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Sprinter
12-08-2007, 01:37 AM
I was on my way back from Arkansas, getting close to 11000 miles on oil (Amsoill Euro formula). I decided to change it as soon as possible, I was in Indiana, I searched for nearest dealer in GPS and Palmer Dodge was just few miles away. I called them if they have Mobil 1 ESP because I wanted to come back to 5-30 for the winter. Some kid from the front desk assured me that's what they use so I went there. Price was good, $110 with filter & labor but I said I need one more quart for refill as it uses a little oil between changes. No problem, they sent me to parts dept. where they sell oil as well and they gave me...
"Valvoline 15W-40 All fleet Plus". I went nuts. Manager assured me that they use this oil succesfully for all Sprinters including 2007. He assured me also that it's safe for DPF.
I just found out this oil is not even synthetic! I thought You should not use non synthetic after using synthetic. I am really pissed, that's one thing, but more important is my question to You guys who know better - should I run it or change it tommorrow, and maybe even flush?!

apprecciate Your advice, as always

talkinghorse43
12-08-2007, 02:04 AM
Valvoline site recommends their full synthetic for the '07 diesel Sprinter. The oil you reference does not mention that it's suitable for the DPF. Valvoline has a non-synthetic that's suitable for the DPF, but that's not the one.

jdcaples
12-08-2007, 02:44 AM
...
should I run it or change it tommorrow, and maybe even flush?!



If it were me, I'd change the oil out tomorrow.

Many people would probably not flush it, but I would. I'd drain the 15w-40, fill the engine with an approved oil, run it around the block a couple of times - get it up to operating temperature - drain the tainted oil, and change the filter and fill with fresh oil. I know there are people who will say that's overkill, but unless nay-sayers buy it from you, you own it.

As an aside:keep the receipt from the 15w-40 dealership. Don't be shy about brandishing it like a sword in the future, should you encounter any Sprinter Dealer hesitating to act on a warranty repair.


They'd certainly use any opportunity to get out of a warranty repair.

Now you have an expensive, paper counter-measure.


-Jon

sikwan
12-08-2007, 02:58 AM
I'm with changing it out as soon as you can. Oil is better than no oil (at least it's still new), but for an oil that's being used on a diesel, the turbo, and the DPF, I would do as soon as you can.

Altered Sprinter
12-08-2007, 03:04 AM
15-40 would give you a better range for long term oil changes between mileage , that oil is fully recomened By Mercedes benz for fleet operations , But only if it's low ash oil ....it won't kill your sprinter I can asure you of this but it would pay to change it in the short term if it's not a low ash oil.
The DPF may end up working overtime Not sure,
Was the oil Low ash??????
Richard

KRZYSZTOF Z
12-08-2007, 10:45 AM
The best oil for the Sprinteris
Mobil 1 ESP Formula M 5W-40 - Emission
System Protection
Advanced Performance Synthetic Engine Oil
Product Description
Mobil 1 ESP Formula M 5W-40 is an advanced performance synthetic engine oil designed to provide exceptional
cleaning power, wear protection and overall performance. Mobil 1 ESP Formula M 5W-40 is engineered to help
prolong the life and maintain the efficiency of Car Emission Reduction Systems in both diesel and gasoline
powered automobiles that require an oil that is approved against Daimler Chrysler's MB 229.51 specification.
Features and Benefits
Mobil 1 ESP Formula M 5W-40 is made with a proprietary blend of high performance components formulated
to be fully compatible with the latest Diesel Particulate Filters (DPF's) and Gasoline Catalytic Converters (CAT's).
Mobil 1 ESP Formula M 5W-40 has been designed to deliver outstanding overall performance and protection. Key
features and benefits include:
Features Advantages and Potential Benefits
Helps to reduce particulate build up in Diesel Particulate
Filters
Low Ash Content
Helps to reduce poisoning of Gasoline Catalytic
Converters
Low Sulphur and Phosphorous content
Reduces deposits and sludge build-up to enable long
and clean engine life
Active cleaning agents
Reduces oil ageing allowing extended drain interval
protection
Outstanding thermal and oxidation stability
Low oil consumption Less hydrocarbon pollution
Quick cold weather starting and ultra fast protection. Also
helps extend engine and electrical system life.
Excellent low temperature capabilities
Applications
Mobil 1 ESP Formula M 5W-40 is approved against Daimler Chrysler MB 229.51.
It is not recommended for 2-Cycle or aviation engines, unless specifically approved by the manufacturer.
Specifications and Approvals
Mobil 1 ESP Formula M 5W-40 has the following
builder approvals:
Daimler Chrysler MB 229.51

Typical Properties
Mobil 1 ESP Formula M 5W-40
SAE Grade 5W-40
Viscosity, ASTM D 445
cSt @ 40C 81.1
cSt @ 100C 13.35
Viscosity Index, ASTM D 2270 167
Sulphated Ash, wt%, ASTM D 874 0.63
HTHS Viscosity, mPas @ 150C, ASTM D4683 3,8
Pour Point, C, ASTM D 97 -39
Flash Point, C, ASTM D 92 236
Density @ 15C, kg/l, ASTM D 4052 0.85
Health and Safety
Based on available information, this product is not expected to produce adverse effects on health when used
for the applications referred to above and the recommendations provided in the Material Safety Data Sheet
(MSDS) are followed. MSDS's are available upon request through your sales contact office, or via the Internet.
This product should not be used for purposes other than the applications referred to above. If disposing of used
product, take care to protect the environment.
The Mobil logotype, the Pegasus design and "Mobil 1" are trademarks of Exxon Mobil Corporation, or one of its
subsidiaries.

You can get at any Mercedes dealer for $6-7.50/QT

kendall69
12-08-2007, 05:42 PM
This is the only thing my dealer would put in. I brought in 0-40 and thy refused to put it in saying 5-30 is what the "new" manual says for the 2007.

http://www.mobil.com/UK-English/Lubes/PDS/GLXXENPVLMOMobil_1_ESP_Formula_5W-30.asp

Sprinter
12-09-2007, 04:01 PM
Thanks a lot guys!

Why didn't I think of it sooner? better late than never, I went to MB dealer and bought 13 quarts of Mobil 1 ESP formula M 5W-40 (only $5.90/qt!) I know it's not 5-30 as my dealer recommends but at least it's what manual says and I rather stick to it, I don't believe any Dodge dealer anymore. It's really amazing and hard to believe how such a nice van can have such a poor service, I just experienced it one more time.

jdcaples, they didn't flush it, just drained, replaced filter and oil. I think I'll just change it again in 4-5k miles

thanks again for advice, DODGE dealers should sign up here and learn something :thumbup::laughing:

KenB
12-10-2007, 07:31 PM
Sprinter...
your first over-reaction was when you insisted on getting an oil change on AMSOIL at 11K miles... a synthetic like that is actually good to 25K miles, yes, even the MOBIL 1 would be OK well above 12K miles. Using fully speced Synthetic (most any brand) in a Sprinter with ASSYST, you will pretty much always be warned to do a change AFTER 13K miles...

Again, using ASTM/API certified oils (or even better MB/DC speced) will be OK pretty much back to back regardless of synthetic or non-synth. You're bigger problem would be that the (Valvoline 15W-40 All fleet Plus) does not meet specs at all for the Sprinter (it is CF rated by the API specs and should be CJ-4 rated (2007 w/DPF)) or you should not use it (a dealer that does not know this is not a dealer with which you should deal...). PUN quite intended.

However, don't over-react again. Simply short cycle your change and do one in 4-5K miles as you say... this is sound judgement at this point. A flush is not necessary, as you drain very well in the Sprinter as far as I can tell.

MB diesel is well known for running well on regular old decent oils. Our passions for synthetic oils is only recent, and born out of desire for long intervals, consistent performance in a wide range of temps and service levels, and finally a need for low ash/sulfur fuels to help prolong life of parts that reduce emmissions.

I have exactly one dealership oil change behind me, and good ridance... It was shoddy work at best. Low within 1K miles by at least two quarts (light came on) topped off with correct oil, it never went low again... 40K miles later, that one time was the only problem... fishy!!! Certain by now that the oil was incorrect, and probably not full by dealer. Also, the Sprinter tech was not on site that day...

The changes are very easy and LOW MESS due to the MB filter arrangement, far superior to any other I have owned.

KenB

BigBlueBus
12-15-2007, 05:00 PM
Draining the oil and changing the filter in the Sprinter is the easiest of any car, truck or van I've ever seen. :clapping:

Although I only have 1500 miles on my new Sprinter, I haven't had to change the oil yet. But I'm hesitant to do it myself for lack of a "dealership receipt" in case of any warranty issues.

I had a 2001 Dodge Intrepid with the notorious 2.7L; at 18k miles, well before the expiration of the warrantly, the engine developed a rod knock. I had done all the oil changes myself, all documented in the service manual with dates and mileage, and with attached receipts for the oil and filter purchases; but because I did not have the "dealership receipts" at each interval, DM would not change my engine after repeated complaints to DM district manager; I ended up wrapping the car around a tree as it was still barely running to collect on the insurance instead; it's sad but I had no choice.

So as far as our new van is concerned and as much as I MISTRUST dealership service, I may have no choice but to take it in for something as simple as oil changes.

What do you guys recommend I do in this situation. Remember, I'm making this decision based on past experience on an unsuccessful warranty claim on a car with just 18k miles on it; now I learned that there's a class action lawsuit against DM on the 2.7L engine issue, which of course the lawyers got the millions of dollars but consumers just got free oil changes; the justice system in USA is such a joke, but that's a whole other issue.

Regards,
John

Sprinter
12-15-2007, 07:46 PM
Draining the oil and changing the filter in the Sprinter is the easiest of any car, truck or van I've ever seen. :clapping:

Although I only have 1500 miles on my new Sprinter, I haven't had to change the oil yet. But I'm hesitant to do it myself for lack of a "dealership receipt" in case of any warranty issues.

I had a 2001 Dodge Intrepid with the notorious 2.7L; at 18k miles, well before the expiration of the warrantly, the engine developed a rod knock. I had done all the oil changes myself, all documented in the service manual with dates and mileage, and with attached receipts for the oil and filter purchases; but because I did not have the "dealership receipts" at each interval, DM would not change my engine after repeated complaints to DM district manager; I ended up wrapping the car around a tree as it was still barely running to collect on the insurance instead; it's sad but I had no choice.

So as far as our new van is concerned and as much as I MISTRUST dealership service, I may have no choice but to take it in for something as simple as oil changes.

What do you guys recommend I do in this situation. Remember, I'm making this decision based on past experience on an unsuccessful warranty claim on a car with just 18k miles on it; now I learned that there's a class action lawsuit against DM on the 2.7L engine issue, which of course the lawyers got the millions of dollars but consumers just got free oil changes; the justice system in USA is such a joke, but that's a whole other issue.

Regards,
John


I just want to let You know what kind of warranty we have on Sprinters, don't expect much unless it's frustration..

I just brought mine for service with loud noise coming from transmission area (?)
First thing they tell me there is $120 diagnostic charge! Just to lift the van up and take a look!

Then they tell me it's center bearing, the one supporting propeller shaft (thank God it's not transmission) It went at 40k but warranty for that expired two weeks ago at 36k

So they want me to pay $240 for the bearing, $235 labor, $475 total.
You can buy this bearing online for $140 and it should take no more than 1 hour to replace...

jdcaples
12-15-2007, 09:03 PM
I had a 2001 Dodge Intrepid with the notorious 2.7L; at 18k miles, well before the expiration of the warrantly, the engine developed a rod knock.
...

I ended up wrapping the car around a tree as it was still barely running to collect on the insurance instead; it's sad but I had no choice.

So as far as our new van is concerned and as much as I MISTRUST dealership service, I may have no choice but to take it in for something as simple as oil changes.

What do you guys recommend I do in this situation.
...

the justice system in USA is such a joke, but that's a whole other issue.

Regards,
John


First, I agree that warranty-related responsibilities are too easy for manufacturer/providers to disregard in the USA.


I recommend doing what ever it takes to prevent you from reacting in any manner that in any way risks anyone's life or property.

If that means risking dealership incompetence, so be it. If it means doing it yourself and functionally abandoning your own warranty expectations, so be it.

Ultimately, the vehicle owner is responsible for the vehicle. Expectations of other parties to keep a machine working are always a risk.

-Jon

Altered Sprinter
12-15-2007, 09:06 PM
So we have a 2007 with a failed center bearing! That will be worth keeping an eye on.
36 thou warranty.:shifty:
At least we get 200 000 Kilometers or three years which ever comes first.
Richard
Merry Christmas
5197

Sprinter
12-15-2007, 10:37 PM
So we have a 2007 with a failed center bearing! That will be worth keeping an eye on.
36 thou warranty.:shifty:
At least we get 200 000 Kilometers or three years which ever comes first.
Richard
Merry Christmas
5197


I have 100000 miles warranty on engine, powertrain is only 36k

100k/5 years but obviously at 10k/month I'll see 100k before next summer


BTW I am driving a lot with bad bearing until new arrive, is there a big chance it may cease completely?

kendall69
12-16-2007, 03:31 PM
With these price I'm glad I got the additional warranty bumper to bumper to 100k.
Cost $1,200.00 - I'm expecting to eat that up pretty quickly within 100k

BigBlueBus
12-17-2007, 06:40 PM
First, A word about extended warranties: I too bought an extended warranty, sold by GM, for a previous new car I purchased. I figured since it was backed by the manufacturer it must be as good (or bad) as the original warranty. Sure enough, when it was time to make a transmission repair claim, the company refused to cover it; their defense was customer abuse. That's probably an automatic defense to every major claim.

So on the next new car, I purchased an aftermarket ext. warranty from a company that had been in business for many years. The only problem was, it had been in business alright, but under many other names; when it was time to do a differential repair, the company had changed names again so my warranty was no longer valid.

About the Sprinters, is the warranty backed by Dodge or MB?
Is there a 100k powertrain warranty or at 36k am I on my own?

Whoever the warranty is backed by, I think I will do all the maintenance myself, I'll just make sure to keep records. I would rather risk not having a warranty from the start, than having some idiot at a dealership "touch" anything on my vehicle, as it is very probable (by experience) that dealership service is more harmful to your ride than good.

jdcaples
12-17-2007, 06:47 PM
About the Sprinters, is the warranty backed by Dodge or MB?
Is there a 100k powertrain warranty or at 36k am I on my own?

Whoever the warranty is backed by, I think I will do all the maintenance myself
...



Sprinters in North America are not warranty-backed by MB.

Let me restate that: Ultimately Chrysler and Freightliner escalate to MB. Owner/Opeators typically have no direct interaction with Daimler or MB. Sprinter owners may have warranty work carried out by any Dodge or Freightliner dealership that sells Sprinters.


I support your self-reliance plan.


-Jon

contractor
12-21-2007, 02:12 AM
Hello. I'm new to this forum and not sure about the whole DPH issue. I have a MY2006 Sprinter and I'm using Mobil 1 0W-40 ... is it the MY 2007 and later that recommend the ESP grade oils?Thanks.

sikwan
12-21-2007, 02:34 AM
Hello. I'm new to this forum and not sure about the whole DPH issue. I have a MY2006 Sprinter and I'm using Mobil 1 0W-40 ... is it the MY 2007 and later that recommend the ESP grade oils?Thanks.

Yes.

tomccart
12-30-2007, 05:27 PM
You're going to love this oil story...

I have a 2005 Sprinter 3500 - I took it to Dodge dealer in Folsom CA for 20K oil change. I asked them to install a 240A alternator that I brought in - they said sure for $200; I said I would do it myself for that much! 10K Mile oil change months ago was a whopping $110, 20K oil change was now $150! What gives I asked? They gave me the standard line, increased oil costs, 911, etc... Ya, ya - whatever, just do a good job and get me back on the road.

1.5 hours later I was back on the road - dredding installing my new 240A alternator. 10 min into my drive home, I'm on the freeway in a down pour and my cab starts getting smokey. I'm thinkng I just paid $150 and they had the nerve to spill oil on my engine! Well, the smoke continued to the point I couldn't see my gauges - late for work, I had to pull over. I opened up my hood and my FRICKEN engine was on FIRE!! I looked down and sitting on my radiator was my oil cap that the bonehead forgot to reinstall. I put the flames out and called the service manager. I asked him how he'd like to start his Monday morning off with an engine fire? He was not amused - neither was I.

He said that he would cover towing back to the shop and another oil change. I told him thats just for starters. An hour later I arrived back to the dealer and was still FIRED up. Other customers had their cars in for oil change with their cars on the rack - when they asked me what mine was being towed in for - I told them and they were mortified.

Long story made short - I made it clear I could have just let it burn to the ground...
I got them to cover:
- full detail inside and out (with wax) (oil was everywhere).
- full documentation in my service record what they had done.
- repair any damage fire caused (luckily none - flames were on top of exhaust manifold).
- swap out my alternator - free of charge.
- rental car
- refunded my $150 for oil change

In hindsight, I wish I would have asked for lifetime oil changes.

I've now learned to ALWAYS - before I leave the lot, check oil for new oil and proper level - and then ensure cap in on securely.

I am curious - what would you have done or asked for in this circumstance?

Signed,
Non-Trusting in California

abittenbinder
12-30-2007, 08:18 PM
You're going to love this oil story...
I've now learned to ALWAYS - before I leave the lot, check oil for new oil and proper level - and then ensure cap in on securely.

Signed,
Non-Trusting in California

Dealerships are high volume operations and unfortunately the customer IS the Quality Control Department. No matter what vehicle you own-always check fluid levels and underhood conditions before driving away from their lot. Usually no one else is doing that job for you. Doktor A

contractor
12-30-2007, 09:26 PM
Doctor
Good point. My first oil change with my Sprinter and the dipstick was not pushed all the way back into the filler tube! I had a friend who just before pulling out of the dealer decided to check the oil and found they stripped the oil pan and all the oil was now on the ground:censored:. Good advice ... who cares what they think.