Sprinter-Forum    
 

Go Back   Sprinter-Forum > T1N Sprinters > T1N Talk

T1N Talk General Discussions related to T1N Sprinters.


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 07-31-2012, 06:35 PM   #1
jcweller1
05' 647 NAG1 2500 HT 158"
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Vero Beach, FL
Posts: 163
Thanks: 97
Thanked 19 Times in 17 Posts
Exclamation Knocking Noise in engine

I have a knocking noise in my 05 2.7L 647. I have had timing chain tensioner replaced along with all lifters, injectors, oil pump and injector pump. Some times the noise is worse than other times. It is random as it can be noisy hot or cold. Has anyone had a vacuum pump make this noise? I'm kind of out of ideas. I've pulled the drive belt to eliminate any components. If I use Lucas diesel conditioner the noise seems to lessen. I replaced the injectors as they failed the leak off test. I'm to the point I will just drive it until it blows. I have lots of power and fuel economy is around 20 mpg.
jcweller1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-31-2012, 06:51 PM   #2
talkinghorse43
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: near Pittsburgh, PA
Posts: 2,765
Thanks: 318
Thanked 663 Times in 515 Posts
Default Re: Knocking Noise in engine

Have you had your oil pressure checked? There is a port on the driver's side of the engine that I used to hook up a permanent gauge to mine. Alternately, there is a test cap for the oil filter housing that allows oil pressure testing. Don't know what minimum specs are for the Sprinter, but my son's '87 190 2.5 TD service manual lists them for his. Probably close for ours, so if you need 'em, give a holler.
__________________
'02 316 2500 SHC FTL 140 passenger, NAG1, 3.73 diff, 16" wheels, OM612 w/EGR (>325k mi.), '04 Golf PD-TDI (>125k mi.), both bought new
talkinghorse43 is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to talkinghorse43 For This Useful Post:
jcweller1 (08-01-2012)
Old 08-01-2012, 01:26 PM   #3
jcweller1
05' 647 NAG1 2500 HT 158"
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Vero Beach, FL
Posts: 163
Thanks: 97
Thanked 19 Times in 17 Posts
Default Re: Knocking Noise in engine

The oil pressure was checked before and after the oil pump was installed. I don't remember what the shop told me what the pressure was. I do know that they said it was within specs. The new pump is less than 6 months old. I will have to check the oil pressure myself since there is an extreme lack of competency here in FL. Best place to find a crook though.

Also have a high pitched hum coming from the EGR at idle (at least that is when I can hear it) and when I push my finger on the top of the valve where the label is, the noise goes away. Has anyone heard of that happening and if so is it normal or am I stuck with getting a new EGR?

Last edited by jcweller1; 08-01-2012 at 01:31 PM.
jcweller1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2012, 08:00 PM   #4
icarus
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 3,446
Thanks: 206
Thanked 1,253 Times in 910 Posts
Default Re: Knocking Noise in engine

Contact DocktorA

Icarus
icarus is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to icarus For This Useful Post:
Old Crows (08-01-2012)
Old 08-03-2012, 03:04 AM   #5
Curious Sprinter Tech
 
Curious Sprinter Tech's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 48
Thanks: 3
Thanked 18 Times in 13 Posts
Default Re: Knocking Noise in engine

You performed a leak off test? Explain how this is performed please. Also, can you do an injector kill test and see if it changes or goes away when each injector is shut off.
Curious Sprinter Tech is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2012, 03:29 AM   #6
talkinghorse43
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: near Pittsburgh, PA
Posts: 2,765
Thanks: 318
Thanked 663 Times in 515 Posts
Default Re: Knocking Noise in engine

Type2teach wrote up the leak-off test.
__________________
'02 316 2500 SHC FTL 140 passenger, NAG1, 3.73 diff, 16" wheels, OM612 w/EGR (>325k mi.), '04 Golf PD-TDI (>125k mi.), both bought new
talkinghorse43 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2012, 01:17 PM   #7
jcweller1
05' 647 NAG1 2500 HT 158"
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Vero Beach, FL
Posts: 163
Thanks: 97
Thanked 19 Times in 17 Posts
Default Re: Knocking Noise in engine

I usde the clear plastic tubing in 4" sections as described in the thread about the leak off test and followed it to the t. After cranking for 10 seconds I measured the fuel in the tubes. #1-1.25" / #2-1.50" / #3-1.75" / #4-1.35"
#5-NO FUEL. #1&5 HAD BEEN REPLACED LESS THAN A YEAR AGO. #2-4 WERE ORIGINAL. All parts came from my local dodge dealer and had new bolts,seals and anti seize compound. LUCKILY THEY WARRANTIED INJECTOR #1 FOR ME.The switch out was easy and painless. I had all 4 replaced and the engine running within 30 minutes. Since then I have gotten the MB Star (knock off) That works well except for injector classification. Working on that now. I did an injector shut off and on a couple of the cylinders there doesn't appear to be a big difference. I can also run the cranking compression test. 2 cyls are just slightly different than the others. I did this late at night to test the unit. I'm hoping to try everything again this morning and write down the results.
The injector shot off test has never made the noise change or go away. It sounds high and in the front of the engine.

