Sprinter 312D 1998 wont start

Dingo

New member
hate to say this , but try a quick squirt of easy start , it should crack into life as the ether burns & hopefully continue running on diesel . Do not go berzerk with the stuff .

Because it is NOT a common rail injection system , you should have a running engine even if one or two injectors are duff , as they are fed fuel independantly of the others .

Daft question this may sound , but has anyone run the van on veg oil or bio diesel ? because sitting for a period of time may bond the needles in place & stop injection occuring as the veg oil breaks down
 

Boater

New member
A warning is going to be useful at this point - one of your injectors has a sensor built in, it might be No. 1, on mine it is No. 2. This injector can be tested, but cannot be re-nozzled because the sensor gets damaged - I have been told this by several places including Bosch service centres. All the others can be tested and re-nozzled, but if the sensor injector is not spraying properly, or the sensor has given up the ghost, you will probably be looking at around £500 to replace that injector (may be less since yours is newer, mine is pretty obscure part number now). My advice therefore is to choose your tester wisely and make sure they are Bosch approved and familiar with this type of injector - there are some out there who only really do CDI injectors and even then some may not test them properly - an ultrasonically cleaned injector looks like new but doesn't demonstrate that anything useful was necessarily done to it!

To be honest at this stage since your main ECU has been checked, I would probably be looking at the fuel pump ECU.
As I said before when I had a sensor fail in the pump fuel was coming through but not at high enough pressure to open the injectors - looking at exploded diagrams of these kind of pumps I think I understand why:

The engine management system controls the injection quantity by moving a plunger in the fuel pump to control the volume of fuel in the central chamber. As the engine turns over the pump goes round (chain driven off the crankshaft) so will always push the fuel in the central chamber to whichever injector port is open at that stage in the cycle, so you always get fuel in the injector line. But when the engine management system has a problem instead of shutting the fuel solenoid it seems to just leave the central plunger in a position where the quantity of fuel to be pumped is not enough to build up the necessary pressure to open the injector nozzles (2 stage spring loaded - not controlled by electronic pulse like CDI injectors). Hence, fuel comes out of the lines and you can bleed the air out, but it doesn't spray out of even a properly working injector because it doesn't reach the 190bar (I think) to open the first stage, never mind the 400bar (I think) for the second stage.....
So it could be that if your main ECU is OK but it is still not possible to read any codes for the fuel injection system, maybe the pump ECU has a problem, or maybe there is an electrical problem between them, and maybe this is why it won't start when everything seems to be right otherwise. Like I say, mine did have communication and they picked up a sensor failure, I reckon other failures such as communication itself could manifest in the same symptoms.

Perhaps you need to look for someone who can test the pump output and/or hook the pump up directly to diagnostics and check it out?
 

Dingo

New member
Just had another thought , at the front & below of the battery tray is a black protective wrap full of connections . Make sure it is dry & not full of water as this can lead to no starts as well ,
if neccessary break & remake any plug connections you find in there and spray with WD40 or similar
 

porsche997

New member
Hi so i now think its done to the fuel not getting there can i check if fuel is getting through the injector if i take out injector 1 and put it in a milk bottle and crank it over to see if its spraying fuel ?? or is there another way ?? of doing this

Thanks
 

porsche997

New member
Hi everyone just got the injectors back they are all fine and working well. So i am down to the fuel pump or the fuel pump ecu now. Does anybody know anywhere that rebuild these ?? and at what sort of cost ??

Thanks for your help

Boater Did you know someone in the kent area that repair or test them ??
 

lindenengineering

Well-known member
Hi everyone just got the injectors back they are all fine and working well. So i am down to the fuel pump or the fuel pump ecu now. Does anybody know anywhere that rebuild these ?? and at what sort of cost ??

Thanks for your help

Boater Did you know someone in the kent area that repair or test them ??
The last time I tackled job like this was with a MB 604 in a GWagen.
Now that pump is not used in the US, all builds were using an inline Bosch pump.

I could only find one outfit it the US that would even touch it but they had no info test plans etc from Bosch USA.

SOOH a call to my old stomping ground Bristol and the West "mah deer" and Bosch fuel pump service centre got some test info flying across the pond and we got 'er dun!

I have used these folks many moons ago so does my brother who has a shop up in Gloucester.
In my case the problem turned out to be a defective internal transfer pump! I suspect yours is the same issue! Fairly common issue.
Best o' luck
Dennis
 

lindenengineering

Well-known member
Hey Porsche 997
Here's a couple of tips if you decide to tear off the pump.

Roll the engine to injection spill position number 1 cylinder. You should see something like 24 dgs BTDC. This will take away the guesswork of finding what stroke and piston position you are at when it comes to installing the pump.

I had trouble getting the pump off the drive gear but it should just slide out once you have the flange nuts off, plus all the pipes of course. You should observe a master spline on the pump shaft at about 11 o' clock as you look at it from the back.

