DIY Cloned Keys - Clone and Cutting Machines

Boeingpilot

New member
This will be my first posting to the forum, hope it is helpful.

I just purchased a very clean 2005 140' low roof passenger van. Vehicle is in good condition, with a number of small common Sprinter problems. (Glow plugs throwing MIL; Fan resistor had failed (replaced already); heater controls stiff and having issues). None of these are deal breakers. The best thing is relatively low miles (139K) and a clean original interior. Rust had been addressed prior to my purchase, as the vehicle was used as a school transport.

The van came with only one key, and it is of the Remote Keyless Entry (RKE) version, though the RKE does not work. (Yes, I tried to 're-pair' the fob to the car, but no joy). The bigger issue is obviously only one key. Lose that, and game over, flatbed to stealership, etc. That said, I wanted to get a spare key (or more) made. As much as I want another key fob (and both of them to work, the quickest thing was to get a standard transponder key made. Looking over the forum, it appears that my choices were dealership (order key, pair to vehicle, $$$); or looksmith and get a clone key (moderate priced, but....)

Being the inquisitive type, I started to research key cloning. The advantage is instead of a finite number of keys, I could have as many keys as I wanted (the car just thinks I'm always using the same key), and I could make new ones whenever I wanted. So, I was looking on line for key cloners that would handle the T5 Silca chip (chip that is in the key blanks). Found an number of cloners in the $150 and up category. Mmmm... Not very cost effective. Then I stumbled on a chinese clone of a Turkish key cloner called the Zed-Bull.


For $35 off eBay, I figured I'd give it a go (https://www.ebay.com/itm/Mini-Type-...e=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649)

Then for another $12.95, I ordered two Sprinter key blanks off of eBay (https://www.ebay.com/itm/2-New-Repl...e=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649)

Fortunately, because I have to copy keys for some rental properties, I have access to a Belsaw key cutter


Quite a simple machine, and it does take a bit of getting used to adjust, but it does the job.

So I started out with the blank and my existing key.



About 5 minutes later I had a key cut.



Once the key was cut I tried it in the van and got the immobilizer starter error, which was expected.



The Zed-Bull can be used to identify a key for a transponder and which type. Here is what it read for my original and for the 'virgin' blank





Not surprising the transponder on the blank key was all zeros.

I then ran the key through the copying process.

Simply insert the original into the machine, press Copy. It will prompt you to press R to read



Once done, the machine prompts you for the correct chip type, and to press W to write the key.

20 seconds later, voila, chip is copied.

I went back out to car and the car started!

So.. what's the take aways?

-- The immobilizer on the T1N is an early generation one that does not use rolling codes
-- If you have access to a key machine the blank is readily cut (as it is not a side cut key)
-- For $35 you can own the cloning machine
-- For $6 a blank, you can make a copy that works.

Yes, I could've just gone to the locksmith, but now I've learned something new, and if I need to copy ANY chipped key that the cloner can handle, all I have to do is get a blank. It's a great feeling not to be leave yourself in the hands of the dealer or locksmith.
 
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autostaretx

Erratic Member
Re: DIY Cloned Keys

Here are his images, presented as in-line visible attachments:
(i've also made the non-functional IMG tags into URLs so that you can visit the original photos)
Then I stumbled on a chinese clone of a Turkish key cloner called the Zed-Bull.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/t4lidrfcu28ls80/Photo Jan 21, 7 23 19 PM.jpg
KeyCut0.jpg
Fortunately, because I have to copy keys for some rental properties, I have access to a Belsaw key cutter https://www.dropbox.com/s/gq4an966rtf6lzy/Photo Jan 21, 7 05 24 PM.jpg
KeyCut1.jpg

KeyCut2.jpg

(.... which looks like the previous photo, and i'm trying to keep within the forum's 5 photo limit)

Once the key was cut I tried it in the van and got the immobilizer starter error, which was expected.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/r54zvtas9.../u0nwhn2ui3njxke/Photo Jan 21, 7 24 03 PM.jpg
https://www.dropbox.com/s/3z3d64rs078400l/Photo Jan 21, 7 24 27 PM.jpg
Top image: original key, bottom image: 'virgin' blank:

KeyCut4a.jpg
Not surprising the transponder on the blank key was all zeros.
I then ran the key through the copying process.
Simply insert the original into the machine, press Copy. It will prompt you to press R to read
https://www.dropbox.com/s/hfm7jvx41fcsag7/Photo Jan 21, 8 01 13 PM.jpg
KeyCut6.jpg
Once done, the machine prompts you for the correct chip type, and to press W to write the key.
20 seconds later, voila, chip is copied.
I went back out to car and the car started!
--dick
 

Woodythesprinter

New member
Re: DIY Cloned Keys

Thank you so much for that! I will give it a try myself.

I got screwed up last year by the stealership.( Thinking it was the only way to make a copy )..They told me for 100$ they would get me a chipped key that was matching my VIN, so the chip was supposed to be already programmed. To my surprise, when I tried to start the van, the STRT ERR. appeared.

I went back back there to be told I had to pay 150$ more for chipping the key !! No reimbursement was possible ( I obviously did not want to pay that extra 150$ for a damned key..) That was my first and last experience with the dealer :).
 

