to visible aluminum frame it can be nicely finished with a light weight 1/4" bamboo, hardwood, veneered plywood or plastic.
__________________
George.

https://goo.gl/photos/2NCR3teXLSwNYSwN8
GeorgeRa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-28-2019, 12:38 AM   #57
Davydd
 
Davydd's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 1,035
Thanks: 26
Thanked 488 Times in 310 Posts
Default Re: Is Advanced-RV now offering the shorter 2500 Sprinter 144" wheelbase?

I’ve made my weight so for me it is a moot subject and I’m having it built by the experts so don’t have to compromise on my building skills. For a good portion of my career I designed hospitals and nursing homes. 80/20 reminds me of the cabinetry in those buildings built for durability, but not aesthetics at least in my mind, that remind me of such institutional buildings I’d rather stay out of. :)

I’m not really a fan of plastic laminate either and since I don’t plan to have any rounded corners I thought I could opt out like Gustav, Cruzmobile and Sue Valentine’s Bucky with polyurethaned real wood finish. ARV’s P lam has held up in my current van, Alvar, to the point where I can accept it and could choose from any manufacturer for infinite choices to complement my other interior finishes of fabric, wall, ceiling and accessories. It gives a clean Scandinavian style look which I favor.
Davydd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-28-2019, 01:22 AM   #58
Boxster1971
2012 Sprinter 3500 Ext
 
Boxster1971's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Laurel, MD
Posts: 1,781
Thanks: 632
Thanked 814 Times in 563 Posts
Default Re: Is Advanced-RV now offering the shorter 2500 Sprinter 144" wheelbase?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Davydd View Post
… I’m not really a fan of plastic laminate either and since I don’t plan to have any rounded corners I thought I could opt out like Gustav, Cruzmobile and Sue Valentine’s Bucky with polyurethaned real wood finish. ARV’s P lam has held up in my current van, Alvar, to the point where I can accept it and could choose from any manufacturer for infinite choices to complement my other interior finishes of fabric, wall, ceiling and accessories. It gives a clean Scandinavian style look which I favor.
"...I thought I could opt out..." Were you able to get poly on real wood like Bucky? That is the interior I would also prefer. Our did you just go with the P lam? Is there a weight difference?
__________________
-- Mike
2012 Sprinter 3500 EXT Airstream Interstate
Boxster1971 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-28-2019, 12:29 PM   #59
Davydd
 
Davydd's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 1,035
Thanks: 26
Thanked 488 Times in 310 Posts
Default Re: Is Advanced-RV now offering the shorter 2500 Sprinter 144" wheelbase?

The real wood was contracted out to a woodworking company in Wisconsin. It has a marine (boating) look to me. ARV said it was harder to install labor wise. It may be lighter in that a p lam finish would probably be heavier than a polyurethane finish.
Davydd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-28-2019, 03:45 PM   #60
Boxster1971
2012 Sprinter 3500 Ext
 
Boxster1971's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Laurel, MD
Posts: 1,781
Thanks: 632
Thanked 814 Times in 563 Posts
Default Re: Is Advanced-RV now offering the shorter 2500 Sprinter 144" wheelbase?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Davydd View Post
The real wood was contracted out to a woodworking company in Wisconsin. It has a marine (boating) look to me. ARV said it was harder to install labor wise. It may be lighter in that a p lam finish would probably be heavier than a polyurethane finish.
Thanks David - sounds like it might also be more expensive considering they had to contract out the work and that it was harder to install.
__________________
-- Mike
2012 Sprinter 3500 EXT Airstream Interstate
Boxster1971 is offline   Reply With Quote

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT. The time now is 10:00 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.