3M Crystalline tinting for 2015 Unity MB
- Thread starter MWSHAWJR
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Don Horner
2012 Unity IB
I'd never heard of it until you mentioned it. I Googled it and it does sound like a very attractive project. I found a nearby (about 100 miles from our rural location) installer and read what they have to say -- "Over the top"..."expensive and very difficult to install. Very expensive, but the best usually is". 3M says "....for high end cars." I think our Unitys qualify as "high end"...
That sounds like it's above my pay grade, but living in Florida, I'm also curious about the details. I wonder how much heat our black privacy glass windows absorb? As a clear product that blocks heat, might it be very effective in blocking heat through those black windows? Sounds like it might be a great product for the skylight!
Short of my driving 100 miles to Fort Myers to talk with expert installers, I'd also like to hear from someone who has done it. Is it really that effective? How expensive is it? Expense is often relative --= it might be "very expensive" compared to standard window tinting, but not so bad in the overall scheme of things.
According the 3M, there are 4 grades -- 40, 50, 60 and 70 with 40 being the most effective. If anyone has experience, which grade did you choose?
That sounds like it's above my pay grade, but living in Florida, I'm also curious about the details. I wonder how much heat our black privacy glass windows absorb? As a clear product that blocks heat, might it be very effective in blocking heat through those black windows? Sounds like it might be a great product for the skylight!
Short of my driving 100 miles to Fort Myers to talk with expert installers, I'd also like to hear from someone who has done it. Is it really that effective? How expensive is it? Expense is often relative --= it might be "very expensive" compared to standard window tinting, but not so bad in the overall scheme of things.
According the 3M, there are 4 grades -- 40, 50, 60 and 70 with 40 being the most effective. If anyone has experience, which grade did you choose?
Old Crows
Calypso 2014 View Profile
Guys! We put that 3M product in our Ventura. We have the Madico product in the View and on the french doors in the house. Lots of glass! They work. It was the only thing that made our Bentura habitable in Texas and the southwest.
It is NO more difficult to install than any other window film. Any competent window tint Dude can install it. It does help if they have a computer program to cut the shapes for the cab windows rather than hand cutting.
Some thoughts.... Glass is a good conductor & transmits heat and radiation to the interior. Solar radiation goes through it and gives you that hot feeling even when the AC is running...like a reptile warmer! Black or black tinted glass absorbs heat (windows can be as hot as the dark color on the RV exterior) and re-radiates it to the air inside creating convection heating in the coach. Hot air moves upward in a laminar flow along the window and into the coach heating the inside air. Think about those old cast iron radiators in your Gran's house! Hot to the touch..hot radiating from them... And hot air connecting off them. Which is why throwing black tint on a car window isn't the sharpest idea.
IME, super insulating the coach isn't the way to go since most of the heat load/loss is through the single pane windows. What to do... Coat the window with a film that nearly eliminates the passage of radiation through it and asks like a barrier to the energy flow through the glass. If you can knock down the heat load from the windows the A/C has an easier time keeping things comfy.
You will notice an immediate difference in the cab if you do the windshield and side windows. Before you are a lizard in a terrarium.... After...you end up turning the AC to a warmer setting and you don't feel hot/sweaty with the AC running full tilt.
Note: there are two types of film... Those with a nano-crystal technology and those with a nano-metal tech. The metal film cuts your RF reception in things like cell phones, WiFi, radio, TVs. Crystal is better.
It is nearly transparent if you use clear material. Both films do produce some odd colors with light reflected from the road surface....sort of a purple / pink look to the road..weird but only at certain sun angles.
Do all the windows...even the tinted glass coach jobs using clear material... Including the moon roof/skylight if you can. Clear on the windshield. Maybe a light tint on the cab doors to pick up the look of the black glass in the coach.
I highly recommend the solar coatings...
It is NO more difficult to install than any other window film. Any competent window tint Dude can install it. It does help if they have a computer program to cut the shapes for the cab windows rather than hand cutting.