Putting the pump back is reverse order, not having any engine info on the Euro engine I used the US inline pump timing postion of 24dg BTDC and gave it a crank.
Ran line a Swiss Watch no smoke or excessive rattle so I left it at that and cabbed it up the front range from 6000 ft to 10,000ft ran like crap off a shovel.

Customer was chuffed; I got paid and it was Fillet Minon that night (with bechamel sauce!:bounce:) AND a good red Borgoyne!
Dennis
 

Boater

New member
Sorry, been busy and not checked in for a while.

I got towed to Kent Diesel Centre in Maidstone, they are attached to a Ford garage but seem to be the main diesel specialists in the SE and Bosh service centre BUT, they don't have facilities to test our dual stage injectors and would have sent them to Colchester Fuels if they needed any work. They did manage to track down my pump sensor issue and repair it before lunchtime which I was very grateful for - pumps they should be able to do, but they didn't have the right test bed for the injectors.

Just to add to Dennis' suggestions, the set up position for these pumps is 12 degrees before TDC No. 1 cylinder on compression stroke. The marks on the crank pulley/harmonic balancer are close but a long way from the indicator so will get a different angle depending on where you stand - I tried to get as straight on as possible.

Pump is held on by 3 bolts through the timing cover - note that the pump flanges are slotted and the angle or rotation can be fine tuned with a long hex bolt against a flange on the timing cover - try to leave that as it is! There is also a bracket to the rear of the pump behind the support for the 4 pipes up to the injectors which can be difficult to get to. Finding the front ends of the 3 main bolts is a challenge, one is partly behind the power steering pulley, one is next to the vac pump (at first glance it looks like a vac pump bolt), and the last one is partly behind the harmonic balancer - if you have the engine set right there should be a scallop in the balancer which lets you get a socket on it but expect to drop it frequently and skin your knuckles!

Once the bolts are undone the pump slides out towards the rear, there is an intermediate coupling - a sleeve with internal teeth, that slides over the gear on the timing pulley and the gear in the pump - there is no key spline on this it can go on in any position and allows you to reset the timing quite easily if say you drop the timing chain when changing it, or break a guide and watch the chain slip as I did! Looking in the pump from the open (front) end at the gear, there is a tooth missing - this is the indicator to set up the pump. Before refitting the pump you need to turn the shaft clockwise until the missing tooth is in line with the port for No. 1 injector - you will feel resistance as you pass each injection position, when you get in line with No. 1 port you go a little further until you can start to feel the resistance build up, if it eases off you have gone too far (keep going clockwise to get back to it). As long as the engine is still at 12 before TDC and the missing tooth is in the right place you should be good to refit the pump, and if all other problems are cleared it should start and run - but will probably need some fine tuning which you will need to get a garage to do unless you know someone who has a dial indicator for setting these up and can find the instructions to do it.

I took some photos of the pump but I don't have them on this computer, will try and look them out for you.

Jim
 

lindenengineering

Well-known member
Sorry, been busy and not checked in for a while.

I got towed to Kent Diesel Centre in Maidstone, they are attached to a Ford garage but seem to be the main diesel specialists in the SE and Bosh service centre BUT, they don't have facilities to test our dual stage injectors and would have sent them to Colchester Fuels if they needed any work. They did manage to track down my pump sensor issue and repair it before lunchtime which I was very grateful for - pumps they should be able to do, but they didn't have the right test bed for the injectors.

Just to add to Dennis' suggestions, the set up position for these pumps is 12 degrees before TDC No. 1 cylinder on compression stroke. The marks on the crank pulley/harmonic balancer are close but a long way from the indicator so will get a different angle depending on where you stand - I tried to get as straight on as possible.

Pump is held on by 3 bolts through the timing cover - note that the pump flanges are slotted and the angle or rotation can be fine tuned with a long hex bolt against a flange on the timing cover - try to leave that as it is! There is also a bracket to the rear of the pump behind the support for the 4 pipes up to the injectors which can be difficult to get to. Finding the front ends of the 3 main bolts is a challenge, one is partly behind the power steering pulley, one is next to the vac pump (at first glance it looks like a vac pump bolt), and the last one is partly behind the harmonic balancer - if you have the engine set right there should be a scallop in the balancer which lets you get a socket on it but expect to drop it frequently and skin your knuckles!

Once the bolts are undone the pump slides out towards the rear, there is an intermediate coupling - a sleeve with internal teeth, that slides over the gear on the timing pulley and the gear in the pump - there is no key spline on this it can go on in any position and allows you to reset the timing quite easily if say you drop the timing chain when changing it, or break a guide and watch the chain slip as I did! Looking in the pump from the open (front) end at the gear, there is a tooth missing - this is the indicator to set up the pump. Before refitting the pump you need to turn the shaft clockwise until the missing tooth is in line with the port for No. 1 injector - you will feel resistance as you pass each injection position, when you get in line with No. 1 port you go a little further until you can start to feel the resistance build up, if it eases off you have gone too far (keep going clockwise to get back to it). As long as the engine is still at 12 before TDC and the missing tooth is in the right place you should be good to refit the pump, and if all other problems are cleared it should start and run - but will probably need some fine tuning which you will need to get a garage to do unless you know someone who has a dial indicator for setting these up and can find the instructions to do it.

