Sprinter-Forum    
 

Go Back   Sprinter-Forum > T1N Sprinters > T1N Database

T1N Database Reference Information, Part Numbers, Recalls, TSBs, and etc.


Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 03-15-2015, 12:25 PM   #11
Aqua Puttana
Poly - Thread Finder
 
Aqua Puttana's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: The Falls of Niagara, USA
Posts: 20,468
Thanks: 10,024
Thanked 10,867 Times in 6,975 Posts
Default Re: Some 2004 Espar Heater Notes

I've noticed some comments about the dash temperature settings being related to the Booster Heater and Aux Heater operating. To my knowledge the Espar doesn't care what positions that the OEM Cabin fan/heater controls are in.

Once the Espar heaters are enabled and fired up the temperature control is maintained by a coolant temperature sensor contained within the Espar heater module. Given proper coolant circulation the heater will run until the coolant temperature reaches setpoint.

There are 2 ea. control setpoints. The first lower temperature will trigger the Espar to go to low power output. The higher (167F if memory serves) will trigger a shutdown of all firing. There is an even higher over-temperature limit, but that shouldn't come into play when proper coolant circulation is maintained.

Except for the Espar dedicated dash controls, the OEM cabin temperature controls do not affect the Espar operation once it is enabled.

vic
__________________
DAD NAS (N. Amer. Spec) 2004 140 2500 >320,000+ mi. Arctic Whitewash Brush-tone Grey
2006 Freightliner 140 2500HC >162,500+ mi. Arctic Whitewash (Spotted Snow Leopard accents)
"My opinion and worth everything you'll never pay for it." assumed.
Anyone can hold the helm when the sea is calm. Publilius Syrus
"There are only 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't." HaWiiLuVeR
Some people have 10 years experience, others just 1 year 10 times.

Last edited by Aqua Puttana; 03-15-2015 at 12:28 PM.
Aqua Puttana is offline  
Old 03-18-2015, 10:17 PM   #12
Aqua Puttana
Poly - Thread Finder
 
Aqua Puttana's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: The Falls of Niagara, USA
Posts: 20,468
Thanks: 10,024
Thanked 10,867 Times in 6,975 Posts
Default Re: Some 2004 Espar Heater Notes

1/4 tank Espar Disable

I have seen quite a few references to the "1/4 tank or more" for the Espar to run. Yesterday I used my Booster Heater for the first time since returning from Florida. With well below 1/4 tank showing on the gauge I could hear the heater blasting happily along until it suddenly stopped. At the same time my low fuel warning light came on. The engine temperature was below 145F by the OEM dash gauge so not hot enough to shut down the Espar.

My conclusion.

The T1N low fuel light logic is what triggers the Espar disable for low fuel. It makes sense to use an already established low fuel circuit. I've found nothing in the schematics which shows any reference to a 1/4 tank signal. The "Above a 1/4 tank" in any documentation is probably just an easy reference.

vic
__________________
DAD NAS (N. Amer. Spec) 2004 140 2500 >320,000+ mi. Arctic Whitewash Brush-tone Grey
2006 Freightliner 140 2500HC >162,500+ mi. Arctic Whitewash (Spotted Snow Leopard accents)
"My opinion and worth everything you'll never pay for it." assumed.
Anyone can hold the helm when the sea is calm. Publilius Syrus
"There are only 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't." HaWiiLuVeR
Some people have 10 years experience, others just 1 year 10 times.
Aqua Puttana is offline  
The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Aqua Puttana For This Useful Post:
Goofy foot (08-19-2017), Jonny Cut Corners (12-01-2017), Oilburner (03-19-2015), seans (07-28-2015)
Old 12-07-2015, 04:16 PM   #13
Aqua Puttana
Poly - Thread Finder
 
Aqua Puttana's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: The Falls of Niagara, USA
Posts: 20,468
Thanks: 10,024
Thanked 10,867 Times in 6,975 Posts
Default Re: Some 2004 Espar Heater Notes

January 19, 2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aqua Puttana View Post
I believe that now I have enough information to end my recent obsession with all things Espar in my 2004. (Just my latest obsession of many?)

