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View Full Version : Help needed, Loss of power problem


tor148
05-15-2015, 01:38 PM
Hello all,
I have tried and searched all the posts to see if I could find a solution but it elludes me!

I bought this van used over a year ago and love it except for this problem.
Last year the problem was intermitent, and pretty much didn't poke it's head out in the last 6 months, but...
I drive mostly in town. Arround 30-40 mph. Some 60-65 mph but only for short stints. On may 5th I drove on the highway about 35 miles away doing about 70. Plenty of power no problems what so ever. Got to my location, was there about 15 min, went to leave and the problem was there. It was untill may 12th when I started it in the morning and drove away, no problems. but soon as i turned it off and then started it again the problem was back and has not left. I know, i am getting to the problem discription!!! just trying to set the mood!

So the problem.....
I start the van put in drive and push on the gas......what happens....
Even if I push the pedal to the floor I only get about 20% of the throtle. It's like after the 20% of the pedal nothing happens!!
So I am driveing with the pedal to the floor and it runs thru the gears at the following way
1 to2nd change at 1900 RPMS
2nd to 3rd change at 1900 RPMS
3rd to 4th change at 2500 RPMS
4th to drive change at 2200 RPMS

This is with the pedal full to the floor. But like I said it is only pulling the throtle about 20%.
Thats all she does.....I don't see any smoke out the side mirror as I drive.

Now, if I use the shifter and manually shift, I can tach up the RPMS to the rev limiter and just shift with the stick. But I still only have about 20% of the throtle even with the pedal all the way to the floor. When I shift with the gear lever, I can't see smoke out the side mirror as I drive, but one time last year before the winter a friend was behind me when I was shifting manually and said there was black smoke. That is the only time I could say there was smoke, but again I can't see it while I drive.

I have tried cleaning the EGR, no affect and drove with it disconnected(the electrical connection) to no change
I have checked the MASS air flow sensor, seams clean and I unpluged and drove with it off and no change
I checked the gate valve on the turbo and it is very stiff but does move, I beleve the stiffness is just from the spring on the vaccum diaphram. Even though it is stiff, it moves very smothly.
I pulled the vaccum line off of the turbo and heard air escape. As in there was a vaccum there and it was lost when I pulled the line off(the engine was off)
I started the van and tried to see if I felt a pull on the vaccum line, I beleive I did. I couldn't find my vaccum gage to check it for real.
I have tried the disconnect the batttery and reset it.
I have added a second battery, with a isolator solenoid to help with starting. I did that mid winter, the van was running fine but was hard to start if it was cold. Found out the main batttery was on its last leg anyways but now I have the second battery and starting is great!!!

I do have a Auto Engunuity(sp?) scanner with a mercedes add on. It never shows the CEL on. I took pictures of the screens when I did get codes and I also have included the engine label in case that helps!

After looking thru and searching the threads for these problems, I have surmized that it could be eithere the EGR, the boost control solenoid, mass air flow sensor, boost presure sensor.....
I really don't want to just trow parts at the problem if I can help it.

Ohh. I also have an ultra gage pluged into the obd port. I always watch engine load, MAP PSI, Intk temp, boost PSI, Engine temp, Rpm, Throtle position, and speed. The only difference in the readings from when the van works fine and when I don't have powere is the boost reading. When I have no power I believe the max boost I have seen is about 3 psi, but when I have powere it goes up to 16 or so psi (just from memory). While I am driving it is, i beleive, around 4 or 5ish.

So, any help would be greatly apprciated. I am located in Wildwood, NJ and the nearest dealer that works on sprinters is about 3 hours away!!!! Let alone a local mechanic!

Also to add, this morning it had the problem when I started out. Drove for about 20 min in town then had asome downtime ( I am and electrician) so I wrote this. When I went to start the van, had power! Drove around no problems, but as soon as I stopped and shut it down to go in to a job site then returned to van and started up and the problem was back????

Thanks in advance!

Tor

grangesand
05-18-2015, 07:08 PM
BINGO..!!!!!!!!!! :crazy:

Hi, I'm experiencing very much the same problem, which has been evident for a couple of years, but not quite to the same magnitude as you detail. I've learnt to drive around it or be prepared to buy a coffee while it gets over its hissy fit !!

Usually only lasts an hour, then starts immediately. Hence I'm thinking it's a fuel pressure issue, but as I only drive it occasionally ( 316cdi 4x4 camper conversion) I've not really worried about it.

