Sprinter Running again but smoking.

marquimarl

marquimarl

Member
I rebuilt my Injectors and installed them.
It was hard to start but when it did the whole Garage filled with putrid Brown smoke.
That was because the shop had tried to start it for three weeks and I had cranked it over 100 times.

As I stated before the Shop was afraid to pull the injectors of a Sprinter with high miles like mine because they had to replace a motor they ruined once before.
I pulled them without incedent and had them tested, they were all clogged.

Warning
Do not use solvents to clean you fuel system. I used Acetone and it desolved the gunk in the tank which reformed in the injector tips when the acetone evaporated in the heat of the combustion chamber.

Back on track,
The Sprinter runs and idles good, although power is down.
The problem now is that it will not pass smog because of visible smoke.
The pertinate code is
P0105 Pressure sensor
"The EPC control light does not light."
"At hand off the Atmospheric pressure sensor the replace value will be determinate."
"The exhaust gas feedback is switched off."

This sensor was one of the things that the shop replaced.
 

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Turbo John

New member
marquimarl said:
I rebuilt my Injectors and installed them.
It was hard to start but when it did the whole Garage filled with putrid Brown smoke.
That was because the shop had tried to start it for three weeks and I had cranked it over 100 times.

As I stated before the Shop was afraid to pull the injectors of a Sprinter with high miles like mine because they had to replace a motor they ruined once before.
I pulled them without incedent and had them tested, they were all clogged.

Warning
Do not use solvents to clean you fuel system. I used Acetone and it desolved the gunk in the tank which reformed in the injector tips when the acetone evaporated in the heat of the combustion chamber.

Back on track,
The Sprinter runs and idles good, although power is down.
The problem now is that it will not pass smog because of visible smoke.
The pertinate code is
P0105 Pressure sensor
"The EPC control light does not light."
"At hand off the Atmospheric pressure sensor the replace value will be determinate."
"The exhaust gas feedback is switched off."

This sensor was one of the things that the shop replaced.
Click to expand...
When mine smoked......it was the glow plugs.......needed to replace 4
 
2

220629

Well-known member
Perhaps the gunk which was loosened by the acetone has also affected the operation of the high pressure fuel rail solenoid? That has fuel running through it too.

Sounds like you are getting close to normal operation now. Good luck. vic

Edit:
Here's the original thread for those not familiar with the issues/previous thread.

https://sprinter-source.com/forums/showthread.php?t=22275
 
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EZoilburner

EZoilburner

03 2500 158wb HR
Sorry to steer the thread off topic for a minute, what do You coat the injector with? I remember some saying one should coat the injectors and glow plugs with something other than regular antisieze yet the antisieze I use hold up to 1600f.

Thanks.
 
S

skyflyer007

New member
I'm still trying to figure out if it was a good idea to rebuild your own injectors. Where did you get the parts and did you have them flow tested before you reinstalled them.

Someone correct me if I am wrong, but I thought flow and other settings on the injectors was very critical and a rebuild of injectors was beyond the scope of a backyard mechanic without measurement tools. If it is possible, please share.
 
Altered Sprinter

Altered Sprinter

Happy Little Vegemite
EZoilburner said:
So that is what should be used on the injectors and glow plugs, is it going to work as well as anti seize? Thanks.
Click to expand...
Injectors are White ceramic grease no where as near as the photo has shown that's a key to asking for trouble,Note it must be kept free of any grease hitting the copper seals .
Glow plugs: If Buru OEM only a light smear of white ceramic Greece:smilewink: is required on the thread only, as little as possible just a smear.

If using Bosch then an appropriate hi-temp Nickel anti-size will be required never use copper anti size on a Sprinter.

The thread should have stayed on M existing thread not a re-run where we're simply going over the same old ground again, as it should be transferred back to the original thread by a moderator. Glow plugs OEM Buru are nickel plated they do not rust any where near as much as the steel Bosch plugs do , however some glow plug threads may be damaged via corrosion and require an alternative anti-size type.''at all costs avoid any grease adhering to the annular gap or the plug will fail prematurely well before it's use by date, as to repeated glow plug failure.

The list is on a PDF for Mercedes engines.
but I'd have to fire up the work computer again sorry:doh: but the threads been discussed one too many times, to repeat this all over again.
Richard
 
marquimarl

marquimarl

Member
Sorry. I have yet again failed to meet your standards. mmmmmmmmmm
Could you point me to a post that shows how much Ceramic Grease should be aplied?
Did you say I should have aplied some C.G. to the threads of the injectors Altered?
Can you show me a picture of a disassembled injector or one that would show the order to reassemble it?
As far as what was posted before. I have gotten past that issue and am reporting what I have done.
Anyone care to answer my question on the code?
At least you may have inadvertanly given me a clue of where some of the smoke is coming from.
I was thinking a leaking injector.