FahrverSprinten

2004 NAFTA 2500
Many thanks to Boeingpilot for his pioneering work in sourcing cheap Sprinter keys! :bow:

Here is my experience:
My local stealership quoted me an astronomical sum for a new key. Claiming that according to my VIN only the fob was available, they wanted $365 for the fob itself, and another $200 for the programming. All based on bringing the van to them, along with ownership documantation. Including tax the total was $615! :wtf: Per key!:eek:

None of the ACE hardware stores in Seattle had the capability of cloning my key. Then I came across Boeingpilot's incredibly helpful post and followed his lead. Bought the zed-BULL Mini for $38 and two blank transponder keys for $13. A local locksmith charged me $20 to cut both. Total investment: $71, or $35.50 per key.:bounce:

When the cloner arrived I struggled to follow the directions for installing the software. The Chinese to English translation leaves something to be desired.:idunno: As it turns out, I needn't have bothered. The basic cloning operation works without the software or, indeed, any computer connection at all. :rad:

The cloning process is simplicity itself. Following the prompts the original key is read and the new keys written. The entire exercise took less than 5 minutes. See the photos in Boeingpilot's post.

Thanks again to Boeingpilot!
 
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ke4rop

New member
I am in the same situation with only one working key. I ordered the two chipped key blanks and the Zed-Bull programmer that were recommended. The programmer seems work just fine reading the old factory fob and writing the new blank key chips. The key blanks do fit into the lock cylinder before cutting. The problem has been getting the key blade cut. The first place, a big box store, said they couldn't duplicate that key. The second place, another big box store, made a very lame attempt that was obviously poorly cut and ruined one of the two blanks. The third place was a hardware store, which cut a key that looked sort of ok, but still wouldn't work and ruined the remaining blank. I did discover how to remove the chips from the blanks, so I may still be able to use the chip for another blank. Now I've ordered more blanks and will be looking for someone that can do a better job of key cutting. Boeingpilot seemed to be able to do it on a basic key cutting machine. Not sure what the secret is. Anyway, thanks to Boeingpilot for helping me get past the chip part of the key duplication.
 
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220629

Well-known member
... Not sure what the secret is.
...
Use a real locksmith. They may balk at using your blank if they stock them (unlikely), but they can cut a brass key on their machine. Maybe get an extra house key or two cut at the same time to make them more willing.

:cheers: vic
 

autostaretx

Erratic Member
Another trick is to have the cut performed using the *shoulder* of the original and new key as the "registration" for cutting the duplicate.

If you use the tip (lazy way), you'll end up with a key you have to "fondle" a bit (pull slightly out) to get it to turn in the lock.

KeyIlcoMB17.jpg

--dick
 

Garandman

Active member
We had two keys made locally for $65 each. However the blank material is not as strong as the OEM key. Are steel blanks available?
 

220629

Well-known member
... However the blank material is not as strong as the OEM key. Are steel blanks available?
Steel key blanks are available, but most locksmiths won't cut them because they are hard on the cutting wheels. The OEM steel keys are known to crack, so they aren't ideal either.

I agree that many of the replacement keys with chip holder are generally flimsy.

If you don't need the chip holder style key I find that the Ilco MB17 blanks are quite stout.

After using a lighter duty replacement key I went back to my Redneck MB17 Key that is sistered to the OEM head. Works great. It really doesn't look bad. If the key does break, a new key can easily be screwed on.

RedneckKeyTapped.jpg

https://sprinter-source.com/forum/showthread.php?p=155692#post155692

FWIW. vic
 
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doug022984

Sporadic Member Since 2015
I've asked this question before on here, but maybe with this new found device someone will know. Will this work on a key that already has its own code? In otherwords, I already have a key that I bought from the dealership that has its own code (presumably). Like others on here, I've refused to pay the additional $150+ that the dealer wants to program my van to accept this other key's code. Will this device be able to write the code from my one good key to this other key that already has a code? Or do only blanks that have 0000000 as their code accept a copy?
 

autostaretx

Erratic Member
I'm going to guess "probably not" ... in an OEM situation like MB's, they'll just buy a few thousand pre-programmed RFID chips and glue them into their keys, with the final "mating" being performed by telling the Sprinter's ECU/SKREEM to accept its bunch of keys. The chip they use is probably (i'm going to say 95% likely) *not* after-burnable.

For a burn-it-later key, there are additional components in the key which facilitate the "burning" of a clone. The original MB keys won't have those.

--dick (factory-programmed chips are really really cheap compared to burnables)
 

LS1K5

Member
I got a couple rfid blanks from Ebay and had them cut by my local locksmith but every locksmith here said that you cant just clone them, they are so wrong! I just bought the zed bull and did it in 5 minutes, now I have 3 keys that start my sprinter!

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk
 

Indysprinter

New member
My first post here. I followed the instructions of the OP and made a cloned key that starts my Sprinter.

My total investment was $36 for the Zed Bull, $16 for two programmable key blanks, and $60 for an old rusty Ilco Key machine that I got off Craigslist.