On the road it loses power, maintains momentum & drive, but 2nd /3rd gear acceleration is woeful - 50% down, as noted above, I keep driving ( with bursts of hard acceleration ) & the issue resolves itself.

Last occasion was yesterday, at the MB dealer's workshop (there on another matter) when it died, their response late yesterday suggested it's injectors, however I'm not so sure..well not at $4500 to replace same.....!!!

Will keep you posted on any resolution..

:cheers:

NelsonSprinter
05-18-2015, 07:41 PM
Both (1&2) problems are a loss of turbo charged boost that can be caused by many factors including turbo hose lose connections, hose split leak, dirty MAF sensor or bad MAF connection, leaking turbo vacuum actuator hose, soot clogged EGR valve , leaking intercooler rad, lose charged air temp sensor etc

grangesand
05-18-2015, 08:06 PM
your reply will hopefully guide the MB muppets in sourcing the problem !!

cheers

Grangesand

surlyoldbill
05-18-2015, 09:27 PM
The dealer wanted to replace all the injectors because of a loss of turbo boost pressure?! yikes.

lowprofile
05-20-2015, 08:08 AM
I to had the same problems with my 06 3500, Had the same problems with local dealer not knowing what their doing and wanting to throw parts at it (beware of the stealer). I fixed my van by replacing one
injector after the replacement all the LHM went away. Was luckey found two injector's on this forum for $200 ea took a chance on them but they worked fine. Back to the dealer they either would not or could not
tell me that the van had a bad injector and I did pay them $280 to do a diagnostic test which I received O usable info on repairing the sprinter..

steven phelps
05-20-2015, 01:13 PM
my 2004 doing the same thing, almost all the time except the first few shifts sequences when cold. get really good power, shifting at 35 to 4000, then it drops down to 2200 shifts only and as stated by others feels like the throttle is not doing anything. i have a hum in the elctronic item on top of the intake manifold, it stays on even after the engine shuts off then stops when a click sound is heard (like a solenoid closing). the marks on top of that control say whaler or whalen on it. i dont know what it does or is supposed to be for. have orderd a service manual so as not to sound so stupid but it hansnt arrived yet. i posted this problem on here somewhere, but cannot find the post or any answers so am trying again hitchiking on this thread. please anyone can shed some light most appreciated

NelsonSprinter
05-22-2015, 01:29 AM
my 2004 doing the same thing, i have a hum in the elctronic item on top of the intake manifold, it stays on even after the engine shuts off then stops when a click sound is heard (like a solenoid closing). the marks on top of that control say whaler or whalen on it. i dont know what it does or is supposed to be for. have orderd a service manual so as not to sound so stupid but it hansnt arrived yet. i posted this problem on here somewhere, but cannot find the post or any answers so am trying again hitchiking on this thread. please anyone can shed some light most appreciated

The solenoid is on the Exhaust Gas Recirculation valve .
There is an online PDF of the service manual on here http://sprinter-source.com/forum/showthread.php?t=26431
You can find your other posts by clicking on your name on the left side of your post avatar

MarioSants
05-24-2015, 11:12 AM
im in the process of buying an 08 2500. I drove 3 hours to test drive it . As I pulled out of the dealership I noticed that THIS van didn't have the POP that others had. I thought that turbo was shot but dealer said that it was a simple fix...Mass Air Flow...said it just needed to be blown out...well its been about a month and the used car dealer in house diesel mechanic hasn't figured it out yet.....should I walk away from this deal? or offer him about 3-4k less than his asking price to cover potentially expensive repair./..thank you

sandiegoskip
05-24-2015, 05:16 PM
What each of you is describing is very typical of what we call - "two foot driver syndrome". Unlike in Asian products (until last year with Toyota's unintended acceleration issues), German vehicle shave a brake pedal throttle cut-out which prevents a stuck throttle from being able to override the braking. If you are even slightly resting a foot on the brake pedal, you will get the 20% power issue described above. It can also be a bad brake light switch (same switch us used for both systems) or an intermittent ground issue with the brake light switch. Have someone drive behind you to see if the brake lights are illuminated which you are feeling the 20% power issue.

surlyoldbill
05-24-2015, 05:45 PM
What each of you is describing is very typical of what we call - "two foot driver syndrome". Unlike in Asian products (until last year with Toyota's unintended acceleration issues), German vehicle shave a brake pedal throttle cut-out which prevents a stuck throttle from being able to override the braking. If you are even slightly resting a foot on the brake pedal, you will get the 20% power issue described above. It can also be a bad brake light switch (same switch us used for both systems) or an intermittent ground issue with the brake light switch. Have someone drive behind you to see if the brake lights are illuminated which you are feeling the 20% power issue.

