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wisdomracer
11-01-2018, 10:48 PM
2003 Cargo Springer.

OK have been dealing with getting this van running again for the past few days. I will try to give the whole story. Well it sat for a few weeks and it did rain a lot. I started it up and drove it about 10 minutes from my house and it went into limp mode. Showed codes P14841, p1482, and P1354 (bad synchronization between crankshaft and camshaft sensor.) I have been having hard starting problems since I bought it and assumed it was fuel line problems letting air in, which I thought I fixed. When code 1354 came up I decided its time to change the crankshaft sensor. I have already replaced the camshaft sensor with a knockoff sensor from autozone a few weeks ago. I changed the crankshaft sensor with an OEM one and still no start. I purged the fuel line and have no air bubbles. I know its not the best habit but it does start up real quick with starter fluid. Also probably 70% of the time when I start the van it kicks like it is going to start for a second then just turns over by the starter. When I clear the codes as soon as I start it those codes come back up. Any ideas? Sorry for the long message

NelsonSprinter
11-01-2018, 11:34 PM
P14841, could be catalytic convertor overheat, could be caused by fuel injector over fueling
p1482, glow plug error, could be cause of no start if cold
and P1354 sensor mis-synchonization code could be set if using starter fluid, igniting before it should, use less than a 1/3 second of fluid spray.

I don't know what caused the limp home mode but suspect overheated exhaust might to save the turbo.
I suspect you have fuel injectors leaking internal pressure preventing a start, and would do a " Injector Leak-off Test" 1st

wisdomracer
11-01-2018, 11:40 PM
Im in houston so the weather has been high 60's low 70's lately. Think it could overheat with just cruising down my streets, max speed of 50mph, for 10 mins?) I'm thinking it might be the injectors to I just didnt know that would put it into limp mode and not throw a code. I had my scanner with me so as soon as it went into limp mode I checked and it was the same 3 codes. The p1354 has come on many times of me trying to start it and clear the codes and most of those were before the 1 time I used starter fluid

Bobnoxious
11-02-2018, 12:58 AM
15-year old vehicle? How old is the battery, health? Check ground distributions. Particularly the negative battery cable attach point to the vehicle.

Midwestdrifter
11-02-2018, 01:32 AM
p1354 is a synchronization error between crank and cam sensors. Either sensor will prevent the vehicle from starting. Check the wires and plugs to each.

Does your tach rise when cranking? If not, suspect the Crank sensor or its wiring. If it does rise, it could still be the crank, but may also be the cam sensor.

wisdomracer
11-02-2018, 04:21 PM
Yes the tach does rise and I have an Icarsoft that also shows around 250rpm when I am trying to start. Its weird when I first turn the key it sounds like it is starting for a second then just keeps turning over by the starter. I pulled some data off the icarsoft that maybe someone can understand
B4/6 (rail pressure sensor) 5.20bar
Calculated Value b4/6 rail pressure sensor 3254.50 bar
Specified b4/6 rail pressure sensor 10.10bar

The camshaft sensor is some knockoff from autozone so maybe it went bad after a month? I installed this crankshaft sensor yesterday (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001COAS78/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o02_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1)

THINGS I DONT THINK ARE RELATED BUT WONDERING WHY THE NUMBERS ARE SO OFF
B10/6 evaporator temperature sensor -273.04
Intake air temperature sensor -273.14
Coolant temp sensor -273.14

Also this morning after trying the first start the check engine light did come on. I got excited thinking it was a new code but it was still the same 3 codes. Once I cleared them the check engine light never came on but those same 3 codes did

Midwestdrifter
11-02-2018, 04:34 PM
I would suspect the cam sensor myself, as non bosch parts have a bad track record. I am not familar with the MBII, so those pressure values are hard to interpret. You normally need around at least 250bar to start reliably. If the ECU does not see the cam sensor signal, or the signal is off, the fuel won't be injected at all, or it will be injected into the wrong stroke.

The glow codes won't stop the van from starting in texas weather, and the cam code is your best bet for a no-start.

Aqua Puttana
11-02-2018, 04:35 PM
...