OO7 As far as I know there is no internal adjustments that can be made in the Piezo Upper half of the injector.
All I did was install new injector Nozzles because the old ones were toast, and clean the lower halfs the best I could.
The injector nozzles are not for sale to the public, per Bosch they are a restricted part.
 
Altered Sprinter

Altered Sprinter

Happy Little Vegemite
M hyper-linking back on your ghost of past injection, is asking a bit much. No offense meant either.

did I state threads on the injector ,Not sure if I said that as it was for or meant to be for glow plugs.

Bosch parts are available in the UK and down under. so no restrictions there.
Piezoelectric ceramic injectors on a Tin congratulations my 2005 does not have them or any other that I am aware of NCV yes.

Listings for white ceramic grease I have ran one too many threads up on that one, and its a tad hard to get it, dammed if I know why just is, it's simply a hi temp lubricating grease.

The problem you have is 100 cranks and reference to replacing injection pipes or re-codding the injectors including the use of new Collete and hold down bolt , the ones with a pre- lubed anti-seize thread applied. injector seal and washers at injector base, what thickness.

That's where you made it too hard, as to jumping your original thread, and those who may want to help are back at square one.
Schematics are shown on multiple threads/
You don't have this one.
if you do better start praying because the Chrystal on the module expand and will blow under high bar fuel pressure.
 
marquimarl

marquimarl

Member
I did install new hold down bolts with a pre- lubed anti-seize thread applied. injector seal and washers at injector base.
The extra Ceramic grease probably will do no harm as it can not pass the injector seal washer into the combustion chamber, it only is squeezed upward as the collete is tightened.

How are the injectors recoded if not by the Tin ECU?
I was under the impression that a 2004 needed no coding for the injectors.

My original question is.

P0105 Pressure sensor
"The EPC control light does not light."
"At hand off the Atmospheric pressure sensor the replace value will be determinate."
"The exhaust gas feedback is switched off."
What do I need to do to fix this code?

The Pressure Sensor was replaced at the shop because of high bar fuel pressure.
Do you think the Crystals may have already swelled?

Would you have used loctite or any other sealant on the injector threads when screwing them back together?
 
autostaretx

autostaretx

Erratic Member
Since this is a 2004, your "P0105" is an incomplete code... there should be a -X qualifier.
For some of the codes, the manual says theses can be the cause:
======================
Symptom List:
P0105-BOOST PRESSURE SENSOR CAN MESSAGE ERROR
P0105-BOOST PRESSURE SENSOR PLAUSIBILITY
----causes------
AIR FILTER
AIR RESTRICTION
INTERMITTENT CONDITION
CAN BUS COMMUNICATION DTCS
HIGH RESISTANCE IN THE BOOST PRESSURE SENSOR SIGNAL CIRCUIT
HIGH RESISTANCE IN THE BOOST PRESSURE SENSOR GROUND CIRCUIT
CAN BUS CIRCUITS OPEN TO THE SHIFTER MODULE
HIGH RESISTANCE IN THE BOOST PRESSURE SENSOR 5-VOLT SUPPLY CIRCUIT
ENGINE CONTROL MODULE
====================
*or*
Symptom:
P0105-BOOST PRESSURE SENSOR SIGNAL VOLTAGE TOO HIGH
---causes---------
INTERMITTENT CONDITION
BOOST PRESSURE SENSOR GROUND CIRCUIT SHORTED TO VOLTAGE
BOOST PRESSURE SENSOR SIGNAL CIRCUIT SHORTED TO VOLTAGE
BOOST PRESSURE SENSOR GROUND CIRCUIT OPEN
BOOST PRESSURE SENSOR
POOR CONNECTOR TERMINAL CONTACT
ENGINE CONTROL MODULE (INTERNAL)
ENGINE CONTROL MODULE (SENSOR SIGNAL SHORTED TO VOLTAGE)
=====================
*or*
Symptom:
P0105-BOOST PRESSURE SENSOR SIGNAL VOLTAGE TOO LOW
---causes----------------------------
INTERMITTENT CONDITION
BOOST PRESSURE SENSOR 5 VOLT SUPPLY CIRCUIT OPEN
BOOST PRESSURE SENSOR
BOOST PRESSURE SENSOR SIGNAL CIRCUIT SHORTED TO GROUND
BOOST PRESSURE SENSOR SIGNAL AND GROUND CIRCUITS SHORTED TOGETHER
BOOST PRESSURE SENSOR SIGNAL CIRCUIT OPEN
ENGINE CONTROL MODULE
==================

The diagnostic trees beneath each of those are a bit long to quote here.
I suspect the 2006 manual (look in the Powertrain sub-manual) here: http://aie-services-2.net/Sprinter/
will have the same (or "close enough") diagnostic tree...

