Xantrex Inverter/Charger

TJLee089

2013 Itasca Reyo 25R
Xantrex Inverter/Charger

I am starting a new thread following my "Battery Charging Issues" thread.

I have a 2013 Itasca Reyo with an Onan 3.6kw generator, a Schumacher Mity-Mite RVCDP55 power center (converter, charger, AC breakers, DC fuses), and a Xantrex xm 1000 1000 watt inverter.

I have learned that the Mity-Mite is really a float charger (~13.3 volts) and will never fully charge depleted house batteries using the generator. The engine alternator does fully charge the batteries, although I'm not sure how long this actually takes.

I'm considering swapping the Xantrex inverter out for a Xantrex Inverter/Charger Freedom HF 1000w/55A, which includes a 3 stage charger which should fully charge the battery from the generator in a reasonable time. The wiring looks similar to the inverter only and I'm hoping it would be a drop-in installation. I need to check on this.

My question is would charging via the inverter charger conflict with the "float" charger on the Mity-Mite. If so, I'm not sure I could "defeat" the Mity-Mite charger. If not, is this even worth it compared to just running the engine when necessary and charging via the alternator. On a recent 5 day "boondock," I found it waste of time to try and charge the house batteries with the generator. I'm still learning.

Any input/suggestions/advice would be appreciated.
 

SullyVan

2005 T1N Conversion
When charging from a generator, you cannot practically charge your batteries to full. The last 10% takes much, much longer than the other 40%.

For this reason, when charging from the generator, it is common practice to deplete batteries to 50%, then dump amps into them using only the bulk charging state to get them up to 90% or so.

If charging from a generator, you do not even enter the 3rd stage of a 3 stage charger. Unless your generator is running all day. So... getting the 3 stage Xantrex just for generator use is a waste. Any charger properly bulk charging at 14.4vdc will work. That other float charger could then be used at home, when you leave the batteries sitting.

You can defeat the other charger by identifying where its 110vac input is and put a switch inline.
 

TJLee089

2013 Itasca Reyo 25R
When charging from a generator, you cannot practically charge your batteries to full. The last 10% takes much, much longer than the other 40%.

For this reason, when charging from the generator, it is common practice to deplete batteries to 50%, then dump amps into them using only the bulk charging state to get them up to 90% or so.

If charging from a generator, you do not even enter the 3rd stage of a 3 stage charger. Unless your generator is running all day. So... getting the 3 stage Xantrex just for generator use is a waste. Any charger properly bulk charging at 14.4vdc will work. That other float charger could then be used at home, when you leave the batteries sitting.

You can defeat the other charger by identifying where its 110vac input is and put a switch inline.
I think I understand you that the Xantrex inverter/charger will not realistically fully charge depleted batteries using a generator - it would take way too long for the float charge. But since my current charger on the converter only puts out 13.3 volts and the Xantrex would put out 14.6-14.8 volts during the bulk charge, wouldn't the Xantrex get me to about 80% using the generator much faster than the current 13.3 volt charger?

My goal is to be able to watch TV (120 volt, ~90 watts) for a couple of hours in the evening without having to run the generator for 2-3 hours to recharge. I have confirmed that the power and signal cables for the Xantrex inverter/charger are compatible with my existing Xantrex inverter, so installation should be very simple - no new holes, switches, wires. Yes, I expect that a simple bulk charger would be much less expensive, but, if permanent, would require some real estate, wiring, and switches.

Am I missing something? Your comments are appreciated.
 

Graphite Dave

Dave Orton
A solar panel does a very good job of charging that last 10%. It can do all your charging depending on power usage, panel size and access to sun.

All I use is a 205 watt panel for all my charging. My major electrical power use is a 4 amp refrigerator. I do occassionaly use the 600 watt microwave. 2 minutes of microwave uses 2% of the battery capacity. I also use the water pump and LED lights which are a minor use of power. I do have a vehicle powered inverter for 120 volt power with engine running. That is my backup charging source if there are multiple non-sunny days. It powers my Magnum MSS1012 house inverter/charger/transfer switch for charging.The normal routine is to see 94% state of charge (SOC) in the morning after starting with 100% SOC before dark the day before. By noon I am back to 100% SOC on a sunny day. I never use a generator or shore power. The only exception is I use shore power at home before a trip to get the refrigerator to operating temperature so I start trip at 100% SOC.
 