THINGS I DONT THINK ARE RELATED BUT WONDERING WHY THE NUMBERS ARE SO OFF
B10/6 evaporator temperature sensor -273.04
Intake air temperature sensor -273.14
Coolant temp sensor -273.14

...
Those values sound like some sort of failure defaults. They may be related to no start.

vic

wisdomracer
11-02-2018, 04:44 PM
I have seen those values before when the van was starting so not sure. I could see the cam sensor going bad but if that happened would it throw it in limp home mode and still allow me to drive the 10 mins back home? I called up my dealer and its $110 for the camshaft sensor. Is there a cheaper place online to buy OEM sprinter parts?

Midwestdrifter
11-02-2018, 04:45 PM
Those values sound like some sort of failure defaults. They may be related to no start.

vic

-273C corresponds to absolute zero. Since most sensors can't read that low, I would assume that the scanner is having communication errors.

The ECM usualy defaults to a high temperature if a sensor is bad or not plausible. As assuming an overheat is much safer than the opposite.

Bobnoxious
11-02-2018, 04:51 PM
Multiple codes may be indicative of a ground faults. Suggest inspect gound distributions.

I am not a paid MB spokesperson. To avoid frustration, buy genuine MB parts, especially, sensors.

Subtle differences in materials and manufacturing of aftermarket parts will only cause grief and aggravation, may receive incorrect part for your vehicle's application and never go by the previous part because it could be incorrect.

Only a "competent" and "experienced" MB parts counterperson will know for certain and, that's a 50-50 crapshoot.

Schematics from 94 SM.

Aqua Puttana
11-02-2018, 04:54 PM
... I could see the cam sensor going bad but if that happened would it throw it in limp home mode and still allow me to drive the 10 mins back home? ...
Yep. Once started, a cam sensor failure/loss of signal sets a LHM rpm limit somewhere below 4200 rpm, but not low enough that an operator may notice during typical driving.

...

The ECM usualy defaults to a high temperature if a sensor is bad or not plausible. As assuming an overheat is much safer than the opposite.
:idunno:

The ECM aka ECU can be programmed to recognize/respond to a high or low default. Open vs shorted?

:cheers: vic

wisdomracer
11-02-2018, 04:56 PM
yes I agree I originally only bought the knockoff trying to throw parts to figure out a no start problem before, that ended up being leaking fuel lines. I do need to buy the OEM camshaft sensor. Also I have cleaned the grounds a few weeks ago so Im thinking that is not the problem. I unplugged most of the front sensors yesterday and blew them out to make sure there was no water.

Midwestdrifter
11-02-2018, 04:56 PM
Yep. Once started, a cam sensor failure/loss of signal sets a LHM rpm limit somewhere below 4200 rpm, but not low enough that an operator may notice during typical driving.


:idunno:

The ECM aka ECU can be programmed to recognize/respond to a high or low default. Open vs shorted?

:cheers: vic

That is a good point. An open circuit would read as a very low temp? Hard to say what the ECMs fault logic is.

The evap temp sensor is connected to the ATC unit, while the intake and coolant sensors are part of the ECM suite. It would be interesting if these all share a wire bundle, I have not looked closely enough to tell.

wisdomracer
11-02-2018, 04:59 PM
Ok maybe it is the camshaft sensor then. This limp home mode I seemed to still have good power but the trans would shift up and keep the RPMs low although I could still get above 70mph. The LHMs I had before it cut the turbo and I could barely get to 60mph.

wisdomracer
11-02-2018, 05:09 PM
Where is a good place online to get OEM parts online? Does $110 for a camshaft sensor seem right?

Midwestdrifter
11-02-2018, 05:11 PM
europarts SD 40$
https://europarts-sd.com/item.asp?cID=102&PID=264

Apparently Hella is the OEM supplier.

wisdomracer
11-02-2018, 05:26 PM
You guys are my heros! I just checked and I kept my old camshaft sensor so decided to swap them out and sure enough the van started right up. I also did just order an extra one from ueroparts. Thank you all for the help!

Midwestdrifter
11-02-2018, 05:28 PM
Autozone garbage strikes again.... I would return that sensor if you can. That way maybe they will get the message and pressure their supplier some...

wisdomracer
11-02-2018, 05:31 PM
Yup I assumed it would go bad faster but not that much faster! I will go into autozone and see but Im not sure exactly when I bought it