Low DEF False Alarm & Another Really Bad Mercedes Dealer

Some people are overwhelmingly stupid, arrogant, idiotic hen it comes to business, especially in this day and age of the interwebs!

I run a service business that lives on customer reviews. (year round vacation rental) As a result, we do EVERYTHING to make the customer experince positive if for no other reason is that a bad review can kill you! The only recurring complaint we can't effectively cure is the remotes on the various devices, despite the best efforts of Harmony Remotes. We simply tell guests to snag a 12 year old on the street to figure it out. Seriously, we had a guest miss up his departure dante, and he didn't vacate. (but he was out doing vacation things and not answering his phone! We got in the horn with the incoming guest, told them to book a room at the local 5 star hotel on us,and go to dinner on us. The overstaying guest was aghast at his mistake, (once he actually read his contract. In his defense, we normally rent by the week, Saturday through Saturday during peak season, but 3 days in the shoulder and off season. It happened to be memorial day weekend, and he just misread his paper work.)

To make everything right, we simply charged him one extra night, and refunded the incoming guest one days rent. We ate the hotel and the dinner costs, chalking it up to good customer service. The bottom line, both guest left 5 star, glowing reviews, including mentioning how happy they were with the resolution, and in fact, both have been back since, one couple several times. The lesson we learned is anytime we have unusual booking dates we phone the people the week before they occupy to confirm that we are all on the same page, since we are usually 100% booked, and with only one house, have no room to put an over staying guest.

It cost us virtually nothing, but we get repeated benefit of doing the right thing. If a deal is a POS and treats you like a POS, (and you have genuinely tried to resolve the issue, instead of just windging) then yell it from mountain top. The inverse should also be true. When someone performs above and beyond the call, they deserve to be called out as well.


Icarus

big_d said:

Here's the VM for anyone who wants to listen to it. It has been edited to remove our employee's last name.

David Parkhill seems to think he has the right strategy for dealing with online criticism.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=wscjitTzgaQ

Click to expand...

Well there you go! --How not to deal with a customer .
How to win friends and influence people.

As a one time zone rep for a once upon a time GM sized truck and bus maker I would have reported his dealership to the head of our service department.
Sales & Service Director Mr Doug J would often say "The biggest problem with this business is Dealers--So true!

I would have made it my personal mission to make sure he & his dealership was on the top ten for a dealer audit. Then watch that big fish wiggle!
This is what I am on about with some of these overbearing big box Euro makes dealers.
Thanks for posting --Now PLEASE send it to MB public relations and put the fat in the fire!
All the best and I mean it!
Warming the cockles of my heart!
Dennis

Well, at least you got a response from Parkhill. I had a NEGATIVE experience at a dealer where I purchased my 2015 Sprinter and my email message to the owner/manager never received a response. A dealership could use a negative report on their staff as an opportunity to make corrections/provide training to employees/assure good customer relations BUT I doubt this happened in this case. My complaint to MBUSA went nowhere also.
I never received a recall notice on the issue [tranny fluid spill problem] from MB but when I read about it here, I called the dealer and made appointment for the fix. They "lost" my van on this huge lot and I had to get out on a very cold day and find it myself or I guess I'd still be drinking their cokes and eating their cookies and waiting - LOL. Funny how pissed off I was that day but I'm OK now. Actually had to think a minute to recall what the issue was after this thread reminded me of the experience.
I have had very positive experiences at 3 other MB Sprinter dealers, however.

1109 said:

Hey, please don't let a bad relationship tarnish a products good reputation.

Click to expand...

Tell that to MBUSA. MB should go Bobby Knight on the ingrate franchise dealerships if they give a crap about preserving their reputation.

If MBUSA can't take some responsibility for their unscrupulous dealership network, then their brand reputation deserves to go down in flames.

The only silver lining in this whole disgraceful story is the thought of Mr. Parkhill reading this thread, knowing how long it is likely to remain here.

big_d said:

Here's the VM for anyone who wants to listen to it. It has been edited to remove our employee's last name.

David Parkhill seems to think he has the right strategy for dealing with online criticism.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=wscjitTzgaQ

Click to expand...