TJLee089

2013 Itasca Reyo 25R
A solar panel does a very good job of charging that last 10%. It can do all your charging depending on power usage, panel size and access to sun.

All I use is a 205 watt panel for all my charging. My major electrical power use is a 4 amp refrigerator. I do occassionaly use the 600 watt microwave. 2 minutes of microwave uses 2% of the battery capacity. I also use the water pump and LED lights which are a minor use of power. I do have a vehicle powered inverter for 120 volt power with engine running. That is my backup charging source if there are multiple non-sunny days. It powers my Magnum MSS1012 house inverter/charger/transfer switch for charging.The normal routine is to see 94% state of charge (SOC) in the morning after starting with 100% SOC before dark the day before. By noon I am back to 100% SOC on a sunny day. I never use a generator or shore power. The only exception is I use shore power at home before a trip to get the refrigerator to operating temperature so I start trip at 100% SOC.
I appreciate your comments about solar. My experience, however, is that we rarely camp in sunlight; usually it's in state parks under shade, sometimes with shore power. That's certainly our preference in hot weather. I don't mind running the generator; I would just like to run it for 1 hour/day, not 3 or 4. I can get the last 10% when I drive or with shore power. I rarely stay at one site more that 4-5 days.

Your 2 minutes of 600 w using 2% looks like capacity of 100 Ahr (600/10=60 amps; 60 X 1/30hr=2 Ahr; 2/0.02=100 Ahr), about the same as mine. Your 4 amp fridge at 50% running (guess/) would be about 48 Ahr/day. Your solar panel at 100% efficiency for 6 hr/day would be about 102 Ahr/day, best case. Sounds like this could work if all the stars (sun?) align.

Thanks for your input.
 

Graphite Dave

Dave Orton
I have a 255 amp-hr 8D AGM battery. Your calculations are about right if you use the correct watts for the microwave. The 600 watt microwave actualy draws 1140 watts for the 2 1/2 minutes for a cup of hot water.

FYI my battery supplier was negative about Xantrex products. I have a 600 watt pure sine inverter that I had purchased before hearing his comment. It has a high pitched whistle when running and it trips on high temperature days. Partially due to the enclosure I put it in. Will be modifying the enclosure for more air flow and may add an additional fan.
 
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TJLee089

2013 Itasca Reyo 25R
I recently replaced the (OEM) Xantrex Pro XM1000 inverter with a (3 stage) Xantrex HF 1055 inverter/charger on my 2013 Reyo 25R. Pretty much a drop in replacement. Didn't touch the converter/charger which only puts out about 13.3v. The new Xantrex bulk charges at 14.4v - MUCH faster. Straightforward installation.
 

wmclibby

New member
I'd like to also replace my xm1000 in our Winnebago View Profile. Have you published some of the details elsewhere? I would disconnect the schmacher rccdp55 etc. I have no problems with XAntrex. Been using them for many rears on sailboat w/o any problems. Thx.
 

Old Crows

Calypso 2014 View Profile
The Shumacher unit appears to be a three stage unit....Google is your friend.... http://www.irv2.com/forums/f101/do-i-have-a-multi-stage-converter-charger-188455-2.html

If your VP is a fairly new one, it probably has a Progressive Dynamics PD9245 power converter/charger. It's three stage + desulphering...

https://www.progressivedyn.com/prod_details/rv_conv/rv_converter_pd9145a_2.html

Why would you replace the XM1000?

http://www.xantrex.com/documents/Po...verters/975-0263-01-01_Rev-C(artwork) (1).pdf
 
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TJLee089

2013 Itasca Reyo 25R
I'd like to also replace my xm1000 in our Winnebago View Profile. Have you published some of the details elsewhere? I would disconnect the schmacher rccdp55 etc. I have no problems with XAntrex. Been using them for many rears on sailboat w/o any problems. Thx.
There really are no details to publish. Simply remove the inverter and install the inverter/charger. The latter is slightly longer; the wiring is the same. The remote controller/indicator is different but fits in the same space and uses the same connecting cable. If your OEM Shumacher is like mine and only puts out ~13.3 volts, the Xantrex charger simply overpowers it. No need to do anything with it. My installation is 19 months old and has performed flawlessly.
 