Some thoughts.... Glass is a good conductor & transmits heat and radiation to the interior. Solar radiation goes through it and gives you that hot feeling even when the AC is running...like a reptile warmer! Black or black tinted glass absorbs heat (windows can be as hot as the dark color on the RV exterior) and re-radiates it to the air inside creating convection heating in the coach. Hot air moves upward in a laminar flow along the window and into the coach heating the inside air. Think about those old cast iron radiators in your Gran's house! Hot to the touch..hot radiating from them... And hot air connecting off them. Which is why throwing black tint on a car window isn't the sharpest idea.
IME, super insulating the coach isn't the way to go since most of the heat load/loss is through the single pane windows. What to do... Coat the window with a film that nearly eliminates the passage of radiation through it and asks like a barrier to the energy flow through the glass. If you can knock down the heat load from the windows the A/C has an easier time keeping things comfy.
You will notice an immediate difference in the cab if you do the windshield and side windows. Before you are a lizard in a terrarium.... After...you end up turning the AC to a warmer setting and you don't feel hot/sweaty with the AC running full tilt.
Note: there are two types of film... Those with a nano-crystal technology and those with a nano-metal tech. The metal film cuts your RF reception in things like cell phones, WiFi, radio, TVs. Crystal is better.
It is nearly transparent if you use clear material. Both films do produce some odd colors with light reflected from the road surface....sort of a purple / pink look to the road..weird but only at certain sun angles.
Do all the windows...even the tinted glass coach jobs using clear material... Including the moon roof/skylight if you can. Clear on the windshield. Maybe a light tint on the cab doors to pick up the look of the black glass in the coach.
I highly recommend the solar coatings...
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Old Crows
Calypso 2014 View Profile
Don, it cost ~ $600 to do all windows in our View Profile, including the picture window in the front above the cab, with the most effective Madico product. The Lad could not do the flip up "moon roof" above the lounge due to the very complex curves and shape. It has a sun screen anyway....
The coach's black "privacy" windows are attractive and necessary. As before, they act as radiators to the inside. A totally unscientific test...unless you have an IR handheld temperature gauge is this. Park the RV so the brightsun shines directly on a black coach window. Let it sit for an hour. Put your hand on the skin of the RV and feel the warmth from different colored areas. Then put you paw on the black glass and aluminum window frame. Yowser! It will be really hot you probably can hold your hand on it too long. Pop inside and put your mitt on the same window..... Almost as hot. That window is acting like your Gran's old cast iron radiator!!!
You can measure an increasing temperature gradient moving up the window...much hotter at the top. Warmed air right at the window surface begins to rise and soon you get this laminar flow of hot air streaming up the window and wafting into the coach. Convection heating..free! Not wanted! Best thing is to use a thermal break...e.g., the film.. to slow down the heat transfer through the glass.
Of course every BTU you add to the heat load has to be removed by the A/C...
While doing the "paw test" compare the temperature of clear or lightly tinted glass and the dark privacy glass.
The folks who have the Fit RV web site reviewed 3M Crystalline Window Tint. They didn't get any kind of deal for the product, so I trust what they said. Their review and video are at:
http://www.thefitrv.com/rv-tips/testing-3m-crystalline-window-tint-for-our-rv/
http://www.thefitrv.com/rv-tips/testing-3m-crystalline-window-tint-for-our-rv/
Old Crows
Calypso 2014 View Profile
Nice test. Tint shops often have heat lamp box to show the effectiveness of the different materials...its a convincing demo. I'm sure I wouldn't apply a heat resisting film over another film.....not a good idea. Windshields and door glass are big contributors to heat in the cockpit. IMO..based on experience.... its worth every penny in comfort and stress reduction. "No matter what the thermometer says....not reaching for a towel to stuff in the window. Exactly!
Old Crows
Calypso 2014 View Profile
Not an issue in Texas. FWIW.... There's also a provision for health reasons. Some folk are photosensitive or take meds that increase photosensitivity And need solar protection. Another legal reason, there's also a provision for "ballistic" film. It serves that purpose. Considering the size of the windshield that is a plus.
Frankly, from the inside with the clear or lightly tinted film you would not know it is there except for cut out for the state inspection sticker. From the outside it is virtually undetectable from more that 4-5' except for that cut out and maybe a slight color shift at odd sun angles. Like one of those gold windshields.
The cab windows were cut using a computer program & CAD pattern cutter at the shop. The Lad then did some magic to stretch the film in all the right places to make it fit the window's curves perfectly... Right up to each rounded corner. He even put a round corner on the cut out... Looks like it came from Mother Benz....
My side windows are so well done, other than the light tint, you can't tell except for about a .5mm glass edge at top of the window.
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I had window tinting and exgterior clear film protection on the front of my Unity performed by an Eco tint shop in Las Vegas.
the use the Luminar Films, and it is the best money I have ever spent. It has reduced heat load while driving, and eliminated most glare while driving in the late afternoon sun. the exterior protective film has also preserved the front of the van's paint job, and makes it much easier to clean off the squashed bugs.
http://www.eco-tint.com/ecotint-las-vegas-automotive-services/automotive-window-tinting/
the use the Luminar Films, and it is the best money I have ever spent. It has reduced heat load while driving, and eliminated most glare while driving in the late afternoon sun. the exterior protective film has also preserved the front of the van's paint job, and makes it much easier to clean off the squashed bugs.
http://www.eco-tint.com/ecotint-las-vegas-automotive-services/automotive-window-tinting/
sikwan
06 Tin Can
I installed 3M Crystalline 40% on my driver and passenger side windows.
Before, I had to cover my left arm (long sleeve) when the sun was beating down the left side during road trips in 110 degree temperatures. Now, I barely feel the heat on my left side and road trips are more enjoyable.
I would put 70% on my windshield if there was a big enough piece of film and it wasn't prohibitively expensive.
I have 3M 20% non-crystalline on my other vehicle. It does cut down on the heat at 20%, but it's a pain backing up with dark windows at night. I do though have more privacy with the dark windows when changing.
Lastly, go to a dealer that sells the crystalline stuff when it's hot and at high noon. Ask them if you could borrow a small piece of film (crystalline vs others) large enough to cover your face. Go outside, feel the heat on your face and put the film between your face and the sun. How does it feel?
When I did the test above using crystalline, I was amazed at how much ir heat was blocked when I put it over my face. And it was only 40% film!
Before, I had to cover my left arm (long sleeve) when the sun was beating down the left side during road trips in 110 degree temperatures. Now, I barely feel the heat on my left side and road trips are more enjoyable.
I would put 70% on my windshield if there was a big enough piece of film and it wasn't prohibitively expensive.
I have 3M 20% non-crystalline on my other vehicle. It does cut down on the heat at 20%, but it's a pain backing up with dark windows at night. I do though have more privacy with the dark windows when changing.
Lastly, go to a dealer that sells the crystalline stuff when it's hot and at high noon. Ask them if you could borrow a small piece of film (crystalline vs others) large enough to cover your face. Go outside, feel the heat on your face and put the film between your face and the sun. How does it feel?
When I did the test above using crystalline, I was amazed at how much ir heat was blocked when I put it over my face. And it was only 40% film!
sikwan
06 Tin Can
Crystalline is non-metallized so it has no (blocking) effect on electrical signals.
Snowbird
2016 Unity MB /2016 MB
After reading the posts here I googled the Crystalline product. I was very impressed. We have an installer 2 miles from our southern California home. MasterShield in Palm Desert, CA did a great job of installing Crystalline 70 on all windows on our Ford Excursion. It has a lot of window area so it was expensive! $1500.00. It has been 30 days since installation and I am very happy. They will install 3M tinting and masking on our 2016 Unity MB when we get it in the fall. Thank you all for all the great information on this forum!
