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View Full Version : How bad is it..? belt shredded & hose busted


rafikiwilliams
08-01-2016, 10:28 PM
Well - just 1300 miles into the road trip AAA became my best friend. Was touring around in the Badlands of south dakota when we heard a not so normal noise. We pulled into the nearest pull off and before we were able to park the transmission disengaged and would no longer go in gear.

This is when i turned everything off, looked under the van and saw a transmission hose leaking fluid, and under closer investigation, the hose was busted in half.

After some more time under the van, I notice the serpentine belt had frayed 2-3 ribs...

Give it to me straight, how bad is it? Any chance the transmission was smart enough to shut down to prevent damage?

:cry:

The sprinter shop in Rapid City (www.eddiestruckcenter.com) can't look at it until Thursday, I always like to know as much as I can when chatting with shops, so any thoughts/input would be greatly appreciated

sailquik
08-01-2016, 10:41 PM
rafikiwilliams,
Do you have a transmission dipstick?
If all the fluid was pumped out, you probably damaged the transmission.
If there is still fluid in the transmission, maybe you got lucky and it just needs a new trans to radiator line and to be refilled with fluid.
Hope this helps,
Roger

rafikiwilliams
08-01-2016, 10:54 PM
unfortunately I didn't think about a dipstick to check the tranny fluid. I had to get a rental car and head down to Denver for a few time sensitive engagements. Going to be back in Rapid City come Thursday/Friday.

If I recall correctly, the hose was still leaking a fair bit when I crawled under.

Do you happen to know is the tranny has any kind of internal safe guard to "try" and prevent damage?

autostaretx
08-01-2016, 11:35 PM
At the lower left corner of your 2nd photo is what appears to be a chewed-up wiring harness???

--------------
Do you happen to know is the tranny has any kind of internal safe guard to "try" and prevent damage?

There are many things which will trigger it into "limp home mode" ... where it won't shift out of your current gear until you stop, then it won't shift into anything other than 2nd and reverse.
So it does have some save-my-bacon programming, yes.

--dick

rafikiwilliams
08-01-2016, 11:52 PM
At the lower left corner of your 2nd photo is what appears to be a chewed-up wiring harness???

--------------


There are many things which will trigger it into "limp home mode" ... where it won't shift out of your current gear until you stop, then it won't shift into anything other than 2nd and reverse.
So it does have some save-my-bacon programming, yes.

--dick

Not a wiring harness, that is the hose from the radiator to the tranny, completely severed in half.

I'll keep my fingers crossed on the save-my-bacon programming. Cant say ive had much luck with my sprinter ownership.

cdman1674
08-02-2016, 03:29 AM
Does anyone have an idea what could have caused the transmission line to fail like this? It doesn't appear that enough of the belt frayed to have cut the hose?

rafikiwilliams
08-02-2016, 03:33 AM
Also a good question... Just had tranny serviced a few months ago too... I would think they'd had noticed if it were worn

Aqua Puttana
08-02-2016, 01:14 PM
The belt cording is very strong. It can rip up a hose if it gets flying, whipping, or wrapped around it.

Also a good question... Just had tranny serviced a few months ago too... I would think they'd had noticed if it were worn

Or maybe they didn't notice if the transmission hose was rubbing against the harmonic balancer ...

Chicken or the egg.

Did the belt fail and take out the hose, or did the hose rub through and cause the belt to fail to further shred the hose?

I don't have answers, only questions.

vic

TJD
08-02-2016, 01:25 PM
Hi- I had the same thing happen to me at freeway speed,was able to coast to a stop. Looking underneath I saw everything was soaked with trans fluid. I found a local transmission shop with my phone (Santa Barbara) that said they would check it out. Anyway, long story short $900 and two days later everything is fine. New serp belt, new hose and fluid. Luckily insurance paid the tow. Hope this helps

terra_firma
08-02-2016, 01:32 PM
All the more reason to "armor" that transmission line i guess?

Cole
08-02-2016, 02:17 PM
I had the same thing happen a few years ago.

I fixed it on the side of the road with about $40 in parts from the local parts store.

A couple of barbed hose fittings, hose clamps, new fluid and new belt and it's been fine. Took about 40min to fix in a parking lot.

Aqua Puttana
08-02-2016, 02:30 PM
I had the same thing happen a few years ago.

I fixed it on the side of the road with about $40 in parts from the local parts store.

A couple of barbed hose fittings, hose clamps, new fluid and new belt and it's been fine. Took about 40min to fix in a parking lot.
Good point.

The stubs on the hoses are long enough.

