Battery Not Charging on Shore Power

Hi, all.

The house battery on our 2005 Pleasure-Way Plateau TS won't charge when on shore power; measuring the voltage at the battery shows 10.5 Volts, but I get 13.5 with the engine running. Any pointers on where I should look first (power converter, transfer switch, etc.) would be most highly appreciated. I've checked the fuses and circuit breakers at the power center, but all looks proper.

Best Regards,
Rob
 
Awesome - thanks! I didn't realize they had reset buttons on them (didn't even realize they were breakers, thought they were some kind of funky fuses) until I saw this thread:
https://sprinter-source.com/forum/showthread.php?t=40453

The one for the power sofa was tripped, and when I reset it everything was back to normal. I'm ecstatic that it seems to be fixed, but confused as to why the sofa breaker being tripped would drag down the whole system voltage.
 

WinnieView1

Well-known member
Awesome - thanks! I didn't realize they had reset buttons on them (didn't even realize they were breakers, thought they were some kind of funky fuses) until I saw this thread:
https://sprinter-source.com/forum/showthread.php?t=40453

The one for the power sofa was tripped, and when I reset it everything was back to normal. I'm ecstatic that it seems to be fixed, but confused as to why the sofa breaker being tripped would drag down the whole system voltage.
There could be some loose wiring connections within the circuit in question causing it to draw too much power when active.
 
Awesome - thanks! I didn't realize they had reset buttons on them (didn't even realize they were breakers, thought they were some kind of funky fuses) until I saw this thread:
https://sprinter-source.com/forum/showthread.php?t=40453

The one for the power sofa was tripped, and when I reset it everything was back to normal. I'm ecstatic that it seems to be fixed, but confused as to why the sofa breaker being tripped would drag down the whole system voltage.

Those are the DC breakers. It’s likely mislabeled and should be the converter breaker. I’ve run across one other Plateau that got the labels mixed up also, which is why in the other post I mentioned to reset them all. That’s the typical solution if the 12V system doesn’t work (with red key in and turned on) after unplugging or turning the generator off. Glad you got it fixed. :thumbup:
You might consider tracing the wires if you can (they’re well grouped in wire loom) and if the labels are in fact switched, correct them.
 
Those are the DC breakers. It’s likely mislabeled and should be the converter breaker. I’ve run across one other Plateau that got the labels mixed up also, which is why in the other post I mentioned to reset them all. That’s the typical solution if the 12V system doesn’t work (with red key in and turned on) after unplugging or turning the generator off. Glad you got it fixed. :thumbup:
You might consider tracing the wires if you can (they’re well grouped in wire loom) and if the labels are in fact switched, correct them.
The other confusing thing is that the sofa continued working while the breaker was tripped, and I was still getting 10.5 Volts from the converter, so something is definitely fishy. Also, running off the generator made no difference to the system voltage - it was still 10.5V when on shore power or generator power, but 13.5V with the engine running.

But thank you all for your assistance - I am most grateful!
 
The other confusing thing is that the sofa continued working while the breaker was tripped, and I was still getting 10.5 Volts from the converter, so something is definitely fishy. Also, running off the generator made no difference to the system voltage - it was still 10.5V when on shore power or generator power, but 13.5V with the engine running.

But thank you all for your assistance - I am most grateful!
The sofa is hardwired to the batteries directly. It does not go through the red key disconnect like everything else.
The alternator will still charge the batteries even if the converter breaker is tripped. It just stops the usage of the batteries for all but the sofa.
The converter should be putting out way more than 10.5V, so you were probably measuring the battery, not the converter output.
If your batteries are that low, I’d suggest you plug in for a week or so to give the batteries a change to recharge fully and deeply. Note if you need to reset the breaker after plugging in, go for a drive and let the alternator bring the batteries up to an acceptable level and then plug in and let the converter take over from there. The breaker is just 30A and the converter is 45A and if the battery is so low, the converter tries to give it all its got which is over the breaker limit.
I hope this makes sense.
 

autostaretx

Erratic Member
That circuit breaker for the sofa keeps tripping. Any idea what could be causing it?
I'm just watching from the side here, but as bl_smith wrote:
the label on the breaker may be *wrong*.

It could really be your generator-to-charger breaker.

Does the breaker trip only when you *run* the sofa, or all by itself?
Is the breaker tripping only when the generator is running?
Is the breaker tripping only when shore power is available?

What current rating is the tripping breaker?

A photo of your breaker panel would help other Pleasure-way owners perhaps figure out what's happening.

"Too much" info is far better (for remote diagnosis) than "too little" or "reduced to minimum".

As bl_smith wrote: if your house batteries are down to 10.5 volts, find *some other way* (separate wall-powered charger with battery clamps?) to charge them to "near or above" 12v to avoid overloading the built-in charging system. (which trips its breakers). A "trickle charger" overnight won't do it ... you'd need at least a 10 amp capable charger, preferably higher. For many many hours.

--dick
 
It pops both on shore power and generator power, and when it pops I get no charging to the aux battery. It trips all by itself, never when operating the sofa. I'll see if I can scare up a charger. Should I disconnect from shore power while it's on the other charger? See attached photo.
 

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autostaretx

Erratic Member
It pops both on shore power and generator power, and when it pops I get no charging to the aux battery. It trips all by itself, never when operating the sofa. I'll see if I can scare up a charger. Should I disconnect from shore power while it's on the other charger? See attached photo.
So before it pops the batteries *are* charging from shore (and/or generator) power?

