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Old 11-04-2017, 10:31 PM   #21
OldWest
T1N Westfalia
 
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Default Re: Need to borrow a digi controller

Kiltym:

Operating at high continuously is tough unless you open windows (Westfalia tried to help by not installing much insulation), raise the thermostat temperature, etc.

The three times per 24 hour period might help but even within each 2 hour operating period, heater does not operate on high the entire time (doesn't need to as cabin is heated up so fast).

Plus, the heater is really noisy at high.

That's why non-Westy DIY conversion-owners are using the snaller Espar D2 heater so the smaller heater runs longer at higher output.

Also, one should supposedly run the heater at high periodically for awhile, especially on kerosene. Could set the temp to 99, open the doors and windows, and run off kerosene for an hour or more. Don't remember suggested interval--do once a month?

Robert:

While you're fiddling around with heater, note thar OneManVan and LindenEngineering found the wiring for fuel pump/heater was too thin so too much voltage drop. Better to have heavier gauge wiring (double up on wiring). Maybe OneManVan can post.which wire to.double-up.

Also, LindenEngineering changed out the Espar for Webasto for a Westy owner. Other James Cook Friends Forum folks have also switched to Webasto. Some think Webasto is more reliable but others will take the opposite position.

Last edited by OldWest; 11-04-2017 at 10:37 PM. Reason: Add info
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Old 11-04-2017, 10:37 PM   #22
onemanvan
 
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Default Re: Need to borrow a digi controller

To operate the Espar in a simple on/off mode IE: Like a conventional thermostat controlled furnace:

1) leave power wires connected B+ & B- IE: red and brown
2) disconnect temperature control wires IE: grey, grey/red & blue/white ( diagnostic )
3) connect yellow wire ( call for heat ) to conventional thermostat

When 12 volts is applied to the yellow wire via tstat the Espar will turn on and run at medium high heat until tstat reaches desired temp.

Conventional tstat: http://a.co/cKnoTPh

Last edited by onemanvan; 11-05-2017 at 02:24 AM.
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Old 11-05-2017, 02:23 PM   #23
Wasaabi
 
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Default Re: Need to borrow a digi controller

The Digi-Max 1000 has a wider spread of temps. In use, that means it will cool down quite a bit, then run till things are quite toasty. I think it is somewhere around 10 degrees. It is less comfortable than the Westfalia control panel approach, but prevents the build-up in the combustion chamber. This should be something that could be replicated with a self-powered digital thermostat that allows custom settings for trigger point. Search for posts by PNWSquid to see what he used (also has remote ability to pre-warm Westy via cell phone).
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Old 11-05-2017, 02:47 PM   #24
onemanvan
 
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Default Re: Need to borrow a digi controller

Waasabi - thanks for the update RE: wide temp swings with the Digi-Max. I had heard rumors that was the case - good to hear first hand feedback confirming this deficiency.

I agree the Digi-Max functionality could be replicated with a basic thermostat. While I may not have made that clear - that was in fact the intent of my post.

The link I provided is for a basic thermostat with a programmable setting for operating differential +/- 1 to 3 degrees Fahrenheit. This tstat was previously sold under the Hunter brand name. I have used them for many years and find them to be very reliable. The AA batteries that power the Hunter tstat last for more than a year - that older model did not have a backlight - so the newer model with backlight might burn through batteries faster...

FWIW: There are many different Eberspacher controllers - some additional info can be found via these links:

https://www.letonkinoisvarnish.co.uk...Control_1.html
https://www.letonkinoisvarnish.co.uk...er_Sensor.html
https://www.letonkinoisvarnish.co.uk..._Wiring_1.html

Note ( excerpt from the sensor webpage ):

Eberspacher documents say Airtronic heaters will maintain a temperature within approximately 4C (7F) of the desired heat comfort level by regulating between Power, High, Medium or Low heat output. Should the temperature rise above the desired heat comfort level by 2C or more, it will then switch itself off until the air temperature drops down by approximately 4C. Assuming the 4C quoted is from the switch off and not from the comfort level temperature the temperature can change by 4C from when the heater switches off to when the heater is restarted. I am more familiar with temperatures in Fahrenheit, if it switches off at 70F it might be 63F before it restarts, distinctly chilly! This poor temperature control will not be changed by fitting a remote sensor.