The Booster heater is working fine. It is wired to pre-heat the engine. I know what specific burner part number will work.
...
2 seasons of successful operation on my Espar heater since my repairs.

Yesterday I removed my heater for general cleaning. It was smoking out the muffler a bit more than usual at startup. I thought that maybe the screen on the D shaped igniter hole had plugged a bit with soot.

Actually there was little soot. I flushed it well with carburetor cleaner as to not disturb the metering screen assembly and re-assembled the heater. A bit less smoke now on startup, but not as little as I recall before. Maybe my memory is optimistic as to how much smoke there was?

Some comments.

In 2015 I repaired the burner screen which I dug out/damaged. I did that by pushing a bit of asbestos cloth yarn up into where the screen terminated in the fuel supply. The asbestos fiber acts like a wick to meter the fuel down on to a fairly coarse nickel screen which I put over it to hold the fiber in place.

The wick and screen looked fine after 2 seasons. There was a bit of soot that easily flushed off the screen by using carburetor cleaner. I really didn't want to disturb my repair at all in case by dumb luck I hit the Goldilocks Zone "just right" combination when I installed the fibers and screen.

The main burner, glow pin, and flame sensor didn't have any real buildup of soot at all. It all appeared generally clean. I didn't disturb the burner coolant chamber O-ring seal. I was able to re-use the graphite composition burner gasket.

Even though I used anti-seize compounds on the screws, some had corroded to the point of being immovable. The one was on the top cover which protects the heat sensors. I deemed that of no real consequence because my warped cover already needed some sealant anyway.

The other was the short screw which locks the burner to the exhaust port. After trying many different removal methods I just drilled that one out. It also was deemed not worth replacing. The other 3 screws will hold that assembly together well enough.

So... if you live in the ugly road salt Northeast it may be worthwhile to open your heater up for cleaning every 2 seasons or so. That may help with keeping fasteners from seizing up.

The anti-seize which I used on the aluminum intake tube allowed that to be removed without issue. The ss exhaust tube was stuck a bit even after using anti-seize, but came off intact with some patient slight twisting and moving about. (The exhaust pipe retaining screw doesn't line up and hasn't been installed for a couple years now.)


vic
__________________
DAD NAS (N. Amer. Spec) 2004 140 2500 >320,000+ mi. Arctic Whitewash Brush-tone Grey
2006 Freightliner 140 2500HC >162,500+ mi. Arctic Whitewash (Spotted Snow Leopard accents)
"My opinion and worth everything you'll never pay for it." assumed.
Anyone can hold the helm when the sea is calm. Publilius Syrus
"There are only 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't." HaWiiLuVeR
Some people have 10 years experience, others just 1 year 10 times.

Last edited by Aqua Puttana; 01-16-2016 at 12:35 PM.
Aqua Puttana is offline  
Old 01-18-2016, 12:59 PM   #14
Aqua Puttana
Poly - Thread Finder
 
Aqua Puttana's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: The Falls of Niagara, USA
Posts: 20,468
Thanks: 10,024
Thanked 10,867 Times in 6,975 Posts
Default Re: Some 2004 Espar Heater Notes

Some general information for the Espar heaters.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aqua Puttana View Post
All this information is out in other threads. I am repeating. A search can be your friend.

The basic Espar heaters are a small self contained oil burner furnace as to firing. The heaters can be installed stand alone in boats and vehicles. The little furnace has a built in combustion control module for the ignition, blower speed, flame monitoring, operating temperature control, and overtemp safety monitor.

To just fire up, the Espar furnace needs a fuel supply (pulse pump), combustion air (internal fan), and an ignition source (glow pin). The native combustion controls are just sitting there waiting for your Sprinter to wake it up properly.