If so, that would certainly support the idea that it's really the charging breaker.

(i wonder if the sofa would stop if you disabled the "power converter" breaker?)

If you're using an "external" charger, it would (of course) be safest to disconnect the PleasureWay's shore power, and discontinue using any loads until the charging is completed.

(or only externally charge it after the breaker has popped, if you need to maintain 120vac power in the rest of the van)

Crawling around with a voltmeter would be more informative ... and/or having a wiring diagram and chasing down "which red wire goes where" (tedious, but informative) and then labeling the wires themselves.

--dick
 
The one labelled sofa is really the converter. It’s the converter breaker that is tripping, not the sofa, which is why when you run the sofa, it’s not related. Switch the labels so they’re correct. Looking at your photo, it’s easy to have gotten the two mislabeled.
The converter breaker is tripping because the current needed to charge your battery is overloading the circuit. Your battery must be really low still, which is why I mentioned above to go for a drive for a bit to charge it using the alternator before finishing it off with shore power.
This leads to another question. What is the status of your battery? How old is it and do you have any issues with it holding a charge? I hope it’s an AGM since it’s in the living quarters and what is it’s state of charge?
Also, you may want to check your shore power cord ends to ensure there are no burn marks as well as the input to the van. If any connections have worked themselves loose, there could be issues there that the breaker is protecting you from.
 
We're camping this weekend at Watkins Glen for the NASCAR race, so please forgive the delays in my responses.

It's a five-hour drive at Interstate speeds to get here from where we live in South Jersey, so the battery should have gotten an excellent charge on Wednesday, but the breaker popping started immediately after we arrived.

We've only had the rig since October, so the battery predates our ownership, but I recall back when we bought it that the dealer said it just had a new battery, and the visual condition of the battery supports it being new. It's a standard lead-acid deep-cycle marine battery. It's difficult to tell whether it's holding a charge, but it does have enough juice to keep the water pump running through the night for the toilet, but the gauge quickly drops to "Low" as soon as I pull it off the generator or shore power. I don't have a proper charger with me - just a Battery Tender that puts out only 1.25 Amps, so I'm running that instead of the on-board charger.

What part(s) of the passenger seat needs to come off to gain access to the battery? Is there a trick to it?
 

brassarl

2006 T1N 2500 Long & Tall
My suggestion would be to call Pleasure Way directly and ask them. I've called them a few times and found them extremely helpful and knowledgeable service department.

Lou
 

autostaretx

Erratic Member
Just as a question: can you squint hard and verify what amperage the *breaker itself* thinks it is?

If they're mis-labeled, they could also be mis-placed ... you may have the 20 amp "sofa" breaker trying to handle the 30 amp charging duties.

In which case, i'd swap the breakers (or parallel the popped breaker with another 30 amp breaker... this would be a test of good/bad breaker, too). Note that i'm suggesting doing the parallel hookup with the existing breaker popped ... if you paralleled it when it's closed (not popped), you'd be creating a 50 or 60-amp capable link, which wouldn't provide the protection you want.

--dick
 
When I got home last night after the five hour drive, I measured the aux battery at 12.6 Volts; this morning I only get 10.8 Volts after it sitting all night with nothing running, so it looks like the battery isn't holding a charge. We did get some receipts when we purchased the rig and one of them was for a NAPA 7549 battery dated 12 May 2016, so it's not terribly old.

Can anyone point me to a thread about the best way to remove the battery so I can take it to be tested?

I'd also be looking for recommendations on a replacement that will give us the most capacity without having to make any alterations or modifications to the camper.
 

autostaretx

Erratic Member
I'm always suspicious that there's an undiscovered load draining a battery.
Things like the isolation relays welding shut (so they don't isolate), gadgets like propane monitors that skirt the shut-offs "for safety" (since you want to KNOW about a gas leak).

To verify there's no load, things like a clamp-on ammeter allow measuring currents without disconnecting any wires ... their sensor just grabs around the wire:



Some battery shops (like Batteries Plus) will do reasonable amounts of extraction/replacement for you.

The fact that you drop almost precisely 2.0 volts is a hint that one cell is internally short-circuiting ... which can happen if they get low on water and then are subjected to heavy loads (or charging current) ... which can heat and warp the cell's plates.
(that's one of the reasons AGM batteries have their Absorbent Glass Mats.. the mat serves as a separator between plates.)

--dick
 
Well, for starters on your rig, the battery is supposed to be an AGM battery. If it’s not, make sure your replacement is because it’s deemed to be inside the living quarters. If it’s under the seat, the seat will need to be removed to get it out. If it’s in one of the other locations, it should be pretty straight forward to remove it. Even a new battery can be bad so if you have a receipt for it, see if you can get a credit and put towards an AGM. You should be able to get a Deka or similar group 49 under the seat. Other locations will have a smaller one. Anyways, match the size and get the biggest one that will fit in the space. It’s not convenient under the seat to have to water a battery periodically to keep it going and you don’t want explosive hydrogen gasses venting into your living quarters while you have propane igniting in the same space.
Make sure your detectors are all up to date and working too. Not just the light is on. They have a lifespan of 5 years so if they’re older than that, get new ones. The dates will be listed on them - either front or back.
 
I wanted to thank all of you for your input on this; just to tie everything up, it was in fact a bad battery with a shorted cell. The old battery still had some warranty left on it, so I replaced it with an identical NAPA #7549. The passenger seat needs to come out to access the battery, and I took plenty of photos along the way in case anyone thinks it's worthy of a write-up.

Best Regards,
Rob
 

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