LOL! :lol:

Several years ago I was puzzled by a car that passed me on the highway, accelerating, yet the brake lights were on. It took a while for me to figure out what was going on, but I surmised it was someone who had not been taught to drive correctly, and they had one foot on each pedal! I now see this quite often, and not to stereotype, usually around the large Asian Mall near where I live. Learning to drive as an adult must be a very different experience, and I suspect most of these immigrants attended the same driving school!

So, driving a car like a tank or other skid steer vehicle with two foot pedals is NOT GOOD.:thumbup:

grangesand
05-30-2015, 12:35 AM
Gidday tor148 & other "Sprinteretts ",
From my original post 19.5.2015 I've undertaken the following to hopefully solve my loss of power & no-go problems; some of it maybe applicable to your scenarios;
I've replicated the MB mechanical diagnosis below;

"Excessive injector leak back plus corrupt CAN signal from cam angle sensor"
Connect Xentry, carry out short test and check codes.
Locate stored codes for cam sensor an CAN signal to ECM.
Test wiring to cam sensor and confirmed OK.
Check cam sensor, unable to fault.
Remove engine cover and carry out injector leak back test.
All injectors leaking back excessively.
Quoted parts and reported back to owner.
Replaced cam angle sensor.
Remove fuel pressure regulator from fuel rail.
Rekit with new Orings & refit rail.
Replace fuel filter & bled fuel system
Clear faulty memory and tested vehicle

Parts;
MBA0149977045 O-ring kit $36AU
MBA6110920101 fuel filter $68AU
non MB part; Cam angle sensor $125 AU
indicative part costs provided as a guide only & yes, you may well buy cheaper; I just wanted it fixed...

Assessment;
Problem seems to have beenn rectified and have used vehicle as I'd normally would; No power loss and not been stuck waiting on it to get over it's hissy fit - I think it was more fuel pressure related but replacing cam sensor may have also eliminated a previously unknown issue.

So at this stage I'm a happy camper

Further work;
Replacing all injectors next week. Given the stupid part costs I received initially I did go $ hunting on the web. (eg, Repco Australia $900 ea !!)

I sourced injector quotes on the web, both new & remanufactured units, from UK, Romainia & locally in Australia
UK approx $190Au ea, Romania (Budapest) slightly less, Australian suppliers were approx $250AU
Eventually located an Australian supplier in Perth, Paul Hewlett, perthinjector@bigpond.com , Perth Injectors $420 AU inc tax new Bosch units.
Unfortunately my diesel mech wouldn't fit units if I supplied them..future possible liability issues should they fail etc..such is the way of the world these days..

trust this offers some assistance to similar Sprintettes !!

injectors I sourced are listed below but you need to check & compare your Bosch part numbers carefully against your vehicle's specific VIN #;

Mercedes Sprinter 316cdi 2.7ltr factory 4x4, Build date 11/2003
Bosch part # 0445110189
MB part # A6120700487
Eng; OM612981 DELA

NORTON
05-31-2015, 12:00 AM
Grangesand, I have found Vanworks at Dry Creek, Adelaide 08 8349 7446 good for sprinter parts, they also service and repair
murray

singlima
09-08-2016, 02:50 PM
I am experiencing intermittent turbo boost failure, particularly when it's over 80˚F ambient air temperature. This 2006 Sprinter 3500 with a 2.7L has already had the resonator replaced with an aluminum billet version; I've replaced the boost pressure sensor, and the boost temp sensor. I've tried to diagnose what might be happening in driving conditions when it does, but nothing is making sense other than outdoor temperature. I keep a Bosch code reader permanently installed in the OBDII port, and when the boost fails, pull over and clear the codes. It will be good for anywhere from 5 miles to 400 depending on ambient temperature and turbo load (mountains cause more failure). I've taken the turbo hoses off to check the amount of accumulated oil, and it appears normal. I would really like to find what might be the culprit as the car is a very handy utility vehicle, but the constant need for resetting this is getting intolerable...help!:thinking: