Serpentine belt broke, suspect A/C

My serpentine belt just came off, and it looked like around a centimeter of it broke. Before replacing the belt, I checked to see each pulley could spin. The A/C pulley can spin, but has a fair amount of resistance (I can still turn it by hand though, seems to 'catch' every inch or so). Could this cause the belt to break?

I've been having problems with the A/C. It seems to blow cold for a few min, then stops. If I turn it off and on again, it seems to blow cold for a min or less, then stop. Makes the think the clutch isn't engaging/disengaging right?

I also had my harmonic balancer fly off awhile ago, knocking the belt off. I replaced the balancer, but the belt could have gotten damaged?

Any other things I can check before just putting a new belt on so it can get shredded too?

Thanks!!

The clutch should have the appropriate air gap (check the manual). It should spin freely, and make a full revolution if you give it a good spin.

Midwestdrifter said:

The clutch should have the appropriate air gap (check the manual). It should spin freely, and make a full revolution if you give it a good spin.

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Thanks for confirming this, that's what I thought too. It def doesn't spin freely. I'm tempted to order a serpentine belt without the A/C just to get it working. The compressor is only a year old. It seems like every time I get the A/C working, I have to fix it again in a few months.

I don't think there is an acceptable routing for a short belt to bypass the AC. DORMAN 34228 is a bypass pulley to allow running without an AC compressor.

Hmm, a bracket is a lot less appealing. When the A/C compressor doesn't spin freely, does that mean a replacement is required? It definitely feels at least partially engaged. I'm not sure how this would break the belt though, as it can be fully engaged and working? I can still turn it by hand with mild-moderate effort. Maybe it seizes occasionally?

The belt was worn for a new-ish belt (3 months old), with fine grain bits of the belt all over.

I tried to follow the wire, and it looks connected. That probably wouldn't affect it with the van off though. Could it be a problem A/C control unit? I've already had one of those go bad, and this one only works with fan blower on setting 4 (max). I guess the van is really starting to show its age.

I'm at a bit of a loss on how to proceed. Get a new belt and take it to a place that works on A/Cs? I can't just vent it even with a $50 bracket, and I'm not sure I want to spend $500+ for a new compressor+labor to put it in.

It could be that the clutch is dragging. If you run the AC all the time, thats less of an issue. If its not the clutch, and the bearing itself, that can cause trouble.

A common issue with the T1N, is the AC clutch relay has bad solder joints in the ATC unit. This causes intermittent operation, which requires a restart to restore, or doesn't work when hot.

Thanks for the info. I don't run the A/C all the time, which is probably what killed the belt (I can only run it on full blast). ATC unit getting hot and causing intermittent voltages could probably wear the clutch down fast.

The pulley is hard to turn with the van off, if it was the relay, wouldn't it have no power and (assuming) be disengaged?

Is there a way to check if it's the clutch, or replace only that piece?

Its not a easy job to do the clutch in-situ, and you need the exact clutch for that model.

I was saying that you may have more than one issue. The clutch issue, and the intermittent issue may be separate.

When you turn the pulley, do it feel gravely? Does the center shaft spin at all?

Ok, so I dug around under there some more and found something weird. The pulley directly above the A/C (the tensioner?) is touching the A/C pulley and moves when I move the A/C pulley. I can't move them separately. The center of the A/C compressor will turn if I move it, but doesn't turn when I move the A/C pulley.

It seems like this is what's causing the A/C pulley so much difficulty to turn, the other pulley is right up on it! This doesn't seem right to me. When my balancer came off, could it have bent the tensioner? Or do I just need to adjust/replace it?

The tensioner does not need adjusted. Have you confirmed you have the right belt, and idler pulleys installed?

Is the belt tight, loose, or normal?

The belt split and flew off. With no belt on, the tensioner is butted right up against the A/C compressor and causing difficulty to move it. I can't move the tensioner pulley with any amount of force (bare hand). Shouldn't it budge a little? This seems broken to me. Is there some trick to get it to move?

I can also see a section of the tensioner spring coming out of the engine housing. It looks like the tensioner exploded out and pinched the old belt in between the tensioner pulley and the A/C compressor pulley, ripping it.

You have the classic failed tensioner. So you need a new tensioner and I would evaluate all your other beltline components at the same time.

Midwestdrifter said:

You have the classic failed tensioner. So you need a new tensioner and I would evaluate all your other beltline components at the same time.

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I guess this is why they say replace the tensioner when you replace the belt. The shop that put a new harmonic balancer on didn't do this.

By evaluate other beltline components, do you mean just make sure they spin freely with little side-to-side wobble?

Thanks for the help!!!!

Yes.

I would replace the two idler pulleys while you're in there. They're cheap, and especially cheap insurance against more belt related failures. I've had on split on me on a road trip and shred the belt. Luckily I carry a spare idler pulley AND belt, and replaced it on the go in about 2 hours. Put a delay on my trip, but not a disaster...

Agreed.
I did my tensioner, idlers, and belt last year, and now travel with my old belt-train parts as emergency spares.

There is a hole in the tensioner where you can place a pin (bolt/nail) to lock it in the “belt slack” (spring tight) position. This makes it MUCH easier to get at the bolts during removal.
(pin is shown inserted at lower left of photo)

-dave

Zundfolge said:

I would replace the two idler pulleys while you're in there.

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Yes! Thank you for reminding me there are two. I had one ordered, but got it modified in time before shipping. It's amazing how cheap Rockauto has these parts compared to actual stores.

I don't think I'm to the point of carrying around a spare set, but it's not a bad idea at all. Everything running on one belt means one point of failure until you're completely out of commission.

brewfox said:

Yes! Thank you for reminding me there are two. I had one ordered, but got it modified in time before shipping. It's amazing how cheap Rockauto has these parts compared to actual stores.

I don't think I'm to the point of carrying around a spare set, but it's not a bad idea at all. Everything running on one belt means one point of failure until you're completely out of commission.

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1) What brand did you order? Not all parts are created equally.

2) Have you met Murphy?

True: INA’s tensioner castings have earned a poor reputation. Some have cracked in service.

Zundfolge said:

1) What brand did you order? Not all parts are created equally.

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Hmm, I ended up buying the cheapest parts. Maybe not the best idea, but it was only $60 shipped for everything I needed.

Two of these $5 Ultra-power idler pulleys

One cheap $13 Bando belt

One Uro parts $26 cheap tensioner