--dick
 
2

220629

Well-known member
marquimarl said:
...
How are the injectors recoded if not by the Tin ECU?
I was under the impression that a 2004 needed no coding for the injectors.

...
Click to expand...
Apparently the answer is "It depends".

From a post today.

abittenbinder said:
'06 engine into an '04 chassis is a plug and play swap.

I would however record the injector 'programming numbers' on paper in case your '04 ECM allows for injector programming. Early '04 ECMs do not program injectors.

Doktor A
Click to expand...
vic

Edit:
Some OM647 specific information


135StartQtyContr.jpg

137FuelQtyContr.jpg

138SmoothRunning.jpg

139AnitiJerkFullLimit.jpg

140MaxEngineSpeed.jpg
 
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Altered Sprinter

Altered Sprinter

Happy Little Vegemite
A schematic shows a routeCLFS.jpg
Common_Rail_Scheme.jpg But you need to understand how the Cdi Fuel system works
As vic shows schematics a picture tells a thousand clues, but with out the CR: common rail codes proper in a prescribed sequence, then M[you must understand Where to look] for the actual Control Unit: Actual value group for fuel injection.
The codes for Mercedes are global except in the States that throws me right off as the codes from a reader are never accurate or even the DRB11 is genetic and not worth it's cost. There are names to codes as to actual values per unit, for Engine speed, Current injection quantity, Start of actuation of pre-injection, Actuation period of pre-injection,pre-injection quantity,Commencement of actuation of main injection,Actuation period of main injection,Quantity of main injection.
c22.png

The above have 4 mathematical unit of formulas..
Each actual unit is by the numbers of the actual values.

049FuelInjector.jpg
M you do not have Piezero electronic injection so the crystal expansion is not your problem.

The next grouping as shown by Vic's schematic is based on the value group for sensors overview for the control unit CR: each name has a code by MB a specified value and a Actual value per unit.
Coolant temperature,Intake air temperature,oil temperature, oil quality,Oil level, Engine speed, Pedal value sensor 1 and 2,Boast pressure,Rail pressure, Atmospheric pressure Switch systems for transmission matching rpm to Engine RPM under load, crank off set, Switch for Clutch or dual mass clutches and or vacuum pressure for torque convertors,
Down to low fuel pressure the latter is used as the primary value not Hi Pressure pumps values.

How far can you push it with out a professional diagnostic and assuming the tech understands it thoroughly is any ones guess.
However if at my suggestion only if that head has not been removed, I'd be doing it to check for value crown and piston wall damage and possible damage to the head itself.
What your doing is not correct, in fact you potentially are doing more harm than good.
Or I'd have those injectors back out and get them reconditioned.


Richard
​
 
marquimarl

marquimarl

Member
Thank you gentlemen . After digesting all of the information you have given me and sleeping on it......
I will have to pull the injectors and have them rebuilt at a Certified Bosch shop.
The shop who tested my injectors have a bad reputation and proved it by lying to me.
The Shop that did all the of the "work" on the Sprinter doing thousands of dollars worth of hours without checking the injectors is pure incompetence.
My hope is that they did not damage the Motor.
The motor idles perfectly.
While test driving the Sprinter it shows multiple symptoms you all have mentioned.
Smoking at idle, loading up and belching smoke on take off, not hardly any smoke when up to speed.
Bad shifting response, maybe due to lack of power because there is no turbo boost pressure mostly at low rpms.
Hopefully there is no engine damage Altered, but if there is it was already there when the injectors were installed.
 
S

skydiver007

DRB III Owner If You Need
My earlier post was not meant to be negative. Injectors are expensive in the US and I just wanted to understand if it was safe for the average DIY person to rebuild them. I have heard everywhere on here that it is not a good idea. If that information is not true then I would love to know.

From my own experience with having a new ECM installed on my 05 I know for sure that my injectors needed to be classified. The idiots at the dealership told me $80 to replace the ECM and then he comes back and says he cannot proceed without coding the injectors for an additional $150. I tell him to forget it as i have a DRB and can do it myself. He refuses and charges me anyway. I get home and check them and he has only done 2 of them.

Without coding on mine, the milage was way down and the engine did not run as smooth as it had been. The values on the DRB also made the injectors look bad.
When I coded them, everything smoothed out.
 
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