History tends to show the third generation screws up the family business. Grandpappy usually keeps the family on the track that proved successful. Regardless of family or fortune, integrity and sound business principles are qualities that paupers have too.

This person demonstrates neither. The Mercedes community is a small one, the Sprinter more so. His due will come back to him. Stick to your facts and present the reports from this dealership and the one that fixed the problem to MBUSA. They will not ignore it.

Names and faces

I doubt this will ever happen but I welcome Mr Parkhill to respond to this thread with his side of the story.

At this point we have Big_D's comments and a quite damning voicemail from the dealership. It seems Big_D has been overly fair in his dealings with this dealership. Let's see what Parkhill has to say.



stew

Update: Low DEF light + Check Engine light are back - even though DEF level has never dropped below about 3 gallons since the service visits described above.

Update Again: Stoops found a blockage in a DEF tube and resolved. But now, a couple weeks later, we've got the Low DEF light + Check engine light back again.

Re: DEF is out of speck ...

big_d ... see icon on right: Wrong reducing agent ...

... replace the old DEF with fresh clean def fluid.

Big D. I went through the exact same thing with my 2011. It took 4 visits to the dealer and help from a MB regional representative to resolve the issue. False codes kept coming up.
I am not mechanically inclined and I don't remember all that they did to fix the issue so I can't help you.
If you call MB of North Olmsted at 440-716-2700 and ask for Gene in Sprinter service he would be able to help. Their mechanic Steve solved the problem.

Oh Boy! I just got these messages this weekend on my 3 month old Sprinter 2500 144 passenger van with the I4, same scenarios, 2 starts left when I dropped it off to the dealer last night. I just can't wait to get it back and then have to take it in to dealer AGAIN, and AGAIN, and AGAIN! Seems like resetting the error and telling you it's fixed is the standard modus operandi. Then you can look forward to getting the message again, and go back.

What is up with this cheap and (sorry Disney) "mickey mouse" DEF and NOx system? I did not find it in the complaints to NHTSA or on the lemon vehicle sites before I purchased the van. I would've thought there would be a massive technical service bulletin sent out to the Service Managers of each dealership explaining what to do rather than letting each dealer re-invent the wheel by experimenting with the customer's vehicles. And especially taking a 'black eye' from that Parkhill fellow! I don't care who he is representing, that is just not the way to do business, and I applaud everyone's evaluation of their dealings with him!

Took 3 dealers in 3 different states to fix my same problem (2013 with 14k miles). Started out on a 12,000 mile journey and in the first 200 miles I get 10 starts left, low def (it was filled at the start of our trip) and CEL. Problem 1 was clogged def nozzle found by 2nd dealer. Biggest problem was 2 bad NOX sensors. The 3rd dealer changed only 1 and problem reoccurred in 60 miles. Replaced 2nd sensor and 13,000 miles later, I'm still good to go.

If your problem still persists...demand 2 new NOX sensors if not replaced already.

The first dealer kept insisting that I let the tank go low. I never did, and he never listened. The 2nd dealer listened half as much and only got half the problem solved.

Everything covered under warranty.

3rd dealer (Birmingham, Al) was great.

I have been to 9 dealers now for problems and service and only pleased with 3 (Greensboro, NC, Sun motors in Carlise, PA and Birmingham,Al)

Hatteras Jim said:

Took 3 dealers in 3 different states to fix my same problem (2013 with 14k miles). Started out on a 12,000 mile journey and in the first 200 miles I get 10 starts left, low def (it was filled at the start of our trip) and CEL. Problem 1 was clogged def nozzle found by 2nd dealer. Biggest problem was 2 bad NOX sensors. The 3rd dealer changed only 1 and problem reoccurred in 60 miles. Replaced 2nd sensor and 13,000 miles later, I'm still good to go.

If your problem still persists...demand 2 new NOX sensors if not replaced already.

The first dealer kept insisting that I let the tank go low. I never did, and he never listened. The 2nd dealer listened half as much and only got half the problem solved.

Everything covered under warranty.

