2006 Dodge Sprinter Transmission Flush?

This is my 1st post. Please be gentle w/ me. 1st off. I have a 2006 Dodge Sprinter retrofitted for mobile pet grooming business. The built date was in May, 2006 as confirmed by the local Dodge Sprinter certified stealer. Besides couple of broken serpentine belts/tensioner assembly incidents, failed EGR valve, ripped turbo hoses (thank goodness, no turbo resonator YET!) and miswiring of the door locking mechanism that was done WRONG @ the factory, nothing else major. Well, in recent months, my groomer and I started to experience this louder than usual noise coming from under the driving seat (more toward the transmission location of the vehicle) while driving @ between 20-40mph. This loud noise would not subside even @ 50-65mph. We also experience vibration and some sort of "shudder" when vehicle is slowing down from 50mph gradually to 10-20mph. This happens more often than not when my groomer and I manually downshift the transmission by using the automatic transmission (tiptronic just like the Audi as I call it). 3 months ago, I had the brake fluid flushed (I know this was overdue since the manual calls for this every 2 years) by either the local MB or the Dodge shop. The shudder seemed to have disappeared. The van is @ the local Dodge stealership currently waiting for the 2 extra bottles of Fuchs transmission fluid being shipped from Europarts-SD. This is my question:

1. Sprinter tech. @ local Dodge had no clue how to get rid of the "loud noise"/shudder experience. He test drove the van and felt the same way as I did. As always, he emailed to Chrysler engineering group for help. As always, the Chrysler engineering group would ask him to check this and that. Basically, the Sprinter tech is told by Chrysler to perhaps a transmission fluid flush. The Dodge shop told me that they need a total of 4 bottles of Fuchs (each bottle has 4 litres). They would need to essentially use 8 litres of brand new Fuchs to flush through the system and then refill the entire system along w/ the torque converter w/ another 8 litres of Fuchs. I was quite disgusted @ the fact that $$ is out from my pocket just because some Chrysler guy on the other end couldn't come up w/ a better answer to my problem.

This is how I see the whole thing: Dodge stealership is going to waste my 8 litres of Fuchs w/ my owner $$ and then refill my transmission system w/ another 8 litres of Fuchs (my own $$ again), on top of the $180 labor for the flush and transmission filter, pan replacement. Who knows how long this would last or fix the problem. One thing I did ask the Sprinter tech to check and confirm is that w/ the way the van is now sitting idle, he used the transmission dipstick and it shows that the transmission fluid is @ full line while the fluid color is "black". @ least the tranny is not leaking. However, I know the tranny fluid is bad and it's just about the right time to flush the system. But I just can't accept the fact that Chrysler would not give me a new re-man tranny in the 1st place. They just want to make sure the flush would "temporarily" fix my tranny issue and hoping that the tranny won't fail in the next 30K before my warranty expires.

Am I blaming Chrysler wrongly? Should I give them the benefits of doubt? Btw, the 2 extra bottles of 8 litre Fuchs tranny fluid will be arriving @ the shop sometime this Thurs/Fri.. The van currently only has 32k miles, though it's being run non-stop (mostly on high-idle) 8-12 hrs daily if not every other day each wk.

Any thoughts? I feel like there's nothing more I could do.

Thank you in advance.

Regards,

Petman

You have just answered the question we all feel going to the dealer . THERE IS NOTHING YOU CAN DO, but bend over.

I's catch 22. If you do the fix and it doesn't fix it they get to shrug their shoulders. if you don't do it and it bombs out they get to shrug their shoulders, but this time they can say " see we told you to get the flush"

Mechanics are worse than lawyers.

I'm of the opinion you can never change fluids too often so it's not like flushing your money down the drain since all trannies need to have their fluids changed. The price yes it bites.

eschaton said:

...
The van currently only has 32k miles, though it's being run non-stop (mostly on high-idle) 8-12 hrs daily if not every other day each wk.

Any thoughts?

...
Petman

Click to expand...

First let me extend you a hale and hearty welcome to the forum.

I'm surprised the transmission fluid would be "black" after so few (thousand) miles.

If they insist that a flush is necessary why do it with expensive stuff? "Flush" to me indicates that they will use the fluid once through. Why not use Dexron III for the "flush" and then refill with the expensive stuff?

https://sprinter-source.com/forums/showpost.php?p=52791&postcount=21


Actually it has been said that Mercedes Benz does not recommend flushing their transmissions. One issue I remember being mentioned is that during a back flush there is a danger of dislodging the transmission filter which will cause it to no longer pick oil up low in the sump or provide filtering. There may be other issues.

