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Old 02-06-2019, 09:30 PM   #21
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Default Re: T1N Sprinter in the snow-traction question?

Funny thing about chains is they actually help while still in the bag in your trunk, because of weight. I dunno maybe that isn’t funny. I blew out my back and I’m on pain killers. I’ll have to consider the socks for my dually. They don’t make sense, but they sure seem to work.
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Old 02-13-2019, 01:56 PM   #22
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Default Re: T1N Sprinter in the snow-traction question?

Hey everyone,
Northern Wisconsin just broke all time record for a one day snowfall that has lasted 110 years.
Fortunately two days earlier I was able to start my Sprinter and make an escape down my plowed driveway.

First of all I plugged the engine in and it started easily(like summer day).
Tires-All season radials at 35-40 psi. No other traction aids. Van mostly empty.

Once warmed up I was able to back up and down a slight off camber hill to get pointed out. I clicked the ARS off and used a little throttle, wheel spin immediately.
Oh ****!
Flipped the ARS on and gave the engine light throttle.
Amazingly and slowly the van pulled itself up on to level ground. Absolutely no wheel spin.

Now very happy and much more confident I headed out my plowed driveway with ARS engaged. No wheel spin except at the very steepest part of the steep hill and at the top only. I had good momentum and just sailed up around a sharp corner and through. It felt a little magical.

Now if someone would post a simple explanation of how the ARS works I would be most appreciative.
ASR-Acceleration Skid Control.

This is what my Owners manual says,"ARS makes it possible to pull away and accelerate on a slippery surface. The spinning wheel is braked and its tractive power is transfered to the wheel with full grip." "If the road surface is not capable of providing traction, bearing in mind the tires, load and grade, it may not be possible to pull away even with ASR."

Anyone care to share real life experiences on ice and snow(not mud or gravel, lets save that).

bill
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Old 02-13-2019, 04:33 PM   #23
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Default Re: T1N Sprinter in the snow-traction question?

ASR is from the German: Antriebsschlupfregelung, lit. 'engine slippage regulation' and is the throttle/power reduction component of the traction control system. The system uses the ABS pump to apply brakes to a spinning wheel, which transfers torque across the differential to the other wheel. If that wheel also spins, it reduces engine power so that the axle can find traction, and will eventually switch braking to the other wheel to look for traction.
Last winter I climbed up a slippery hard-packed hill at a CRAWL (“Dad, we’re going slower than a wounded snail...” said my helpful son ;-) and watched in the mirrors as the system alternately spun the left wheel, then the right wheel, creeping forward a few inches each cycle. I was impressed. Chains would have been the real answer, of course, but the system managed the available traction well. It was icy cold so brake temp was not an issue, but could have become one under different conditions.

The Electronic Stability control uses an accelerometer bolted under the driver’s seat to monitor the van’s motion, and will apply brakes to counter sudden yaw/looseness that don’t match the measured steering input. I have certainly felt it kicking in on slippery offramps to counter the back end trying to swing out, and I have suspected it of going active to correct understeer (“pushing”) into corners but haven’t been on the brake pedal to feel the pulses that accompany its interventions.

The Antilock Brake System program is the grand-daddy of all of these, and uses rotation speed sensors on each wheel to detect wheel lock associated with a skid, and runs a pump to release the individual brake to maintain wheel rotation and steering control. Early systems were relatively dumb, becoming confused by very low traction and allowing 4-wheel lockups on ice, but later systems have added accelerometers and better “plausibility” checks into their programming, and now manage threshold braking better than most drivers could ever hope to.

The logical progression of all this technology is now reaching the market, with systems that use forward-facing sensors and image processing to track objects near the vehicle’s path, measure relative velocities, detect interference events, then send the driver a text message to put down their damned phone and watch where they’re going!

-dave
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Old 02-13-2019, 04:57 PM   #24
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Default Re: T1N Sprinter in the snow-traction question?

Quote:
Originally Posted by billintomahawk
Now if someone would post a simple explanation of how the ARS works I would be most appreciative.
ASR-Acceleration Skid Control
The "what's happening inside the beast" is described on pages 107ASRsm.jpg through 109ASRoff.jpg in the service_scans folder.
That's a sub-set of the broader ABS through ESP pages: 098ABSinfo.jpg through 113ESPdescript.jpg, with the ESP continuing from page 126 through 137.

--dick
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Old 02-13-2019, 05:00 PM   #25
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Default Re: T1N Sprinter in the snow-traction question?

The ESP traction control system includes ABS, stability control, anti skid, brake force assist and several other features. ASR (part of ESP program) will cut the throttle to limit wheelspin, and reduce the chance of a spin out or skid. Pushing the ASR button on the dash disables the throttle reduction feature of ASR (up to about 30-40mph). This allows wheelspin (traction control braking still occurs). Wheelspin is often necessary for forward traction on loose surfaces.

ABS only vans still have ASR, but don't have stability control and rollover protection.
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Last edited by Midwestdrifter; 02-13-2019 at 05:25 PM.
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Old 02-13-2019, 08:00 PM   #26
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Default Re: T1N Sprinter in the snow-traction question?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nautamaran View Post
The logical progression of all this technology is now reaching the market, with systems that use forward-facing sensors and image processing to track objects near the vehicle’s path, measure relative velocities, detect interference events, then send the driver a text message to put down their damned phone and watch where they’re going!

-dave
Hey Dave- have you seen this?

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Old 02-13-2019, 08:33 PM   #27
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Default Re: T1N Sprinter in the snow-traction question?

No, I hadn't. THAT's pretty cool!

-dave
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Old 02-13-2019, 08:41 PM   #28
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Default Re: T1N Sprinter in the snow-traction question?

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No, I hadn't. THAT's pretty cool!

-dave
I have been told that U.S.-spec BMWs equipped with the robotized headlights (like my wife's F-22 Track Pack car), already have everything it takes to enable all those functions, but that U.S. law does not allow those functions to be enabled. I have read that some people claim to have been able to enable those functions in their U.S.-spec cars.

I think it's cool that it can track multiple bogeys, traveling in multiple directions, even around corners, and still be able to do everything that it does.
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Old 02-13-2019, 08:57 PM   #29
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Default Re: T1N Sprinter in the snow-traction question?

But does it take pre-emptive action on the diffused glare (and/or illuminated trees) of a car *about* to crest the hill in front of you?

Or does it wait until it sees the oncoming headlights (which means the driver's eyes have been blinded between the time the windshield crested the hill and their headlights crested the hill?

The video (at the end) showed such a "latent" adjustment of the tunnel ... it only took action when the oncoming car's headlamps were clearly visible.

--dick
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Get YOUR Sprinter's full configuration datacard by entering your VIN to https://www.datamb.com/
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Old 02-13-2019, 09:13 PM   #30
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Default Re: T1N Sprinter in the snow-traction question?

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Originally Posted by autostaretx View Post
But does it take pre-emptive action on the diffused glare (and/or illuminated trees) of a car *about* to crest the hill in front of you?

Or does it wait until it sees the oncoming headlights (which means the driver's eyes have been blinded between the time the windshield crested the hill and their headlights crested the hill?

The video (at the end) showed such a "latent" adjustment of the tunnel ... it only took action when the oncoming car's headlamps were clearly visible.

--dick
Given the number of people who don't dim their headlights at all, I think it shows potential.
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