The basic external requirements to fire up are:

Constant 12 volts to pin #1.
A proper negative ground connection pin #2.
A connection (wire) out to the dosing pump pin #4 (It is a conditioned signal. Not just 12 VDC.).
A 12 volt enable signal to pin #6.
A 12 volt enable signal to pin #7.

Pin #5 is for communication. It is not required.

The circulation pump is not required for the heater to fire up. The Espar control has no idea what the MB aux electric coolant pump is doing, or not doing until the heater goes to over-temperature. Without proper coolant circulation the Espar heater will shut down on overtemp safety in a short time.

The Espar heater does run through an internal system check before firing. If there is a problem with the glow pin, flame sensor, blower, etc, then that will prevent the Espar heater from getting to startup. (There may also be some sort of verification for an external relay component. I say that because there have been reports of the Sprinter Espar throwing a coolant pump code failure. That is even though the MB Aux Electric Coolant Pump has no connection to the native Espar controls. The Aux Espar with two electrical connectors may have a direct connection.)

Here is a basic diagram.

10.3.3 Booster.JPG


Added: As Vanski pointed out, the Espar coolant type heaters can even be test fired with no coolant. I wouldn't allow it to run for more than a very short time without coolant though. It will very quickly over heat and stress components.

vic
__________________
DAD NAS (N. Amer. Spec) 2004 140 2500 >320,000+ mi. Arctic Whitewash Brush-tone Grey
2006 Freightliner 140 2500HC >162,500+ mi. Arctic Whitewash (Spotted Snow Leopard accents)
"My opinion and worth everything you'll never pay for it." assumed.
Anyone can hold the helm when the sea is calm. Publilius Syrus
"There are only 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't." HaWiiLuVeR
Some people have 10 years experience, others just 1 year 10 times.

Last edited by Aqua Puttana; 11-19-2016 at 01:20 PM.
Aqua Puttana is offline  
Old 01-19-2016, 06:26 PM   #15
Aqua Puttana
Poly - Thread Finder
 
Aqua Puttana's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: The Falls of Niagara, USA
Posts: 20,468
Thanks: 10,024
Thanked 10,867 Times in 6,975 Posts
Default Re: Some 2004 Espar Heater Notes

Program Timer

I found this guy's comments helped me to easily operate and program my Espar timer.



RESET METHOD
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aqua Puttana View Post
Apparently a reset can be accomplished without a scan tool or control head communication. Thanks goes to SkyGypsy.


Quote:
Originally Posted by SkyGypsy View Post
If the unit doesn't start, then you can clear and reset the unit by powering it up, then pulling the fuses underneath the driver seat. I have done this several times and gone from no response to startup in moments.

I have done a full overhaul on my unit. I should post a write up on it. I have the factory manual, maybe I will post it on my website for others to download.
I have not tried the above.

vic
__________________
DAD NAS (N. Amer. Spec) 2004 140 2500 >320,000+ mi. Arctic Whitewash Brush-tone Grey
2006 Freightliner 140 2500HC >162,500+ mi. Arctic Whitewash (Spotted Snow Leopard accents)
"My opinion and worth everything you'll never pay for it." assumed.
Anyone can hold the helm when the sea is calm. Publilius Syrus
"There are only 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't." HaWiiLuVeR
Some people have 10 years experience, others just 1 year 10 times.

Last edited by Aqua Puttana; 10-29-2017 at 04:32 PM.
Aqua Puttana is offline  
Old 11-18-2016, 12:35 PM   #16
Aqua Puttana
Poly - Thread Finder
 
Aqua Puttana's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: The Falls of Niagara, USA
Posts: 20,468
Thanks: 10,024
Thanked 10,867 Times in 6,975 Posts
Default Re: Some 2004 Espar Heater Notes

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aqua Puttana View Post
...

Note: One expert I've communicated with warned that Bio-fuel is a problem with the Espar heaters. He even cautions against 5% and suggests installing a "Day Tank" and running the heaters on Kerosene. I can't disagree, but installing a day tank with easy fill capability is likely easier said than done. He mentioned that a coffee colored residue which is harder to clean than the normal black soot is one evidence of bio-fuel rlated problems. ...
I was recently made aware that the NAS aka NAFTA T1N models have the fuel fill body metal chamber on the passenger side. Thanks Dick.

That area may provide a place to add a fill port to an Espar day tank mounted under the Sprinter.

Another use for that chamber might be for an external potable water fill port.

vic

Some possible parts.
http://www.discountskitubesandgear.c.../?locale=en_au

https://www.starmarinedepot.com/whit...s/pzz4528.html
__________________
DAD NAS (N. Amer. Spec) 2004 140 2500 >320,000+ mi. Arctic Whitewash Brush-tone Grey
2006 Freightliner 140 2500HC >162,500+ mi. Arctic Whitewash (Spotted Snow Leopard accents)
"My opinion and worth everything you'll never pay for it." assumed.
Anyone can hold the helm when the sea is calm. Publilius Syrus
"There are only 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't." HaWiiLuVeR
Some people have 10 years experience, others just 1 year 10 times.

Last edited by Aqua Puttana; 12-29-2017 at 12:59 PM.
Aqua Puttana is offline  
Old 11-19-2016, 01:39 PM   #17
Aqua Puttana
Poly - Thread Finder
 
Aqua Puttana's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: The Falls of Niagara, USA
Posts: 20,468
Thanks: 10,024
Thanked 10,867 Times in 6,975 Posts
Default Re: Some 2004 Espar Heater Notes

Some Condensed Information from this (same) thread http://www.sprinter-source.com/forum...ad.php?t=30384 that may help with troubleshooting.
All of the information is from my Some 2004 Espar Heater Notes thread so take the time and go back for pictures and schematic references. This is not a "How to". Some basic multi-meter and other troubleshooting techniques will be needed.

At some point you may just need to bite the bullet and remove the Espar for testing and cleaning. It isn't that difficult.

Some other 2004 Espar Booster Heater threads which I've posted are here:

Remove Espar Heater from T1N
http://sprinter-source.com/forum/showthread.php?t=30427

General Espar Heater Wiring Information
http://sprinter-source.com/forum/showthread.php?t=30191

Cabin Fan Resistor Circuits
http://sprinter-source.com/forum/showthread.php?t=30286

T1N Booster Heater Wireless Control
http://sprinter-source.com/forum/showthread.php?t=30512

********************

First: The Varnish Sniffers across the pond have been busy revealing interesting information about the Espar heaters since I last visited their site. Visit the site.
http://www.letonkinoisvarnish.uk/Ebe...r_Intro_1.html

Some general information for the Espar heaters.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aqua Puttana View Post
All this information is out in other threads. I am repeating. A search can be your friend.

The basic Espar heaters are a small self contained oil burner furnace as to firing. The heaters can be installed stand alone in boats and vehicles. The little furnace has a built in combustion control module for the ignition, blower speed, flame monitoring, operating temperature control, and overtemp safety monitor.

To just fire up, the Espar furnace needs a fuel supply (pulse pump), combustion air (internal fan), and an ignition source (glow pin). The native combustion controls are just sitting there waiting for your Sprinter to wake it up properly.

The basic external requirements to fire up are:

Constant 12 volts to pin #1.
A proper negative ground connection pin #2.
A connection (wire) out to the dosing pump pin #4 (It is a conditioned signal. Not just 12 VDC.).
A 12 volt enable signal to pin #6.
A 12 volt enable signal to pin #7.

Pin #5 is for communication. It is not required.

The circulation pump is not required for the heater to fire up. The Espar control has no idea what the MB aux electric coolant pump is doing, or not doing until the heater goes to over-temperature. Without proper coolant circulation the Espar heater will shut down on overtemp safety in a short time.

The Espar heater does run through an internal system check before firing. If there is a problem with the glow pin, flame sensor, blower, etc, then that will prevent the Espar heater from getting to startup. (There may also be some sort of verification for an external relay component. I say that because there have been reports of the Sprinter Espar throwing a coolant pump code failure. That is even though the MB Aux Electric Coolant Pump has no connection to the native Espar controls. The Aux Espar with two electrical connectors may have a direct connection.)

Here is a basic diagram.

10.3.3 Booster.JPG


Added: As Vanski pointed out, the Espar coolant type heaters can even be test fired with no coolant. I wouldn't allow it to run for more than a very short time without coolant though. It will very quickly over heat and stress components.

vic
My Espar start overview.

What I learned after it fired.
The earlier times that I thought it was firing it was just burning fuel in the glow plug chamber which produced white smoke and did not ignite the main chamber. Actually evaporating might be a better term than "burning".

The faulty operation sequence as I recall it.
The engine noise at idle makes it hard to be certain of some noises. After starting the engine the Espar combustion fan would cycle for a quick ramp up. After a short fan run cycle to purge the combustion chamber the fuel would pulse in. The heater would begin pouring out white smoke. I thought that meant it was firing because the combustion fan would ramp up. After ramp up I'd see even more white smoke. Then the fuel pump would stop, the fan would ramp down, raw diesel fuel would drip out the exhaust (I later learned that my muffler packing was soaked with fuel.), the fan would run a while (combustion chamber purge) and then slow down. After (if?) the first start fails, the blower runs on a low speed into a 2nd start attempt. If the 2nd start fails, the blower continues to run through a standard cooldown cycle and then locks out for no more attempts until a power down reset.

Each failed ignition attempt dumps about 1 1/2 teaspoons of unburned (raw) diesel into the combustion chamber. No ignition at all = x2 start attempts = approx. 3 teaspoons of fuel. The combustion fan carries that fuel to the exhaust system. Once the muffler stuffing is saturated the fuel will spill out from the exhaust system.

I learned that when the heater actually fires off there was just a little white smoke and then the Espar would begin to roar. You will recognize the roar as opposed to just the fan ramping up. It sounds like a low rubble not just a whine. The whine is just the fan turning up to very high speed. For each start attempt the fan will run and the fuel pumps until the flame sensor kicks into the circuit and realizes that there is no main flame. It then stops the fuel and the fan ramps back down, but not shut the fan down right away. As I said, the white smoke I saw is just the glow plug chamber fuel burning (evaporating?) and not actually igniting the main burner.

Firing correctly = A little white smoke then No Smoke. Not enough air = Black smoke. Unburned fuel = White smoke.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Aqua Puttana View Post
I've noticed some comments about the dash temperature settings being related to the Booster Heater and Aux Heater operating. To my knowledge the Espar doesn't care what positions that the OEM Cabin fan/heater controls are in.

Once the Espar heaters are enabled and fired up the temperature control is maintained by a coolant temperature sensor contained within the Espar heater module. Given proper coolant circulation the heater will run until the coolant temperature reaches setpoint.

There are 2 ea. control setpoints. The first lower temperature will trigger the Espar to go to low power output. The higher (167F if memory serves) will trigger a shutdown of all firing. There is an even higher over-temperature limit, but that shouldn't come into play when proper coolant circulation is maintained.

Except for the Espar dedicated dash controls, the OEM cabin temperature controls do not affect the Espar operation once it is enabled.

vic
*******************

I've read that Espar heaters "Lock out" after some failed start/ignition attempts. I don't find that true with my 2004.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kubbie View Post
Isn't it true that after a number of failures to fire, the Espar locks itself out and needs to be reset with an MB star tool?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aqua Puttana View Post
...
I've read that. From my research that may be the mode of a native Espar diesel fired heater. I've read that after so many start attempts the native Espar heater locks out and needs to be reset using the proprietary Espar access scan tool. OR maybe the permanent lockouts are related to specific component failures which are monitored by the Espar computer and people assume it has locked out related to a couple start attempts.

My experience:
My 2004 heater main burner never fired for the first 6+ years that I owned my van. I tried it more than a few times over the years. Each time the most I would get was white smoke = unburned fuel. The Ignition Air Duct was plugged solid so the main burner never fired. When the button was pushed the red dash LED would light, the heater would try to start two times in succession and then would lock out, but not permanently. After an engine shutdown and restart it would again give two white smoke cycles.

After I cleaned the burner and screwed up the screen "wick" metering into the glow plug chamber I tried many more x2 white smoke cycles. There was never a permanent lockout. The heater runs fine now.

So, my experience shows that the Sprinterized Espar control module doesn't lock out after a failed ignition sequence. The 2 x start tries are allowed and then it prevents any further starts until power off/on. That is not as described for the native Espar control.
...
This thread has some good info.

Espar Booster Heater Not Starting - Info near Write-up Status
http://sprinter-source.com/forum/showthread.php?t=18131


********************

Espar D5 Fuel Quantity Test

Fuel Quantity Test
The fuel Quantity should be tested if the heater has difficulty
starting or maintaining a flame.

Note: Measure the fuel quantity when the battery is
sufficiently charged. At least 11V and at
most 13V should be applied at the control
unit during measurement.

Preparation
• Remove metering pump cover in the cases of SC versions.
• Pull the fuel line off the combustion chamber and insert
into a graduated measuring glass
• Switch the heater on, when fuel delivery is uniform
(approximately 40 seconds after switching on), the fuel
line is full and bled.
• Switch heater off
• Empty measuring glass and replace

Measurement
• Switch heater on
• Fuel delivery stars automatically approximately 40
seconds after switching on
• Hold the graduated measuring glass at the glow pin
height during measurement
• After 90 seconds of fuel delivery, it will shut off
automatically
• Switch heater off.
• Read off quantity of fuel delivery in the graduated
measuring glass

Evaluation

Nominal value

Diesel

Hydronic D5W SC

8.6 cm3 / 90 seconds - Maximum Qty
7.5 cm3 / 90 seconds - Minimum Qty

7.5 ML = approx. 1 1/2 teaspoons

I found that an old Baby Medicine Dosing Spoon worked perfectly to measure the fuel output. The output from my pump was at the 7.5 ML low end of the specification. (Note that the 90 second test includes a combination of low pulse and high pulse pump operation. Low pulse = ignition cycle. High pulse = ramp up until no flame sensor cutoff.)

Attachment 56483
http://www.maxiaids.com/products/143...FclcMgodQAIAoQ


The fuel doesn't "pump" out it more trickles out. You can feel the fuel line pulse as the fuel is "pumped".
*****************


These Sprinter wire colors and function are deciphered from a few different technical sources and schematics. You will not likely find this info in many places. MB doesn't make it easy to track down using just their Service Manual schematics. The MB OEM controls are a step child to Espar that they have no interest in.

Sprinter OEM Espar Plug Info

Chamber (Pin) - Cross section/Colour - Function

Pin #1 - 1,5 red - plus supply, terminal +30 Sprinter = Orange? (Red/? - Heavy Wire) - All (8W-42-11)
Pin #2 - 1,5 brown - minus supply, terminal –31 Sprinter = Brown (Heavy Wire) - All (8W-42-11)
Pin #3 - 0,5 black/red - not in use? Sprinter = Blue/Yellow - Program Timer Only - Fan Stage 1 Relay = REST Low Spd (8W-42-08)
Pin #4 - 0,5 green - plus signal, dosing pump Sprinter = Dark Green - All (8W-42-11)
Pin #5 - 0,5 blue/white - diagnosis Sprinter = Blue/Red - All (8W-42-10)
Pin #6 - 0,5 blue - terminal 15 Sprinter = Blue - Program Timer, Black/Blue/Orange - Except Program Timer (8W-42-10, 8W-42-11)
Pin #7 - 0,5 yellow - D+ dynamo Sprinter = Yellow - Program Timer. Blue - Except Program Timer (8W-42-10)
Pin #8 - 0,5 black/white - not in use?? Sprinter = Blue/Yellow (8W-42-09)
Pin #8 Clarification Note:
Cabin Heater Module aka Program Timer = Circulation Pump Relay - Cabin Heater Module (Relay Block)
REST System aka Except Program Timer = ATC Module - No Relay, Direct (Heater Booster Mode) (8W-42-09)

