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Old 06-02-2016, 06:01 PM   #41
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Default Re: Low DEF False Alarm & Another Really Bad Mercedes Dealer

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Originally Posted by Hatteras Jim View Post
You will get the problems again is my bet. I have listened to the rhetoric about too many error codes clogging the system, needing to reset everything, everything will be fine ...blah, blah, blah. Only things that fixed my two problems were the actual replacement of parts.

My closest dealer (who I would not visit again) is 140 miles away.

Wish you well and hope for the best. Maybe it will work for you. Let us know.

jim

Well, after another 5200 miles so far, there have been no problems. The DEF system is apparently fixed for now ...

I know by posting this, I have jinxed it, and it will be a problem by the weekend...drat it all!
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Old 06-03-2016, 05:25 PM   #42
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Default Re: Low DEF False Alarm & Another Really Bad Mercedes Dealer

Just my two cents. I would always keep the DEF tank full.
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Old 06-03-2016, 06:14 PM   #43
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Default Re: Low DEF False Alarm & Another Really Bad Mercedes Dealer

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Originally Posted by big_d View Post
Here's a related question:

What did the dealer gain here? If he gets paid the same hourly rate by Mercedes for warranty repairs as he collects from end-user, what was his incentive to screw around here? What did he gain by not submitting it as a warranty repair, as he clearly should have?

These guys really dug in, and they're completely wrong. They lost any future warranty repairs and all of our parts business. For what, I don't know.
I can't speak for Mercedes, but most dealerships try to stay out of warranty work if they can.

Mercedes warranty probably does not pay as much as you do for an hour of labor.
Mercedes warranty probably does not pay as much as you do for parts.

both of these numbers can be dealer specific. the dealer I work for has re-negotiated its warranty rates on both of those front at least twice over the last decade.

Mercedes warranty has a defined labor time (book time) for most jobs, so they can't round .8 up to an hour. you do not, so .8 easily becomes a whole hour, and one hour can just as easily become two.

so, in summation, there are at least three factors that make you a more profitable customer than warranty is.
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Old 04-16-2017, 06:41 AM   #44
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Default Re: Low DEF False Alarm & Another Really Bad Mercedes Dealer

DELETE IT 917 642 1645
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Old 04-16-2017, 05:47 PM   #45
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Default Re: Low DEF False Alarm & Another Really Bad Mercedes Dealer

Amazing to see what happened to Volkswagen... and their vehicles didn't even 'threaten' their drivers with Limp Modes, or or 'demand instant attention'...or will outright QUIT on the spot! All because of a unknown breakdown somewhere in their emissions compliance system. Hmmm
Whereas Mercedes has been able to successfully maintain their Prestige and Sprinter Diesel Sales...while at the same time avoiding addressing the faulty technical compliance issues that are continually facing their MB Sprinter owners, Dealers and Shops. in this case, dealing with faulty Compliance Issues that could all result in the driver 'BEING STRANDED' on the road or in a Shop. I wonder if any aircraft have 'Limp Modes' ? Hmmm
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Old 04-16-2017, 06:55 PM   #46
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Default Re: Low DEF False Alarm & Another Really Bad Mercedes Dealer

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Amazing to see what happened to Volkswagen... and their vehicles didn't even 'threaten' their drivers with Limp Modes, or or 'demand instant attention'...or will outright QUIT on the spot! All because of a unknown breakdown somewhere in their emissions compliance system. Hmmm
Whereas Mercedes has been able to successfully maintain their Prestige and Sprinter Diesel Sales...while at the same time avoiding addressing the faulty technical compliance issues that are continually facing their MB Sprinter owners, Dealers and Shops. in this case, dealing with faulty Compliance Issues that could all result in the driver 'BEING STRANDED' on the road or in a Shop. I wonder if any aircraft have 'Limp Modes' ? Hmmm
Well from my perspective the whole affair has been skillfully handled by MB to keep its warranty work to a minimum.
Of course the V6 engine series is old technology and subsequently hashed (if you want to to use that word) to acceptance Adblue applications.
The new 4 cylinder is nothing like as troublesome for operators , in fact its a sweety of a power pack!

I can cite numerous cases of grey cloud support for troublesome systems.
Take one the other day came in for a routine service and the light on for a NOx issue
A 2010 model 906 with 36,000 om the clock--customer tired of the light on! But had learned to live with it for two years.
MB records showed that it had new Nox sensors fitted at 18,000 miles but no update re-flash nor any updates by the last dealer it had been to in Colorado.

The remedy wasn't cheap.
He needed a new DEF dosing valve --plugged up!
Two new latest and greatest NOx sensors and a "bazooka tube" to get the NOx reduction down to at least 75% across the bazooka, @ and out the ail pipe!
For good measure i sent it down to the dealer for a latest re-flash and SCN coding to cover my tail!
Owner is now happy but $3500 of happiness I think should have been mitigated in some way by our dear MB friends.

Now i have another which is grey again.
Owner buys it used with 165.000 on it.
The unit has never been touched by a dealer for any updates & re-flashes are greeted with a firm NIET !
I can see this going the same way with $3500 bill to get the CEL off and an E test compliance.

I as a past employee of manufacturers can help drawing conclusions of what would they have done!
Campaign changes would have been one remedy instead of the Sprinter public at large doing the testing for them!
Like I stated skillfully handled.
Dennis
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Old 04-18-2017, 12:09 AM   #47
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Default Re: Low DEF False Alarm & Another Really Bad Mercedes Dealer

Dennis, should (could) we be doing preventive maintenance on the DEF dosing valve, or any other part of this system other than adding DEF?
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Old 04-18-2017, 12:25 AM   #48
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Default Re: Low DEF False Alarm & Another Really Bad Mercedes Dealer

Yes there are two or three basic visuals .
Examine the fr'wrd ex pipe flex section for breakage! It usually starts with black carbon stain traces.
If left too long/neglected and the flex breaks, the hot gases will torch the TCM wires to the transmission with some nasty results.

Next check the wires running to the dosing valve, they can burn on the exhaust pipe due to their proximity.
Remove the valve by releasing the band clamp and inspect the nozzle .
No incrustations allowed !

If you have an appropriate scan tool you can check the spray pattern of the dosing valve hanging on the wires! It has three radial jets of fluid when operating . Then check the delivery quantity of 125 to 150 mili litres per tests period as commanded by the scanner.

Lastly I always give it a road test looking for at least 75% reduction of NOx across the bazooka tube.
Dennis

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Old 04-18-2017, 12:49 AM   #49
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Default Re: Low DEF False Alarm & Another Really Bad Mercedes Dealer

To add insult to injury, emission related components, such as DPF, the dealer will not sell to the general public.
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Old 04-18-2017, 01:01 AM   #50
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Default Re: Low DEF False Alarm & Another Really Bad Mercedes Dealer

Fair warning, I have never dealt with DEF but I know how to research. DEF can go bad in as little as two month in high temps. It would therefor seem reasonable to me to run the tank as close to empty as possible. Keeping it full means at least some is getting very old. Would that make it turn milky?
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