We have had two different ceramic films on the front and side windows of our 2013 Unity MB and both of them greatly reduced radiant heat in the cab which is why we had it put in. In Oregon you can't legally put any film on the front windshield except a small portion of the upper part. The first film I had put on was Air 80 which was about $400 for front and sides. It did a great job and you could not even see it on the windshield. The second film was llumar and just at tiny bit more tinted but still essentially invisible and worked equally well. Why have I had two different films? Our Unity seems to have a special affinity for rocks hitting the windshield! We now have to have it replaced again (third windshield in two years) and will have to have the film replaced again. Fortunately we now have full glass coverage and insurance has always covered
replacing the film as well. You do see a slight rainbow effect if you are wearing polarizer sunglasses but not distracting. Definately worth the effort to have a cooler cab!
replacing the film as well. You do see a slight rainbow effect if you are wearing polarizer sunglasses but not distracting. Definately worth the effort to have a cooler cab!
pfflyer
Well-known member
Sorry I did not see this earlier but I forget the brand that shop quoted. I ended up going with the 3M product and am very happy with it so far. The 3M shop installs it on the surrounding counties K9 units as well.
We put the 3M crystalline film CR 70 on the front and side windows in the cab. Even in February in the southern Arizona sun my wife and I were baking in the cab. Unfortunately the AC does not help the burning sensation as the IR coming through directly heats your skin and clothing. The 3m film cuts essentially all the UV and IR that hits the glass and the difference is dramatic. You would have a very hard time telling that the film is on there if the installation is done well. The sprinter glass up front uses a lot of film. We paid $450 for the job. I was concerned about having to replace the windshield due to the "Alaska stars" I am sure to collect as we go back and forth along the Alcan hiway. The hood design of the Sprinter is guaranteed to funnel anything in the air in front of us onto the glass so I am expecting lots of stone damage am considering investing in a CrackMaster stone and chip repair system to avoid having to replace the windshield and eat the cost of the film ($250). I believe if the windshield is not filmed the driving comfort will be greatly reduced--just the heat coming off the black plastic on the dash in the sun is substantial and greatly reduced after film applied.
As regards the other windows in the Unity, I am skeptical that putting film on the inside of the heavily tinted glass will not prevent the glass heating, as the IR and visible light will be absorbed by the glass before getting to the film, and what gets to the film is reflected back the the glass again for more absorption. A much more effective solution,IMHO, is to put the reflective coating on the outside. For that purpose I will try using cut pieces of a space blanket and taping over the glass from the outside. This system has worked beautifully on our boat windows for those rare hot sunny days in Prince William Sound.
BTW, we also applied the Xpel extreme film to the whole front of the Sprinter and also the the fiberglass "kick outs" where the body swells out beyond the cab profile. I am expecting some stone blizzards in our travels. If anyone is interested in how the Xpel works out let me know.
Thanks to everyone on the forum for all the helpful advice I have gleaned and put to use in our rig.
Dave 2015 Unity TB
As regards the other windows in the Unity, I am skeptical that putting film on the inside of the heavily tinted glass will not prevent the glass heating, as the IR and visible light will be absorbed by the glass before getting to the film, and what gets to the film is reflected back the the glass again for more absorption. A much more effective solution,IMHO, is to put the reflective coating on the outside. For that purpose I will try using cut pieces of a space blanket and taping over the glass from the outside. This system has worked beautifully on our boat windows for those rare hot sunny days in Prince William Sound.
BTW, we also applied the Xpel extreme film to the whole front of the Sprinter and also the the fiberglass "kick outs" where the body swells out beyond the cab profile. I am expecting some stone blizzards in our travels. If anyone is interested in how the Xpel works out let me know.
Thanks to everyone on the forum for all the helpful advice I have gleaned and put to use in our rig.
Dave 2015 Unity TB
I also live in Oregon. In both cases for the ceramic films you have used on your Unity, did you then only have the top 13" of the front windshield filmed because of Oregon's law? Or did you/can I apply a non-tinted film to the entire front windshield?
Old Crows
Calypso 2014 View Profile
DHB, just film the inside of all the windows... Messing around with outside foils? That's tacky My Man. Just film the insides... Once and done. It doesn't significantly add to the temperature of the black glass. It does decrease the IR UV transfer to the inside of the coach.