Note:
*The Dash Inset Control aka Program Timer will have a Circulation Pump Relay and a Stage 1 (Low Spd) Fan Relay under the driver seat.
* The Booster Heater aka Except Program Timer doesn't have any related relays under the seat.The ATC module does the logic/control for the Booster Heater/REST pump and fan.

***************

Have fun.

vic
__________________
DAD NAS (N. Amer. Spec) 2004 140 2500 >320,000+ mi. Arctic Whitewash Brush-tone Grey
2006 Freightliner 140 2500HC >162,500+ mi. Arctic Whitewash (Spotted Snow Leopard accents)
"My opinion and worth everything you'll never pay for it." assumed.
Anyone can hold the helm when the sea is calm. Publilius Syrus
"There are only 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't." HaWiiLuVeR
Some people have 10 years experience, others just 1 year 10 times.

Last edited by Aqua Puttana; 11-19-2016 at 07:05 PM.
Aqua Puttana is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to Aqua Puttana For This Useful Post:
outbound (11-19-2016)
Old 11-23-2017, 02:25 PM   #18
Aqua Puttana
Poly - Thread Finder
 
Aqua Puttana's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: The Falls of Niagara, USA
Posts: 20,468
Thanks: 10,024
Thanked 10,867 Times in 6,975 Posts
Default Re: Some 2004 Espar Heater Notes

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aqua Puttana View Post
Apparently a reset can be accomplished without a scan tool or control head communication. Thanks goes to SkyGypsy.


Quote:
Originally Posted by SkyGypsy View Post
If the unit doesn't start, then you can clear and reset the unit by powering it up, then pulling the fuses underneath the driver seat. I have done this several times and gone from no response to startup in moments.

I have done a full overhaul on my unit. I should post a write up on it. I have the factory manual, maybe I will post it on my website for others to download.
I have not tried the above. It did work. I pulled the 25 amp fuse under the seat.

vic
More info from SkyGypsy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SkyGypsy View Post
I don't know how it's different, but that is the procedure. And it has worked for me on several occasions.

My heater tests returned these results at 92F. I have the workshop manual somewhere but I'm on my phone now. It's easy enough to find.

Test results
Glow pin - 0.6 ohms
Flame sensor - 1132 ohms
OH sensor - 7.25K ohms
Temp Sensor - 7.25K ohms

They were all within spec.
...
And more:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aqua Puttana View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by SkyGypsy View Post
... However, recently my unit stopped working for me and the fuse reset wasn’t bringing it back to life. The start up sequence wouldn’t even turn the fuel pump on.

I took it to the local thermo king (4 hours away) and they ran diagnostics. Turns out my flame sensor set off multiple codes.
Not that this matters. Your fuse removal reset was probably still clearing the Espar. (Thanks for that tip by the way. )

The Espar was likely not getting past the flame detection verification of the combustion module pre-start safety routine. That should throw it right back to lockout.


Quote:
Originally Posted by SkyGypsy View Post
...Unfortunately, the tech didn’t not read the full description of the troubleshooting guide for that code, which is to short the sensor and see if that throws the proper code to verify it is indeed the sensor and not the ECU. oh well. It will cost about the same to just order the part as it will to drive back down there. ...
Another good piece of information.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SkyGypsy View Post
...Anyway, my point is you probably have an error in the start up sequence and that is why you’re not hearing your fuel pump. Run the diagnostic wire. You’ll know what you need to do, and you can also use that to unlock a locker out heater, if the fuse truck doesn’t work.
Good advice.