----------------------------------------

One additional note regarding internal vs external temperature sensor... When the D2/D4 Airtronic is controlled via the internal temperature sensor the fan must run continuously. In this way cabin air continuously circulates through the heater - thereby allowing the internal temperature sensor to indirectly monitor the cabin air temperature.

Last edited by onemanvan; 11-05-2017 at 04:16 PM.
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Old Today, 05:12 AM   #25
512Westy
 
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Default Re: Need to borrow a digi controller

Time for an update on our Airtronics problem.
I bought a Digi-Max and wired it up and confirmed that my early issue Westy's (#17) Espar is not compatible with the Digi-Max. So wasted the $100 but if anyone wants a new Digi-Max, give me a call. Many ThermoKing franchises seem to represent the Espar products and I was able to show up at the franchise in Austin, rig my heater there on the asphalt, which I had already removed from the van, jumpered the various appropriate wires, and connected the fuel line, and the ThermoKing tech brought out his laptop with the EDITH diagnostic software program, and was able to read and reset the faults that had locked out the heater. Faults were due to overheating. So now the heater is back in working order.

It seems like overheating has not been a common problem reported in this forum. Lockout issues seem to be discussed with regards to false starts. But Espar advised that 3 consecutive overheating faults will lock out the heater. So my efforts to prevent overheating in the future consist of the following:
1. Re-installed the high altitude fuel pump to provide 15% less fuel, and less BTU's when running
2. ALWAYS open the louver on the bathroom heater vent to reduce back pressure on the supply side ductwork and allow better air flow across the heat exchanger.
3. run the heater in 10 degree increments and allow it to recover to slower speed before moving it up to 10 degrees warmer, rather than it running for 20 or 30 mins full blast.
4. pull the fuse after every other time running the heater to break the possibility of 3 consecutive faults occurring. This last one is possibly over reaction but it cost $140 for the guy to just walk out, sit down next to me, plug the laptop in and reset the codes. Such a pain that I don't want to have to do this again.

These methods have proven effective over the 6 day run from Austin to Bend. Nice to have heat!!!

Does anyone know where I can buy a version of the EDITH software?
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Old Today, 03:06 PM   #26
Wasaabi
 
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Default Re: Need to borrow a digi controller

512Westy, thanks for the tip about the bathroom vent. We have closed that sometimes and haven't yet experienced the overheating, but it's a good point. Since you now have a (useless) Digimax, you might consider, depending on budget, swapping the ECU to a compatible one. A bit costly but some have found deals on them. Then you would have the ability to reset and view diagnostics easily while traveling. Heat being crucial, it provides some peace of mind.
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Old Today, 05:59 PM   #27
OldWest
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Default Re: Need to borrow a digi controller

1. EDITH for Sale

http://www.lubricationspecialist.com...stic-software/

One fuzzy thing is whether the Westfalia version of EDITH, which the Airstream Service Center in Ohio has/uses, is any different than the standard EDITH.

2. New ECU

Wasaabi mentioned before that the new ECU is NOT compatible with the central computer console. Westfalia apparently had a custom ECU which communicates with the central computer console. So it's probably either central computer console or new ECU and DigiMax.

3 Obstruction

The Espar heater has some type of way to tell if the output is obstructed and will turn off. Our heater is supposed to be a supercharged one for longer ductwork. So leaving bathroom duct louvers open may be a good idea.

4. Alternatives

A. Replace with Espar D2

May try replacing with smaller D2 heater. Issues include no central computer console, different fit inside metal box, longer air duct an issue?, etc.

B. Webasto

Several folks on James Cook Friends forum have switched to a Webasto. Some Westy owner (unknown) had LindenEngineering replace their Espar with a Webasto. Dennis at LindenEngineering pointed out the Espar voltage drop in thin wires like OneManVan fixed. Dennis also posted that he found Webasto to be more reliable.

Last edited by OldWest; Today at 06:15 PM. Reason: Add #3, #4.
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