Literally 10 minutes after I opened the package for the Zed Bull, I had a newly cut key that starts the van. I didn't even have to open the instructions for the Zed Bull.

Thanks to the OP for the tip.
 

Boeingpilot

New member
I've asked this question before on here, but maybe with this new found device someone will know. Will this work on a key that already has its own code? In otherwords, I already have a key that I bought from the dealership that has its own code (presumably). Like others on here, I've refused to pay the additional $150+ that the dealer wants to program my van to accept this other key's code. Will this device be able to write the code from my one good key to this other key that already has a code? Or do only blanks that have 0000000 as their code accept a copy?
I think not.... I don't think those transponders are re-writable.
 

Boeingpilot

New member
My first post here. I followed the instructions of the OP and made a cloned key that starts my Sprinter.

My total investment was $36 for the Zed Bull, $16 for two programmable key blanks, and $60 for an old rusty Ilco Key machine that I got off Craigslist.

Literally 10 minutes after I opened the package for the Zed Bull, I had a newly cut key that starts the van. I didn't even have to open the instructions for the Zed Bull.

Thanks to the OP for the tip.
Glad this could help! You basically discovered what I did, that for the price of maybe one key from the dealer, you can buy all the equipment to do it, learn something, and have the tools to do more in the future.

In reality (IMHO) the whole immobilizer thing is the biggest scam that the automakers ever came up with. Obviously they can be hacked (what we're doing). So what is accomplished, just making it a pain to work on your own car. The dealership takes a 20 key, and then because of the paperwork at time to program the car makes a couple of bucks.

I've glad to see all the people on the list that have used my brief tutorial.
 

hepcat

Just an old guy...
I recently bought an '04 T1N, Airstream Interstate. It came with a single remote, switchblade key. I bought a couple of remotes from a vendor on eBay anticipating that they'd be re-programmable like every OTHER manufacturer's... after calling my local Dodge dealer to find out that a new remote key is $599.

I wrote MB to find out what their official line is:

"I have one more question about key remotes on my van... I bought two used key remotes with the same FCC ID number as the one for my van... can they be reprogrammed to work with my '04 Sprinter? I found a source for replacement key blades, and since they're side-cut that should be no problem, but can the chip and the RF portion for locking and unlocking be re-programmed and/or cloned from my existing, working key remote?

Thank you!"

And MB's response:

Dear Mr. ...,

Thank you for your contact. As this is a Dodge Sprinter, all key details would be answered by Dodge.

We can advise for any Mercedes Benz vehicle, keys can only be ordered and obtained from a parts advisor at the local dealership. Keys are unable to be programmed at the dealership. Keys are considered theft related parts and therefore require strict adherence to the ordering policy, along with proof of ownership and the vehicle presented to the dealership.

Dodge can be reached at 1-800-423-6343 or any of their dealerships.

Have an enjoyable day.

Kind Regards,

Debbie A.
Mercedes-Benz USA
(800) 367-6372"

Fortunately, I have a locksmith in a nearby city who can cut and clone the t-5 chipped keys available on eBay. I guess I'll sell the extra remote keys to a key fob wholesaler.
 

autostaretx

Erratic Member
I recently bought an '04 T1N, Airstream Interstate. It came with a single remote, switchblade key. I bought a couple of remotes from a vendor on eBay anticipating that they'd be re-programmable like every OTHER manufacturer's... after calling my local Dodge dealer to find out that a new remote key is $599.

I wrote MB to find out what their official line is:

"I have one more question about key remotes on my van... I bought two used key remotes with the same FCC ID number as the one for my van... can they be reprogrammed to work with my '04 Sprinter? I found a source for replacement key blades, and since they're side-cut that should be no problem, but can the chip and the RF portion for locking and unlocking be re-programmed and/or cloned from my existing, working key remote?
Sigh...

MB uses what's called a rolling-key algorithm for their remote entry.
That makes it pretty much impossible for thieves to simply "listen in" and replicate what your fob sent to try and open the door. Your fob only uses a code *once*, and the next transmission is totally different (but can be calculated by the SKREEM).

The FCC ID number says nothing other than "this transmitter design (the RF part, not the codes) has been registered with the FCC and meets certain design limits". ALL Sprinter keys bear the same FCC number.

Due to the rolling-key algorithm, if someone baps on your keys' buttons 256+ times without the Sprinter "hearing" any of them, that key will cease to open the doors (it will still run the car, since the RKE system is functionally separate from the RFID system).

In theory (back in the day), a Sprinter dealer *could* "resynchronize" such a 256+ fob back to "accepted".

Due to the Chrysler/MB fall-out, you're also facing that corporate hurdle. You're Dodge's baby, not MB's (just like recalls).

SOS Diagnostics can probably make your ECU/SKREEM properly respond to your set of new keys. sosdiagnostics.com ... ask them (i've never used them).

--dick
p.s. it is possible that a "smart" Dodge dealer could make your "new" keys work on your Sprinter.
But it may be against corporate policy (there's "could" and "will" with a canyon between)
p.p.s. whenever dealing with a "theft-related" component (such as the keys), bringing along "proof of ownership" when you visit the dealer avoids having to go back home to fetch them.
 
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