Do you recall the hose barb size?

vic

Cole
08-02-2016, 02:35 PM
Good point.

The stubs on the hoses are long enough.

Do you recall the hose barb size?

vic



I don't remember, pretty sure it was standard transmission cooler hose size. Mine was shredded in a way that I had to add a length of hose to it.

When mine broke I had to walk to the parts store. The closest one was an O'riley's and they had everything in stock. (So not exactly an import or Mercedes parts wearhouse)

Mine has been patched for about 30k miles now without issue.

Midwestdrifter
08-02-2016, 02:52 PM
Those hoses are fairly low pressure. If needed the ferrules can be cut off and new rubber hose added. There is a good chance the trans is fine.

Cole
08-02-2016, 03:24 PM
. There is a good chance the trans is fine.

I agree.

Running an auto trans "slightly" low over a long period of time reduces the pressure on the clutch plates enough to let them wear against each other and wear down. Which is usually the result of a slow leak.

Dumping all the fluid in one fast action usually takes *all* the pressure away from the clutches and torque converter, so nothing is really wearing itself out, especially in a short distance.


When mine broke I also had to take an educated guess on the fluid level. Think I put in 3-4 quarts. Bought a factory dip-stick the next day and was within 1/2q

smrl
08-02-2016, 03:25 PM
When I was visiting Doktor A he informed me of this very failiure and suggested I put another split chunk of hose along that line directly underneath the belt to prevent just this situation. He remarked that he was surprised such a critical transmission line would run there and without any sort of shielding was a design oversight. Sounds like he must have seen this a few times, you could ask him about it but it does seem to me based on his description that it was the belt.


2006 t1n 140"

CharlesinGA
08-02-2016, 03:34 PM
Those hoses are fairly low pressure. If needed the Hercules can be cut off and new rubber hose added. There is a good chance the trans is fine.

I've never heard it called this, but if you are referring to the permanent crimp sleeve on the ends of the rubber hose, you are correct, they should be fairly easy to cut off with some care, and new hose slipped on the beaded metal tube and clamped. A fuel injection hose clamp would work nicely on this. There is practically no pressure in this line, it goes from the transmission to the radiator cooler and then back to the transmission where it dumps open into the pan.

The tube has a large bulge or bead to act as a hose stop, so you cut the crimp sleeve with care. A dremel with an abrasive disk would work to score or completely cut the sleeve, but at the very back, where the rubber ends, I would stop before reaching this.

I will be doing this soon, as I plan on adding a cooler (long thin one like the Upscale one that is no longer available). I will take pics and post them when I do.

I have measured the tubes and suspect that the hose is 10mm ID which is 3/8. The tubes measure at about 11mm, and 10mm is a common European hose size for transmission fluid. (8 mm is the other from what I have found, which happens to be 5/16)

A couple of members of the View/Navion Forum on Yahoo have had this happen in the past. No one mentioned transmission problems. There is still enough fluid to keep the pump wet and lubed till it is shutdown.

The OP's biggest problem will be finding the correct transmission fluid, and a dipstick.

The belt cording is very strong. It can rip up a hose if it gets flying, whipping, or wrapped around it. vic

Think WEED EATER STRING !!!

Charles

CharlesinGA
08-02-2016, 03:55 PM
This is a pic on how to remove the sleeves from the hose. I have done this on air conditioner lines in the past to preserve the specially bent end tubes. Its quite easy if you are careful and understand what NOT to cut.

Second pic is one I took showing how I used a 24 inch Harbor freight breaker bar and a old industro 11/16 socket I have to move the tensioner. 11/16 is a little loose but a good fit nonetheless. I keep the breaker bar, the socket, 1/8 drill bit, and the OLD belt in the tool bag in the motorhome. I had heard of the belt cutting the transmission line, figured at 10 years it probably should be replaced, Continental 6PK2260, AutohausAZ $28.29

http://www.autohausaz.com/search/product.aspx?searchtype=partnumber&partnumber=6pk2260&searchbutton.x=12&searchbutton.y=13

Charles

surlyoldbill
08-02-2016, 04:40 PM
I read about this possibility years ago and added a piece of split pipe over the tranny hose under the belt. I think a piece of 1" ID channel would also work. Hold in place with tape and zip ties.

terra_firma
08-02-2016, 05:51 PM
When I was visiting Doktor A he informed me of this very failiure and suggested I put another split chunk of hose along that line directly underneath the belt to prevent just this situation. He remarked that he was surprised such a critical transmission line would run there and without any sort of shielding was a design oversight. Sounds like he must have seen this a few times, you could ask him about it but it does seem to me based on his description that it was the belt.


2006 t1n 140"


This is exactly what dr a told me when i visited him a few years back

obie
08-02-2016, 09:26 PM
Is the Harmonic balancer in good shape?

Nigebirch
08-03-2016, 02:48 PM
Charles,

Thanx for your post and the post on the V/N forum. Your photos are veryhelpful. However, I am wondering if you linked to the correct serpentine belt, at least for the 2006 Sprinter. Here is what your link brought up:

"CRP-Contitech 6PK2260 - Serpentine Belt
This Part Doesn't Fit Your 2006 Dodge Sprinter 3500 Base."

For the record, I, too, was told by Dr. A. a few years ago when he serviced my 2007 Navion (2006 Sprinter) to get a length of hose, split it and zip tie it over the transmission hose to protect it should the serpentine belt decide to go belly up.

cdman1674
08-03-2016, 03:13 PM
Can anyone be kind enough to suggest the type of hose that should be used to protect the transmission line as this will be my next project. Also any pictures would be greatly appreciated , thank you

Aqua Puttana
08-03-2016, 03:49 PM
Can anyone be kind enough to suggest the type of hose that should be used to protect the transmission line as this will be my next project. Also any pictures would be greatly appreciated , thank you
http://sprinter-source.com/forum/showthread.php?p=59394#post59394

obie
08-03-2016, 04:40 PM
Just a length of heater hose perhaps?

Nigebirch
08-03-2016, 10:13 PM
Can anyone be kind enough to suggest the type of hose that should be used to protect the transmission line as this will be my next project. Also any pictures would be greatly appreciated , thank you
As I recall, Dr. A. said a cut length of garden hose would work. I used some heavy-duty, thick clear plastic tubing I had in the garage, left over from a pond water-pump project. I used tie downs to secure it. Let me know if you'd like some pictures, and I'll snap a few.

AdrianD
08-05-2016, 09:54 AM
A couple of cents from me...

Ravenol transmission fluid (I know it's not available in the US) has a horrible smell, which I think is good if you have a large leak, you will smell it.

When a transmission cooler line came off in the driveway, I got a code P0700 (did not check in detail) along with a check engine light, so if you did not get any codes, you might not have lost a ton of fluid.

Non-oil rated hoses will work in a pinch but be quick to replace them. I used such a hose as the power steering pump feed and it ruptured in about a week.

cdman1674
08-05-2016, 01:27 PM
Seems like a piece of plastic flex water pipe might protect better than just a rubber water hose? What do you think... I still haven't done the job but I've been thinking about it.

Aqua Puttana
08-05-2016, 01:53 PM
Seems like a piece of plastic flex water pipe might protect better than just a rubber water hose? What do you think... I still haven't done the job but I've been thinking about it.
I was thinking the same thing. PEX might be good. One concern would be how the material would react to the impact in really cold weather. It might just crack/shatter. :idunno:

A section of formed metal sheet similar to an equipment fan belt guard would probably provide the best protection. It would make a bunch of warning noise should the fan belt start whipping against it. I have no idea how difficult that would be to fabricate and install.

Looking at my 2004 there is some contour of the hose to follow. Adding a piece of slit hose is probably easiest. It improves the situation even though it may not be 100%. It isn't like shredded transmission hoses come up as a subject here often, but it is shown that the consequences of a whipping belt can be pretty disastrous.

The cable ties or metal hose clamps holding the slit hose in place may also provide some protection.

:cheers: vic

Cole
08-05-2016, 02:08 PM
The other option is just to insert a longer hose when repairing it. That lets the hose hang down further away from harm.

terra_firma
08-08-2016, 03:44 PM
I just used a larger diameter coolant hose slit down the middle with some zip ties as per the "cheap tricks" thread

rafikiwilliams
08-23-2016, 01:08 AM
Just an update. No damage done to the transmission. Cost me a hefty $1100 for the replacement of the belt, replacement of the hose, and a transmission service. But I can't complain, I've been back on the road and going strong.

soflo316
08-27-2016, 07:06 PM
This happened to me on a 3500 mile trip 2 years ago. One of my idler pulleys broke and that started the chain reaction. Got really lucky with MB of Hagerstown in Maryland, they took car of it for $922. That included lot's of cleaning underneath and all around the engine bay, 2 new pulleys, belt, and fan clutch.

Prior to the trip I had changed out the tensioner and belt trying to avoid this. Unfortunately I did not change the pulleys because I ran out of time! (foolish in the end).
Best,
Todd