You might read through this thread. There's discussion about flushing transmissions included there.

2004 Sprinter advice on maintenance
https://sprinter-source.com/forums/showthread.php?t=6599&highlight=transmission+fluid+ATF

Good luck. vic

Thank you very much for responding back. I am surprised that a flush is recommended by Chrysler engineers after only 32K miles. As I said previously, I really think that Chrysler simply wants the whatever problem I have w/ the tranny to be covered up/temporary fix and hoping that it would last another 30K/2-year before my extended warranty expires. Then, they just clean their hands and say goodbye to me or charge me outrageous amt. of money for a re-man tranny. The manual says to have transmission serviced @ 60K. Spoke w/ Chrysler customer response. I told them it's misleading and mis-information to lead consumers to believe that the tranny needs service only every 50-60K miles when I have to do it every 30K or so. I did NOT use the word "lawsuit" nor "reporting to consumer protection agency" yet. Perhaps I should have. We purchased Sprinters based on various factors. One of the factors was presumably longivity and fairly long time intervals between service (we use only full synthetic stuff for all serviceable parts as recommended by MB/Chrysler per their technical bulletin).

Anyway, the local Dodge shop is about 40 mins away. They charge around $170 for 8 litres of transmission fluid (not synthetic, mopar stuff, btw) for flushing purpose. That's why I spent $270 to get 16-litre of Fuchs synthetic tranny fluid, transmission filter, and the whole kit from Europarts-SD on my own and shipped to them. The stealership should have the fluids by end of tomorrow, Thursday from UPS. We shall see what happens after the flush and full replacement on Fri when I go pick up the van hopefully... One thing: Chrysler customer response told me based on last conversation that if the flush does NOT repair the fix, perhaps they would consider of doing something else such as $$ reimbursement since I objected the flushing idea to begin w/ as recommended by their engineers. I thought either the customer rep. said something she shouldn't have or it was her own sympathy toward my situation. Either way, I am holding those words dearly in my heart in the coming days once the tranny is flushed...

Guys a few comments.
As a professional mechanic/shop owner we are NOT worse than attorneys nor doctors for that matter--they have only two models to deal with (maybe 2.5 in California!) and if it doesn't work you always have to pay again or see it buried/cremated.
I have a daughter studying to be a surgeon, she has plenty of tales of incompetance/experiments in the med field and explains why I fix Landrovers to pay for her tuition!

Now as a past zone rep/service engineer for several factories it would be right to suspect the fluid in the transmission as having deteriorated or has the wrong fill due to incorrect slip additives etc--this is not uncommon in the world of motor vehicles when faced with complaints of shudder and strange shifting characteristics. In short its the first remedy tool out of the box of tricks--sometimes it works--then sometime it doesn't, but you have least a bench mark to work from.

Black transmission fluid even on a unit having had some considerable mileage is rarely black, this suggests something else is going on.
For info trans fluid is alkali is the chem' world and gradually goes acidic as it works in the transmission--hence the reason to change it per the factory recommendations. Of course few follow that "mumbo jumbo" so the unit gets very acidic inside, hardens the seals and causes gum/varnish build up!
Then its a crap shoot when you do change it, because you "shock" the transmission as it goes from acidic to alkali state which strips out gums/varnishes and causes the internal seals to react often causing unexpected internal leakage resulting in sudden failure--ie no drive!
Hence the reason why it is not recommended by some experts when dealing with an unknown badly serviced unit. Better to slowly dilute the fluid with new to gradually change its chem state over several months of usage.

For that reason when a new cusomer comes on the lot looking for a tranny service I ALWAYS test the vehicle before putting a wrench on it. Simply put the reason for the request to service usually has a hidden agenda--there is a problem and it is hoped that a "service" will fix what is likely to be a progressing expensive problem that isn't disclosed, until an innocent flush really stirs up the transmission and it fails--the shop then gets the blame and those previously mentioned lawyers like cockroaches crawl out of the cracks.
My suggestion woiuld be to present the vehicle to a transmisson specialist who knows the Benz/Sprinter unit and give him the service history before he attempts a fix.
Best of luck
Dennis

Aqua Puttana said:

Actually it has been said that Mercedes Benz does not recommend flushing their transmissions.

Click to expand...

