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View Full Version : Rusted hard lines on power steering rack


the brit
09-16-2013, 03:28 PM
The hard lines on my otherwise perfectly functioning power steering rack have died. The rack has been removed, and the fitting came out just fine, so rather than spending the $250-$400 for a rebuilt rack I was hoping to flare my own replacement lines.

The issue is that they use a seemingly unobtainable M11x1.25 line nut. I've been calling and searching around but just can't seem to locate any.. Even the 'metric specialist' at the local hydraulic couldn't seem to help out.

Has anyone else had this problem, and solved it with a new rack? I didn't see the hardlines available separately from the rack, which would be another solution.

TIA.

Boater
09-16-2013, 09:19 PM
I didn't find an actual outlet, but first link on google produced this:
http://www.brakequip.com/tubenuts.html
and they seem to have a locate a dealer function.

It does look as though these lines are not available separately, probably the steering gear manufacturer provides it as a pre-built assembly.

In fact I just spotted a footnote for the lines - "May not be replaced for safety reasons, replace steering" (presume that should read "replace steering box assembly").

the brit
09-16-2013, 09:38 PM
I didn't find an actual outlet, but first link on google produced this:
http://www.brakequip.com/tubenuts.html
and they seem to have a locate a dealer function.

It does look as though these lines are not available separately, probably the steering gear manufacturer provides it as a pre-built assembly.

Thank you.

I called BrakeQuip and they only have them with a 3/16" opening, where the stock line is 6mm. I gave in a ordered a rebuilt rack, which will come out to be $240 after I return the core. I also threw in some aftermarket tie-rod ends for about $30 to make everything on it new. Should be back on the road this week.

Boater
09-16-2013, 10:08 PM
No worries, see my edit - replacing the lines on the rack is not permitted anyway!

Dingo
09-17-2013, 11:26 AM
Simple repair , get hydraulics place to make up two core steel braid hoses with fitting to take banjo bolts , if you really want tot be swish get stainless overbraid as well

BQ8087 is the part number for the brakequip banjo you require , use dowty washers either side of the union . As long as you use wire cored hydraulic hose it will work as well as the steel rigids did .

Normally rigid pipes are used for space , ease of manufacture & cost .

Done this type of fix many times without problems everything from , large trucks / buses , car , vans , agricultural , even boats steering gear

have fun :cheers:


http://spokanehose.com/product.php?id=7076 is the link to the page i found the banjo's on , sorry having bad day , broken a driveshaft on a customers S500 , not seeing funny side of that one

Zymurgy
08-26-2018, 11:25 PM
I have a major hole from rust in the the exterior hard lines on the rack and pinion. I thought I would revive this old thread. I like Dingo's suggestion of using the banjo bolts. I absolutely don't want to remove the rack on my 04. I have had no problems with with the steering until the hard line rusted through. I have never even had to add fluid after 165,000 miles.

Anyone ever do this? I have never used banjo bolts, but I am game and Dingo's link still works for the bolts.

billintomahawk
08-27-2018, 03:35 AM
Mine on the '02 take flare nuts. I don't get his repair at all.
My lines are in rough condition.

http://www.brakequipproducts.com/product/brakequip-bq8087-banjo-bolt-m11-x-1-25

bill in tomahawk

Patrick of M
08-27-2018, 07:54 AM
Mine on the '02 take flare nuts. I don't get his repair at all.
My lines are in rough condition.

http://www.brakequipproducts.com/product/brakequip-bq8087-banjo-bolt-m11-x-1-25

bill in tomahawk

I think the repair concept is to use Bango bolts and lines instead of the flare nuts and lines. The idea being just grab some off the shelf bolts and lines and swap them in. Sounds good to me, as swapping in good hard lines can be quite difficult (sometimes impossible) in situ. The fact that changing lines is “not permitted “ is excessive, hydraulic failure in the steering system is hardly catastrophic, just a little Armstrong Steering until fixed.

Aqua Puttana
08-27-2018, 12:39 PM
I'm not clear on how a banjo bolt replaces a flare fitting either.

Back to the original fittings.

Assuming that the flare seal is formed by/in the replacement line, not the fitting itself.

Chop the hard line close to the original flare fitting. Use a six point socket to remove the fitting. Drill out, or otherwise rescue the fitting for re-use.

The flex line repair does sound reasonable. Can anyone offer insight (pictures?) on how the banjo bolts are applied? Does the steering rack fitting area have a flat surface allow a crush seal washer to be used?

:cheers: vic

billintomahawk
08-27-2018, 01:00 PM
Vic,
What would the banjo bolt thread into?


bill

Zymurgy
08-27-2018, 03:30 PM
Thanks for all the insight everyone the banjo bolts would thread right in to the rack and pinion I like the idea of trying to salvage the original I will definitely try to do that 1st cheapest for sure.