I'm unlikely to be proactive enough to add the Data Link enable wire to my 2006 console control now, but the first sign of odd Espar issues will have me install that feature.

vic


...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aqua Puttana View Post
An Espar Aux Timer Control possible hack.

If the console dash timer/controller fails there is a temporary, maybe permanent hack.

A mechanical thermostat or twist timer can be wired from 12v+ to the yellow enable wire. A simple switch would also work, but perhaps a temperature/time control of some sort is wanted.

An example of a mechanical stat.
https://www.walmart.com/ip/White-Rod...ostat/37528790
An RV style mechanical stat will also work. More $$$.

As an aside for northern home owners who travel:
I used this stat as a backup freeze protection addition to my home programmable thermostat.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000E7PZUY/

Most programmable stats are NOT fail safe = no freeze protection. A cheap thermostat will provide that protection. The lowest temperature on the above stat is 50F. That was great for my freeze protection (No off switch. I set 55F.), but will need an off/on switch for the Espar hack use.


A twist timer example.
https://www.homedepot.com/p/Intermat...2HWK/205478810

vic
__________________
DAD NAS (N. Amer. Spec) 2004 140 2500 >320,000+ mi. Arctic Whitewash Brush-tone Grey
2006 Freightliner 140 2500HC >162,500+ mi. Arctic Whitewash (Spotted Snow Leopard accents)
"My opinion and worth everything you'll never pay for it." assumed.
Anyone can hold the helm when the sea is calm. Publilius Syrus
"There are only 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't." HaWiiLuVeR
Some people have 10 years experience, others just 1 year 10 times.

Last edited by Aqua Puttana; 01-20-2018 at 02:06 AM.
Aqua Puttana is offline  
Old 02-10-2018, 12:23 PM   #19
Aqua Puttana
Poly - Thread Finder
 
Aqua Puttana's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: The Falls of Niagara, USA
Posts: 20,468
Thanks: 10,024
Thanked 10,867 Times in 6,975 Posts
Default Re: Some 2004 Espar Heater Notes

There is no Flame Sensing proper with the Espar combustion control

An answer to a recent PM.

*****************
Ho boy. It's cocktail time in the Keys and I just ran across your questions.

Using my poor memory.

To my knowledge, the T1N OEM Espar combustion module doesn't use a flame sensor proper. The established flame feedback is provided by the temperature sensors which are clamped into the heater housing.

Once initial pre-ignition system tests have been passed, the combustion control looks for a rise in housing temperature, not a flame. If that rise isn't verified, the Espar shuts down. [Note: The fuel pump output ramps up (faster tapping) after each start attempt whether flame is established or not.]

I believe that what you refer to as a flame sensor is the glow pin heater which inserts into the "D" shaped opening. For certain the glow pin ignites the fuel in "D" chamber. Once flame is established I'm a bit sketchy on how the main combustion chamber is fueled. I believe that some sort of vortex is created to keep the fuel/air mixture firing. As I said... sketchy.

Anyway, the 2004 glow pin did screw out. You'll need the glow pin with integral leads [because you have a burner with integral fuel pipe].

Some info should be here.

https://sprinter-source.com/forum/sh...601#post278601

There is more info in post #1 which may help.

I hope this helps.

vic
__________________
DAD NAS (N. Amer. Spec) 2004 140 2500 >320,000+ mi. Arctic Whitewash Brush-tone Grey
2006 Freightliner 140 2500HC >162,500+ mi. Arctic Whitewash (Spotted Snow Leopard accents)
"My opinion and worth everything you'll never pay for it." assumed.
Anyone can hold the helm when the sea is calm. Publilius Syrus
"There are only 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't." HaWiiLuVeR
Some people have 10 years experience, others just 1 year 10 times.

Last edited by Aqua Puttana; 02-10-2018 at 12:27 PM.
Aqua Puttana is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to Aqua Puttana For This Useful Post:
outbound (02-15-2018)
Closed Thread

Tags
espar info

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT. The time now is 11:37 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.