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jb21cri
01-20-2013, 03:06 PM
have been experiencing cold temp. starts.its as if the glow plugs are not heating,after doing bill's mod and buying the new module at ueroparts and now hooking them to a momentary switch via the mod fuse box directly to battery,it starts or i should say does'nt start like the plugs are not heating.i'm getting 12v to the disconnected glow plug wire at the plug,i took out #1 gp and bench tested it as i thought maybe the 1 year old gps had shorted.it lit up just as it should,which leads me to believe the other 4 gps are good as they ohm out at the external fuse block mod.when removing #1 gp i did notice that was gunked up and almost wet as if it had never been heated.short of taking a plug out and testing on the top of the motor with the harness still connected i am at a loss.i did scan it on a snap-on solus and came up with 2 maf sensor codes.could this have anything to do with the no cold start?it runs and starts fine when warm.i'm using desiel power additive in the fuel and the fuel filter was replaced about 5000 miles ago at the most.fuel rail pressure was 4650 when running during the last scan.any ideas would be greatly appreciated as it is cold here and this is my main transpo as well as my work van.thanks,jb.:thinking:p.s.it started right up with a very small squirt of ether in the intake box,yea i know,but i had to resort to it for the first time this morning at 15f and its only going to get colder the next couple of days.

surlyoldbill
01-20-2013, 03:37 PM
It wouldn't hurt to get a can of MAF cleaner and try it.
Also, I wonder about the ground strap to the engine block?

Aqua Puttana
01-20-2013, 03:51 PM
The syptoms you describe for an OM612 diesel engine are often related to low fuel rail pressure during cranking. There are seals in the fuel rail which can deteriorate over time and leak pressure internally. When it is cold the seals may leak even more.

You need to read the fuel rail pressure during cranking. It needs to be at least 2900 psi for reliable starting. There are posts about the seal replacement if you search from the blue bar above.

How old are the MAF codes?

This is information, not a diagnosis. vic

surlyoldbill
01-20-2013, 05:06 PM
If low rail pressure, the o-rings in the rail pressure sensor/valve/whatever at the rear of the engine next to the firewall are a known problem. Dr A has a kit of the proper replacements that I installed years ago. The device is difficult to remove, but it can be done from above and below the engine.
I had a no hot start issue that turned out to be a bad injector leaking (hot thin) fuel back to the return fuel line, thus reducing rail pressure when attempting to start. You have a cold start problem, so it's probably something else.

jb21cri
01-20-2013, 06:56 PM
thanks for the fast replies,i might try the fuel filter first,but i am leaning towards fuel rail pressures.won't have access to scanner till tomorrow.will keep my progre:thumbup:ss posted.jb.

jb21cri
01-20-2013, 07:01 PM
forgot.the maf codes are new but reaccuring after clearing them.i have cleaned the maf twice in the last 5000 miles.van runs fine after it starts.jb.

A.Hayes
01-21-2013, 04:13 AM
A slow air leak at one of the clear fuel line connections (usually at the fuel filter) can cause a cold no start. '02-'03 OM 612 Sprinters pull fuel to the engine via mechanical low pressure pump on the front of the engine. So as a result of the suction (rather than a elec fuel pump pressurizing the line) seal failures tend to draw air in rather than leak fuel out. After the van has been sitting a bit, it easy to tell if a large air bubble has settled at the high bend in the line just under the EGR. Also, when running, it helps to shine a light on the lines coming off the filter to see any bubbles.
May not be your issue, but it's a pretty easy thing to check.

jb21cri
01-21-2013, 07:06 PM
i ordered a fuel filter to low pump line because i'm missing the white retaining clip at the filter side.i have looked for air in lines before and not seen any.i will install the new line and maybe a new filter along with it just to eliminate those 2 components.weathers too cold to do much for next day or 2.scanned it again with cam sensor unplugged and cranking fuel rail pressure was 3900 psi,but that was with a warm motor.could the pressure be affected by the 10F temps and then when warm go back to normal?

jb21cri
01-28-2013, 09:02 PM
so today i replaced the fuel filter and low pump to filter line now i am seeing air in the line when running and not running.i don't know if this is a result of replacing these parts or maybe the old fuel line just was'nt clear enough anymore.the good news is i got the freeze plug out for my block heater install,mapp gas was'nt enough,so i had to break out the blue wrench,came out easily even with the 12 point socket that i ended up using.now on to the air leak.when i changed the filter and line i lost the prime,i then pressurized the fuel tank and still nothing appeared in the line that i replaced.i also vacced fuel at the point where the line attatches to the low pump but it kept flowing back to the filter finally i resorted to ether and more cranking than i was comfortable with ,but it did start only now i can clearly see that air is intruding.any thoughts?jb.

surlyoldbill
01-29-2013, 01:32 AM
so today i replaced the fuel filter and low pump to filter line now i am seeing air in the line when running and not running.i don't know if this is a result of replacing these parts or maybe the old fuel line just was'nt clear enough anymore.the good news is i got the freeze plug out for my block heater install,mapp gas was'nt enough,so i had to break out the blue wrench,came out easily even with the 12 point socket that i ended up using.now on to the air leak.when i changed the filter and line i lost the prime,i then pressurized the fuel tank and still nothing appeared in the line that i replaced.i also vacced fuel at the point where the line attatches to the low pump but it kept flowing back to the filter finally i resorted to ether and more cranking than i was comfortable with ,but it did start only now i can clearly see that air is intruding.any thoughts?jb.