I took some photos of the pump but I don't have them on this computer, will try and look them out for you.

Jim
Jim
A little bit different than the one I worked on but the info is very useful I will store this away until the next time.
Thanks Dennis
 

porsche997

New member
Hi Thank you i took out injector 1 today and put it on a friends 312D and it run fine so i now know mine is not starting due lack of fuel pressure so i can only think the pump is knackered !! One other thing is a sensor or something at the back of the pump above where the fuel pipes are with a 12 volt supply to it. Should i be able to hear this click or anything as i get no noise from it there is power there. Any thoughts on this ?? thank you for your help.

Shaun
 

Boater

New member
That's the stop solenoid.
The bad news is I haven't found the photos I took of the pump yet, the good news is that I remembered I bought a wrecked pump in case I needed it for spares and I have found that.
When I supply the solenoid on this one with 12v (flashed it from 12v battery I use for a sea kayak pump) it makes quite a loud click as the coil opens the stop valve. You shouldn't be getting any fuel through if yours isn't opening.
It looks like the solenoid should unscrew easily enough (my tools are all covered up because I'm spraying in the garage) and shouldn't be very expensive. Let me know if you can't get one (Merc commercial dealer parts department should be able to get it, or Bosch service centre), I might think about parting with my spare if you are having trouble finding one.

Good news that your No.1 is supplying the timing signal!

Some photos of my spare parts pump (the one on my van looks much better)

Front side showing the drive gear in roughly the right place (internals are too badly wrecked to be sure)


Rear showing the solenoid above the fuel ports


This pump came from an engine that ran away and over-revved, the pump was damaged by the over-revving.
 

porsche997

New member
Hi Boater

Thats what i was looking at. It has power to it and when i strike with a piece of wire from the battery it doesn't make a noise. So fingers crossed it might be that. I will speak to Merc on monday and see what they say. Do you know what size spanner it is to remove it as its tucked away and hard to get to with the pump on the van. Thank you for your help

Cheers Shaun
 

porsche997

New member
Hi i have fitted the new stop solenoid and it still wont start !!! It must be the pump now really dont think its worth wasting anymore money on it now.

Thanks for all your help

Shaun
 

andy1971bikes

New member
Hi everyone i am new to all this but i have a problem and wondered if anybody can help. I have a 312D sprinter it has been running fine and never let me down until now. I have not used the van for around 3 months i went to start it and it turns over fine but it wont fire i have had a couple of merc people look at it and they said it wont give a fault code so they thought there was a problem with the ECU. I stripped out the ECU and sent it away for tests and its come back fine. If i crank off injector one its getting fuel there when i turn it over im not sure how much it should be spraying out on turn over but its coming out. Somebody else has said that its electrics not fuel. Just seems funny that it was running fine before Please HELP !!!

I have replaced the fuel filter also.

Thanks
Shaun
Hi Shaun, I know its a while ago but did you ever get the van started. I am experiencing same fault now on a 1996 Sprinter ( just cranking no start) . I have had pump and ecu checked.
 

SneakyAnarchistVanCamper

Reading till my eyesbleed
Isn't there a way to test fuel pressure, can't you do that? Have you checked your air filter isn't clogged or the intake isn't full of acorns from squirrels? Have you still not ruled out the low pressure hoses by using a new vinyl hose run into a clean diesel can? What is the ambient temperature and do you have functioning glow plugs? Does it start any easier in a warm garage or if you put on an oil pan heater?
 

andy1971bikes

New member
Hi Vic

Many thanks i have tried to give it a little squirt but it wont run still. It seems to run but wont rev and then just stops. I know its a old van now but i have had it from new and its a really good van. We do have 3 of the newer ones this is just a spare but i would really like to get it going again.

Cheers
Shaun:thinking:
Hi, I know its a while ago but did you get van going again. Mine has the exact same no start
 

milos_ca

New member
Hello everyone,

Hope everybody is having a great day!
I am having the same problem as the rest of you, my 312d turns over but no start, when i spray easy start it will start but shut down right after, i've changed the filter and bleed the system from air and got a new battery but still no go.
What would be the next thing to look at the pump or go the electrical route like Ecu.
Thank you in advanse
 

fisjon

Active member
Hi Milos,
If the motor turns over but does not fire, the stop solenoid is not opening.
Get a length of wire and put a small dog clip on both ends. Connect one to the stop solenoid, and the other to the battery. The engine will fire up straight away. The engine will not switch off with the key until you disconnect the wire.
This happened to my 312d, I used the wire with the dog clips for a fortnight before getting the van into a Bosch garage to diagnose the fault. They found a break in the wiring under the cab.
 

milos_ca

New member
Hi Fisjon
Thanks for the fast response, that was my first thought.
I tested it by conecting one side to the solenoid and other to the + on the batery and it clicks and i also replased the entire wiring between the alternator, glow plugs and starter motor because it was getting cracked.
I will remove it completly to see its not sticking or damaged
 

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