3rd dealer (Birmingham, Al) was great.

I have been to 9 dealers now for problems and service and only pleased with 3 (Greensboro, NC, Sun motors in Carlise, PA and Birmingham,Al)

Click to expand...

Thanks! That's great info to send to my local dealer. They need this sort of feedback and info in order to know what to look for. I told them I didn't want it back with the light turned off and told its ok, they should kepp it until it is fixed.

For what its worth I had one like this last Friday.

Low level light on and system inoperative.

There are three sensors in the Adblue tank one wasn't showing "wet".
Pump was inoperable and the DEF injector plugged.
Tank was full!
Draining the tank the Def liquid was like milk with a very creamy constituency!

I tested it with a refractometer for Adblue liquid sg--didn't pass!
Owner had no idea if contaminated fluid had been introduced, or if he did know, he wasn't saying !
Did he buy same crap Def fluid --Well who knows?
So a tank heater level sender unit went in @ $1100, plus a pump $770, and an injector @ $429.
Plus a few "schkllings" to fix and it was a runner.

Moral be careful of the quality of the fluid you put in that tank!
Dennis

I can only imagine what some folks put in there. In my unit, I purchased two new boxes (2.5 gal each) of Peak DEF from Sam's and it was very clear going in (spout is opaque so you can see through it). I used up the entire 2.5 gallons, and when I tried to pour more in from the next box, it immediately ran over into the rubber around the filler neck. Only 2.5 gallons had been used. Both boxes had their safety seals intact, and were perfectly clean and clear....

Got my Sprinter back today! Discussed the issue at great length with the service manager (apparently caught him when no one else was pulling at him for a bit), and he was aware of the issues the Sprinters were experiencing. He had sent my emails to his Merc rep and contacted him. They exchanged info from my vehicle.

Here is what the report on the $0.00 invoice which I received: 3523 cel on and adblue message in cluster

541011 quick test perform
540991 control unit program (after quick test)
540992 control unit code (after quick test)
540000 reset adblue counter

Performed sds short test. Found fault codes for adblue metering/adaptation values. Found new software for cdi control unit. Updated cdi control unit software and scn code, Reprogram and scn code both nox sensors, reset adblue counter.

Well, what do you think? Is this a temp fix or should I expect it to repeat?

You will get the problems again is my bet. I have listened to the rhetoric about too many error codes clogging the system, needing to reset everything, everything will be fine ...blah, blah, blah. Only things that fixed my two problems were the actual replacement of parts.

My closest dealer (who I would not visit again) is 140 miles away.

Wish you well and hope for the best. Maybe it will work for you. Let us know.

jim

Thanks, Jim. Don't worry about telling it like it is. That is what these wonderful forums are all about. Relating our experiences helps in more ways than one. I worked diligently to explain to them about what people had experienced and what it was taking to fix the problem. If they did not listen or take what I had to say to heart, then we will be back with the same issue. I drove it for about 100 miles yesterday, and so far it is OK. I know that is not a very definitive test, nor near long enough to say it was fixed. I probably won't consider it truly fixed until I run enough miles to have had to refill the DEF tank about 3-4 times and not have any lights or codes. That could be a while!

On the manufacturer's side, I understand their not wanting to replace any part unless it shows that it is out of their specifications. However, when we have a warranty issue with a fuel injection product for a customer, we appeal to our manufacturers if we know there is a slight issue with a particular item that could cause a future problem of a similar nature that would make the customer have to come back or have additional downtime. They sometimes work with us and allow for replacement of those additional items (example: NOx sensors, DEF pump-heater-nozzle) if we explain the case properly. I don't know if it would be applicable here, but I guess I'll have to find out.

I thank you for the honest report. So, for now I will continue to drive down the road waiting on the "other shoe" to drop. Guess I'll have to travel that same road that has been paved by you folks that have been there, done that, and finally got the T-shirt.

If I see the CE light come on again, maybe I should be ready to call another dealer such as Greensboro, NC or Carlisle, PA and tell them that I need to come see them to get it truly "fixed". Greensboro is only 2 hours away, Carlisle is about 5 hours away.