Search for the NUMEROUS posts about changing the fuel filter and dealing with air getting in the lines from one of the 6 holes in it (02-03). Also, "priming" the fuel filter; I've had to back-fill the line going to the tank, and then quickly connect it and go crank the engine. Since we have a sucker pump on the front of the engine instead of a pusher in the tank, that first start after filter change can be...fun.

I now only change fuel filter when I have a full tank, it makes it easier to back-fill if I have to.

NelsonSprinter
01-29-2013, 03:26 AM
To prime the filter/ fuel system you need to vac from the line going to the return valve from the HP pump, not the line going to the LP pump from the filter. That will get most air out.
It is common for air to circulate up to 15 minutes after re-prime, even if there is no leak

jb21cri
01-30-2013, 01:49 PM
yesterday i took the van out for 4-5 miles and sure enough the air in line dissappeared.i hope that was cause of the cold no start,but now i have a 250 watt pan heater as well as a 500 watt block heater installed.weather going down to 0 by weekend,so i'll know for sure then.

Allantuttle1
01-30-2013, 03:00 PM
I have a block heater and it works flawlessly. Love it.

jb21cri
04-01-2013, 12:16 PM
an update,after installing a block heater which i've been using for the last few months i called dr. a and after going over everything i had eliminated,fuel filter,fuel line to low pump,glow plugs and module,fuel rail components,andy suggested that with 315,000 miles on the motor that the starter might not be providing enough rpm at cold start.well i finally had a nice enough day to replace with a new bosch unit from europarts.i am happy to report that she starts like a champ now!the old starter did'nt really sound like it was that weak and once the motor was warmed up it started just fine.it will be interesting to see the internal condition when i rebuild the old starter to have as a spare.just thought i'd share the info to possibly help others that are experiencing cold start problems before they chase they're tails as i unknowingly did.not that i spent alot,but it sure was frustrating.thanks to dr.a.jb:cheers:

Aqua Puttana
04-01-2013, 02:12 PM
Checking for problems in a logical manner is not "chasing your tail". It is often a process of elimination. The starters don't have any real history of becoming "weak" that I know of. Changing the starter may have cured your particular problem this one time, but for someone to just begin by just changing the starter without any testing might be the first lap of a tail chasing frenzy.

Thanks for the feedback. :thumbup: So many times people don't bother to do that and it leaves the thread hanging. It's good to know that the starter itself could be a problem. vic

P.S. - Cables and connections are disturbed during a starter change. If the problem returns I wouldn't discount a cable problem.

an update,after installing a block heater which i've been using for the last few months i called dr. a and after going over everything i had eliminated,fuel filter,fuel line to low pump,glow plugs and module,fuel rail components,andy suggested that with 315,000 miles on the motor that the starter might not be providing enough rpm at cold start.well i finally had a nice enough day to replace with a new bosch unit from europarts.i am happy to report that she starts like a champ now!the old starter did'nt really sound like it was that weak and once the motor was warmed up it started just fine.it will be interesting to see the internal condition when i rebuild the old starter to have as a spare.just thought i'd share the info to possibly help others that are experiencing cold start problems before they chase they're tails as i unknowingly did.not that i spent alot,but it sure was frustrating.thanks to dr.a.jb:cheers:

MillionMileSprinter
04-01-2013, 02:52 PM
an update,after installing a block heater which i've been using for the last few months i called dr. a and after going over everything i had eliminated,fuel filter,fuel line to low pump,glow plugs and module,fuel rail components,andy suggested that with 315,000 miles on the motor that the starter might not be providing enough rpm at cold start.well i finally had a nice enough day to replace with a new bosch unit from europarts.i am happy to report that she starts like a champ now!the old starter did'nt really sound like it was that weak and once the motor was warmed up it started just fine.it will be interesting to see the internal condition when i rebuild the old starter to have as a spare.just thought i'd share the info to possibly help others that are experiencing cold start problems before they chase they're tails as i unknowingly did.not that i spent alot,but it sure was frustrating.thanks to dr.a.jb:cheers:

From my two year experience with my Sprinter and this forum, I would say that a LARGE part of the "no start" issues are fuel related with the '02 and '03 Sprinters. It has to do with the location of the fuel pump. Starting there is logical and where I always have people start when dealing with theses issues. I certainly wouldn't call it "chasing your tail". That's why Andy started you there, too. Now you know all those things are in good shape and if you have any problems in the future, you can do the fuel system a quick once over and you'll be better equipped to diagnose the problem.
Thanks for posting a follow up on the original problem. :thumbup: