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xeonx2
09-30-2008, 08:30 PM
We had a fellow from out of town stop in with a fuel leak. We removed the upper cover and after some cleaning could see the very 1st injector blowing up fuel from the well. We pulled (after much carbon cleaning and twisting) the injector out and could see it was cracked above the pintle. New injector ordered and installed.Went to crank up and the vehicle would not start. All-Data has very limited info. We have no error lights on dash, we have 60 psi out of lift pump to mech pump. We do not normally work on diesels so I do not have a guage for the high side of system. We did wave the cam and crank sensor and they seem fine. The only code is #1 glow plug issue. What am I missing ?

talkinghorse43
09-30-2008, 09:15 PM
Must be no fuel - injectors not firing. Since it was running, probably due to something you inadvertantly did during repair. Did you disconnect the neg batt terminal before repair? Are all the sensors on the fuel rail connected (maybe disconnect and reconnect - after neg terminel disconnect)? Check the work area for disconnected sensor(s).

xeonx2
09-30-2008, 09:45 PM
You would think that..but we have went back over all connectors. Plugged and Unplugged, Cleaned terminals ect. Did not connected battery before repairs, but have since to see if something needed re set. I am down to checking injectors with a noid light and it seems kind of dim compared to other 12v injectors I have checked. From what I have read i should get high current to open the injector and then ramp down.Cranking I am 2 volts below battery upon cranking across all 5 injectors. Is this normal ?

xeonx2
09-30-2008, 09:57 PM
Well, Forget that thought.. I can hear the injectors energize with a stethoscope. I'll need to somehow check high pressure from mech.pump to injectors

jdcaples
09-30-2008, 10:08 PM
This is from a T1N service manual


STANDARD PROCEDURE
STANDARD PROCEDURE - INJECTOR
CLASSIFICATION
The classification of injectors into 3 classes
describes the quantity characteristic of the injector.
This will make it possible in the future to match the
engine software to the tolerances of the injector
within a more narrowly graduated range. Classification
can be clearly recognized, and assigned only by
means of a DRBIIIt.
Classified injectors can be recognized by the part
number and identification on the magnetic head (circle
with a number between 1 and 3 inside) (Fig. 9).
The number corresponds to the classification stage.
These general conditions equally apply if, as a
result of replacing an engine, carrying out repairs to
the cylinder head etc., the cylinder selective assignment
of the injectors or the engine control module
assignment may have changed. If proper attention is
not paid to the classification on these vehicles driveability
and smoking concerns could result.
If an injector is replaced, it is then necessary to
assign the classification number to the corresponding
cylinder with the DRBIIIt in the control module.
INJECTOR CLASSIFICATION PROCEDURE

(1) Turn ignition switch “ON”.
(2) Using a DRB IIIt and select ENGINE then
MISCELLANEOUS.
(3) Select LEARN INJECTORS.
(4) Using the up and down arrows, scroll to the
appropriate injector.
(5) Using the right and left arrows, set injector to
proper classification.
(6) Once injectors are classified, cycle ignition to
complete.

xeonx2
09-30-2008, 10:19 PM
I have read about the different classifications and thought that might be it, but due to being a no start instead of a poor performance issue, such as too rich or lean on a cylinder and I did not think I would have to re classify the remaining 4 injectors since i did not replace them. I kind of threw that idea out, but even so I unplugged the new injector, re set pcm/cleared any codes and plugged the old injector back in to the harness. Same thing.. Crank but wont start

Vito boy
09-30-2008, 10:27 PM
Sounds like air in the system.
Try starting it with a sniff of easy start or better still silicon spray.
If its been sitting for a while with an injector missing the fuel will have run back to the tank and they can be a pig sometimes to bleed up again.

xeonx2
10-01-2008, 12:40 AM
We bled all of the injectors at the inlet of the injectors while cranking. Seemed like it had volume but not as much pressure as i would expect, although i could be way off, we do no much diesel work at all. I tried a whiff of starting fluid and it seemed to want to start, but would not. Any help is very much appreciated

talkinghorse43
10-01-2008, 01:18 AM
So, sounds like you have fuel, but not pressure. The fuel rail has a pressure sensor on the front end and a pressure control valve on the back end. Maybe there's a problem with one of them so the pressure's not as high as it should be?

The pressure sensor is read by the ECM and the ECM controls the valve to control pressure in the rail. From my reading of the '03 service manual, if the pressure control valve receives no current from the ECM, then there will be no pressure built up. So, maybe the fuel pressure sensor is sending a false high pressure signal, or the pressure control valve is not receiving current from the ECM, or is faulty?

xeonx2
10-01-2008, 02:51 PM
Ok, I have fired it with a spritz of starting fluid and the fuel pressure goes to 69000 kpa @ 1500 rpm then drops to around 30000 kpa, and then stalls. What is the procedure and specs to test the pressure sensor and pressure control valve.
It also throws a p087 low fuel rail pressure code. That is the only code and it comes back and back
Thanks

jdcaples
10-01-2008, 04:27 PM
Go easy with the starting fluid. A friend of mine told me be broke an '87 300D's crankshaft using it to start his inline 5.

xeonx2
10-01-2008, 05:42 PM
We only spritzed it 2 times. I know what you mean, lack of lubrication and or hydroloc would not be good.
I wonder what the specs are for high side fuel pressure, after the mech. pump cranking ?

jdcaples
10-02-2008, 04:26 PM
This is from one of the T1N service manuals:


WARNING: HIGH-PRESSURE FUEL LINES DELIVER
FUEL UNDER EXTREME PRESSURE FROM THE
INJECTION PUMP TO THE INJECTORS. THIS
MAYBE AS HIGH AS 1600BAR (23,200PSI).

-Jon

Douglas Hicks
10-06-2008, 06:59 AM
For a short time I had a Ford Dsl van. Loud, hard to start, noisy, rattles. did I mention loud? Did not compare to my Sprinters. I was told not to use starting fluid, but silicone spray. Seems the silicone spray does not wash the oil from the cylinders.