Also it's bull**** that it's a hazard I drove 30 miles home probably ruined my pump, but not much worse than a grain truck I drove as a kid without power steering.

Zymurgy
08-27-2018, 03:46 PM
One thing I find interesting, through all this is not an idiot lighte or an engine code has popped from this complete failure

Midwestdrifter
08-27-2018, 11:39 PM
The power steering is totally independent from the vehicle electronics. At cruising speed the PS doesn't provide much assist anyways. As long as the steering angle sensor matches the wheel angle, the electronics wont care. If you have no ESP, even a broken steering shaft won't set a code (though it may kill you!).

For safety reasons, even a complete failure of the power assist won't prevent you from steering, as the pinion is linked to the wheel with a shaft.

Zymurgy
08-28-2018, 06:08 PM
I hope to start to tackle this job this weekend. I will post my results. I don't know whether to be surprised or discouraged that no one has attempted to do this. My brake lines rusted through about 3 years ago, I guess I should have figured the same on the rack and pinion lines.

Zymurgy
10-31-2018, 08:35 PM
Update. I am back on the road. I had a small brake line rust through while I was working on the hard lines on the rack and pinion, so it sat. I didn't have enough room to work on it on my back. I took it to a local shop. He fabricated a new brake line first. He was able to reuse the original M11x 1.25 line nuts and then fabricate new lines. He made my day. Amazing my power steering pump was still fine after driving 30 miles dry.

Midwestdrifter
10-31-2018, 08:38 PM
Those gear pumps are really durable, even a small amount of oil will keep them happy for a long time (with no load).

Zymurgy
10-31-2018, 09:19 PM
Even happier now, just picked it up. A place that has been recommended to me, so first time. They didn't charge me a tow to the shop. To replace the hard lines on the rack $250. $150 to fabricate a new brake line.

I am a happy man!

Aqua Puttana
10-31-2018, 09:23 PM
Even happier now, just picked it up. A place that has been recommended to me, so first time. They didn't charge me a tow to the shop. To replace the hard lines on the rack $250. $150 to fabricate a new brake line.

I am a happy man!
:thumbup:

Did they replace with similar hard lines or flex? Reuse old fittings or new all the way?

:cheers:vic

Zymurgy
10-31-2018, 11:38 PM
:thumbup:

Did they replace with similar hard lines or flex? Reuse old fittings or new all the way?

:cheers:vic

He replaced with copper/nickel lines and was able to use the old fittings.

If anyone else needs this done and can't reuse the fittings I did find some on ebay that should work by Brake Hoses Unlimited.

Found the link https://www.ebay.com/itm/MALE-TUBE-NUT-M11-x-1-25-Bubble-Flare-3-16-Line-/331842259414?vxp=mtr&hash=item4d435709d6

Charly
01-14-2019, 05:38 PM
He replaced with copper/nickel lines and was able to use the old fittings.

If anyone else needs this done and can't reuse the fittings I did find some on ebay that should work by Brake Hoses Unlimited.

Found the link https://www.ebay.com/itm/MALE-TUBE-NUT-M11-x-1-25-Bubble-Flare-3-16-Line-/331842259414?vxp=mtr&hash=item4d435709d6

Removed my lines in the rack in the hope to replace with some others in better shape from another rack. However I found a white nylon type seal inside the hole where the fitting goes. It appeared to be crushed inside so I pulled it but it came out into pieces.

Did you guys had the same inner seal too or it could have been added by previous owner to stop a leak? Cannot seem to find any mention of the seal/washer anywhere... Thanks for the help.

Midwestdrifter
01-15-2019, 03:11 AM
Rebuilt steering racks sometimes have this face seal. My factory flared lines sealed fine on a rebuild rack without using those plastic seals. however a copper or aluminum sealing washer may sometimes be required to achieve a leak free fit. It all pans on the quality of the flare and the condition of the sealing face on the rack.

JSMI
03-24-2019, 03:09 PM
Sorry to hijack the thread. I'm on a road trip and kinda stuck in Chicago (it was a 3 day stop anyway). I think I have the same problem described in this thread. A hard line rusted out yesterday, and all the fluid leaks out in minutes. In the attached photo (found thru a Google search) it's the shorter line that rusted out. The local Napa store didn't know what to do because they hadn't seen a fitting like this before. It was late in the day so I had it towed to a dealership that was about to close.

Then I found this thread. Sounds like a hydraulic shop can remake the line for me. Would rather go that route than have the dealership replace the rack (I assume that is what they will tellme Monday morning).

Just asking the people who fixed a leaking line rather than replace the rack: was this the line that was rusted out? The fitting I have is different than what was pictured in the link to the online brake part supplier. My fittings have plastic or nylon pieces on the end. Wish I took a pic before it was towed away....

I have a 2002, 118, passenger. 215k miles. Love the dang thing, built like a tank...