TJLee089

2013 Itasca Reyo 25R
The Shumacher unit appears to be a three stage unit....Google is your friend.... http://www.irv2.com/forums/f101/do-i-have-a-multi-stage-converter-charger-188455-2.html

If your VP is a fairly new one, it probably has a Progressive Dynamics PD9145. It's three stage + desulphering...

Why would you replace the XM1000?

http://www.xantrex.com/documents/Po...verters/975-0263-01-01_Rev-C(artwork) (1).pdf
My Schumacher is definitely not a 3 stage charger and is not the one your link points to. It is clearly marked 13.3 volts output. This makes it a trickle charger. Early in the game when boondocking, I ran the generator to charge the batteries and almost nothing happened. We learn from our failures.
 

TJLee089

2013 Itasca Reyo 25R
There seems to be a disconnect here and I apologize if I've confused things.

1. I replaced my Xantrex inverter with a Xantrex inverter/charger because my OEM converter/charger was really only a trickle charger.
2. If your OEM charger is truly a 3 stage charger, there is no advantage to doing what I did.

I hope this clarifies things.
 

TJLee089

2013 Itasca Reyo 25R
Even more confusion:

wmclibby indicated a Schumacher rccdp55 converter charger. I am almost sure this is a typo and should be rvcdp55, same as mine. If so, this is definitely a trickle, or float, charger which is essentially useless to charge a depleted battery. I was told by a Xantrex dealer that the Schumacher unit would cause no issues after replacing the Xantrex inverter with an inverter/charger. That has proved to be the case.
 

wmclibby

New member
TJLee,

I've really enjoyed your project and comments. Our last dry camping convinced me that adding a 3 stage charger was a must and am looking to do that in the simplest way possible without tearing out the Rvcdp55. Our inverter is fine with lots of access etc. so plan on installing a Xantrex Charger adjacent to it which ditto's accessibility and also adjacent to our house batteries (1 bulkhead away). Do you advocate simply installing the unit, connecting the charger wires to bat's, ignore current trickle charge system and enjoy the benefits of smart charging? And/or are there some caveats you could suggest. Thank You in advance!

Bill

2013 View Profile G
 

TJLee089

2013 Itasca Reyo 25R
TJLee,

I've really enjoyed your project and comments. Our last dry camping convinced me that adding a 3 stage charger was a must and am looking to do that in the simplest way possible without tearing out the Rvcdp55. Our inverter is fine with lots of access etc. so plan on installing a Xantrex Charger adjacent to it which ditto's accessibility and also adjacent to our house batteries (1 bulkhead away). Do you advocate simply installing the unit, connecting the charger wires to bat's, ignore current trickle charge system and enjoy the benefits of smart charging? And/or are there some caveats you could suggest. Thank You in advance!

Bill

2013 View Profile G
Your approach is different than mine. As you know, I replaced the inverter with an inverter/charger. It has performed flawlessly. You propose to add a charger. I'm not sure of the implications of adding a separate charger. For example, where do you connect to AC to be safe and not interfere with the inverter? Can you simply tie in to the AC side of the inverter? I don't know. Perhaps Xantrex can advise.

On the other hand, I am confident that any serious 3 stage charge will simply overpower the OEM float charger. I don't know if there is any simple way to disable the charging function of the OEM device, since it is also the converter (AC to DC) for the rig. I simply ignored it, based on advice from a Xantrex dealer.

If you don't already have one, you should consider installing a battery monitor so you can see what's going on with your power systems.
 

wmclibby

New member
Thanks for the prompt reply. AC access is easily available and does not interfere with the Inverter. My Inverter is perfectly fine so the decision to just add a charger. I would disconnect the oem charger however not sure of what's going on there and don't want to screw up anything for the next owner. The electrical schematics for this RV are an Engineers minefield so If I did make alterations I would want to also update them which adds to the task. Perhaps a passerby with similar rig reads this, that has "done that" and can throw in on what I'm doing.

Again, I believe your ideas are simpler to accomplish the job with less destruction and still maintain a straight record for others to follow.
Cheers!
 

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