Last edited by jcweller1; 08-03-2012 at 01:20 PM.
jcweller1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-04-2012, 12:35 PM   #8
jcweller1
05' 647 NAG1 2500 HT 158"
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Vero Beach, FL
Posts: 163
Thanks: 97
Thanked 19 Times in 17 Posts
Default Re: Knocking Noise in engine

Quote:
Originally Posted by jcweller1 View Post
I usde the clear plastic tubing in 4" sections as described in the thread about the leak off test and followed it to the t. After cranking for 10 seconds I measured the fuel in the tubes. #1-1.25" / #2-1.50" / #3-1.75" / #4-1.35"
#5-NO FUEL. #1&5 HAD BEEN REPLACED LESS THAN A YEAR AGO. #2-4 WERE ORIGINAL. All parts came from my local dodge dealer and had new bolts,seals and anti seize compound. LUCKILY THEY WARRANTIED INJECTOR #1 FOR ME.The switch out was easy and painless. I had all 4 replaced and the engine running within 30 minutes. Since then I have gotten the MB Star (knock off) That works well except for injector classification. Working on that now. I did an injector shut off and on a couple of the cylinders there doesn't appear to be a big difference. I can also run the cranking compression test. 2 cyls are just slightly different than the others. I did this late at night to test the unit. I'm hoping to try everything again this morning and write down the results.
The injector shot off test has never made the noise change or go away. It sounds high and in the front of the engine.
OK, I still can't get the injectors to classify. This MB STAR knock off is programmed wrong with preset parameters. Anyway I did do the injector shot down test again and I got slight noise variations in cyls 3 & 4, and a major change in cyl 5. The rattle part of the noise when away. I ran the test a few times to make sure. I also ran the fuel rail pressure regulator and sensor test. I told me I had a fuel pressure sensor that was out of parameters and failed the test.
This may explain why the noise comes and goes. If the sensor is working properly or close enough to the tolerances then the noise is lessened, but if it is working out of the parameters, then the knock would be worse because the rail pressure would not be correct and neither would the injector spray pattern causing a knock. Just a theory.
I will gladly receive any input from anyone.

Oh I for got, I posted about a high pitched whistle coming from my EGR valve and have had no comments on that subject. When it whistles, I can put my finger on the top where the decal is and push down with very little pressure and the noise goes away. Any thoughts?

Last edited by jcweller1; 08-04-2012 at 12:43 PM.
jcweller1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-04-2012, 01:19 PM   #9
Aqua Puttana
Poly - Thread Finder
 
Aqua Puttana's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: The Falls of Niagara, USA
Posts: 11,374
Thanks: 4,743
Thanked 4,916 Times in 3,268 Posts
Default Re: Knocking Noise in engine

Quote:
Originally Posted by jcweller1 View Post
...This may explain why the noise comes and goes. If the sensor is working properly or close enough to the tolerances then the noise is lessened, but if it is working out of the parameters, then the knock would be worse because the rail pressure would not be correct and neither would the injector spray pattern causing a knock. Just a theory.
Sounds like a reasonable enough theory to be probably worth purchasing and installing a new part. That said, the DAD has the capability to monitor fuel rail pressure with live data. Your unit should do that too. Does the condition happen regularly enough that you can do a test drive with someone?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jcweller1 View Post
I will gladly receive any input from anyone.
Then I guess I'm included.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jcweller1 View Post
Oh I for got, I posted about a high pitched whistle coming from my EGR valve and have had no comments on that subject. When it whistles, I can put my finger on the top where the decal is and push down with very little pressure and the noise goes away. Any thoughts?
I remembered that the EGR control gets a PWM Pulse Width Modulated signal. That is confirmed in post #1 here about halfway down.

"PWM is the pulse modulated signal wire for the EGR
MAF is the signal wire from the MAF"

http://sprinter-source.com/forum/sho...01&postcount=1

and here

237Scope.jpg

238Scope.jpg

The PWM frequency can cause an irregularly manufactured coil or unit cover to mechanically vibrate with a resultant noise. By pushing on the unit you are either binding the loose parts or changing the lever point so the noise goes away. Often AC powered solenoid coils will have what is described as a "60 cycle" hum which I find an interesting term because it is actually a 120 cycle hum as the sine wave passes through "0" volts twice for each cycle.

Anyway, sometimes coils or covers make noise. I wouldn't worry about reliability. If the noise is driving you batty then maybe try tapping the cover lightly with a ballpein hammer to change the position. Personally I wouldn't worry about it.

Thanks for the continued feedback about your scan unit. vic
__________________
NAS (N. Amer. Spec) 2004 140 2500 >275,000 mi.DAD Paint=Arctic Whitewash Brushtone Grey
"My opinion and worth everything you'll never pay for it." is expressly implied.
Anyone can hold the helm when the sea is calm. Publilius Syrus
"There are only 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't." HaWiiLuVeR
Some people have 10 years experience, others just 1 year 10 times.
Don't expect much from me. I've forgotten much of what I once knew.

Last edited by Aqua Puttana; 08-04-2012 at 02:02 PM.
Aqua Puttana is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Aqua Puttana For This Useful Post:
jcweller1 (08-05-2012), tegimr (02-01-2014)
Old 08-04-2012, 02:03 PM   #10
talkinghorse43
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: near Pittsburgh, PA
Posts: 2,765
Thanks: 318
Thanked 663 Times in 515 Posts
Default Re: Knocking Noise in engine

Quote:
Originally Posted by jcweller1 View Post
The rattle part of the noise when away.
It's hard for me to tell w/o hearing if the knock/rattle, etc. you're hearing is normal, or abnormal and if abnormal, what might be the cause. Maybe you could post a video w/ sound?
__________________
'02 316 2500 SHC FTL 140 passenger, NAG1, 3.73 diff, 16" wheels, OM612 w/EGR (>325k mi.), '04 Golf PD-TDI (>125k mi.), both bought new
talkinghorse43 is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to talkinghorse43 For This Useful Post:
jcweller1 (08-05-2012)
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 06:43 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © 2006 - 2012, Sprinter-Source.com