Not only does Mercedes not recommend it, but neither does Chrysler - there is a TSB (Technical Service Bulletin) floating around out there that specifically states that D-C (the entity at the time) does not recommend (or condone ?) flushing anything but the cooling system.

I'd be asking that Chrysler rep: WTF ?

FWIW, I can't say that it was the cause, but a friend just recently replaced his transmission (with around 370K miles on the clock) - and he regularly had his transmission flushed as part of the service.

Me, I think I'll pass.

Petman,

The information that you have gathered is some what accurate. The way we handle this rumble strip and shutter problem that sprinters have is that we have designed the torque converter and along with Sonnax and Raybesto and came up with a spring kit to stop not only this problem but as well as the engine stall problem when first starting in the morning. Mercedes and or Chrysler say that there was never a problem, yet we have put out over 1,000 of these redesign converters to finally stop this problem. This style torque converter was not used after 2006, so that being said on 2007 and up models we do not experience the same problems. I know you don’t want to go to the expensive of replacing the torque converter at these early miles so what you might try is something that we have used in the past and had great success with. The transmission and torte converter from this perspective drain plugs. The pan can be removed and a new transmission filter can be installed. After Draining the converter and transmission there is not a whole lot of flushing to do especially on a 35,000 mile truck. For our sprinter fleet we use specially formulated oil by Pure Power of California. This fluid contains extra friction modifiers that can help with your converter shutter and rumble strip affect. I would suggest just draining the converter and pan, replace the filter and use our oil along with a bottle of Chrysler limited slip differential additive. This additive is sold in 6 or 7 oz bottles. One bottle should be plenty. Our oil is only 30 dollars a gallon and I would suggest buying 3 gallons so you have some left over later. To discuss this problem further give us a call 1.800.369.6601. Don or Bob will be more then happy to further assist you.

Best Regards,
The Sprinter Trans Man

First off, thank you all for your insights. An update is here: Picked up the Sprinter today from the Dodge stealership. Entire transmission system was fully flushed w/ Fuchs's fluid. Transmission fluid and gasket were replaced as well. Drove it for about 40 miles from there to home. Felt the same, i.e. experience shudder from the rear of the vehicle (brake flushed 3-4 months ago) while letting go of the accelerator when approaching a stop light from approx. 40MPH to 20MPH and below. This "shuddering" only lasts for perhaps 2-3 seconds most. Meanwhile, I did not notice of anything else. I could however feel that the engine/transmission is still reving up harder going uphill. Had the Dodge Sprinter tech to check for cracks @ all turbo hoses, resonator and hose end connector. Not cracks found. All tight. One comment specifically type-written on my service receipt: It may take some time for the new transmission fluid to bind w/ the transmission. That's pretty much it. I'm going to drive the van for the next couple of days to see if anything else going on w/ the transmission. If it's not improving (i.e. less noise during shifting and less shuddering during deceleration), I'm going to have it towed again @ Chrysler's expense and demand a re-man transmission...

@ Silver Star Tran: I've never had any engine stalling in the morning. Thank goodness. But I will definitely consider of using your specially formulated transmission fluid next time around.

@ rlent: I thought the same thing too when Chrsyler engineers told the Dodge Sprinter tech to tell me that they want the transmission flushed. I even called and spoke w/ Chrysler's useless customer support line. They said I have to follow the direction put out by Chrysler's engineers or else risk voiding the extended warranty, blah blah. As far as I understand, Sprinter's transmission and torque converter have their own little drain plugs. Credit to MB, they designed the Sprinter's 2006 transmission this way so that "most" of the transmission fluid can be drained out (I was told by Europarts-SD the same thing as well) and replaced as needed.

Anyway, I won't hesitate to demand the "next steps" if the truck continues to have shuddering and louder than usual noises coming from under the chasis during acceleration. Chrysler would NOT get away from this especially when they wanted me to shell out few hundred bucks (unwillingly and protested to their customer service # prior to agreeing the flush) to get the tranny flushed. Now, I have done it. The ball is in their court.

No Problem, Anytime you have Sprinter Transmission problems or need questions about parts we are more then happy to assit you. You can contract us through this fourm or by phone 800.369.6601. Anyone who purshase a Transmission this us mention this forum and get a 100 dollars off.

The Sprinter Doctor.

also to add to the original message:

the part number for the limited slip differential additive for the sprinter transmission is 4318060-AB service requires two bottles.