DIY version of Outside Van bed panel frames?

ECU

2006 T1n 118 Sprinter
I'll throw out one more idea I had for a removable bed. Something akin to a kitchen table with an expanding center section. The legs could be 4 feet apart with the top overhanging a bit more to the edges. This could come out when not needed. Pushed together for traveling. Pull it open like for Thanksgiving dinner and put in the expansion panels.
 
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220629

Well-known member
... Pull it open like for Thanksgiving dinner and put in the expansion panels.
That's a terrible idea. :lol:

:dripsarcasm::dripsarcasm:

Because that is when all the in-laws show up. I don't need them in my Sprinter.

Sorry. Back to topic.

vic
 
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ECU

2006 T1n 118 Sprinter
Well the idea stems from a thread on pop outs. I thought the best I could do with a 118 would be to open the back doors. I started with truck bed slides, then came up with the table idea. Mount a cabinet across the back doors. I could have slides on each side. Pull the bed out almost three feet out the doors and a similar amount inside. That way I had a 78" bed.
Variations would be to mount the table extension to one wall. 20" compacted. Pulls out to 50". Other lengths available.
Fun research, but beyond my construction capabilities.

Not to be merlinistic. My wife likes to drive when we go out together. I need to think of anything besides the driving, so I daydream.
 

d_bertko

Active member
I don't want any support structures inhibiting loading/storage options underneath. Hence the need for a pretty strong frame/platform.
I also did not want any extra support structures but preferred to maximize platform center clearance.

I compromised on my clear span by using cantilever AL bench supports. Design use was for locker rooms---very strong. They attach to my L-track on carrier plates for easy removal. I also could have put them on strong hinges to fold to the wall instead.

But even when the van interior is stripped for pure cargo use I find the basic bench/shelves that sit on the brackets very useful. The benches flip up for extrawide cargo load and are independently wall mounted to allow for the cantilever removal. I have yet to unmount the cantilevers after ten years--just some quick ratchet wrench use---because I've never needed the last bit of cargo space. The wheel wells restrictions are the big factor. OTOH, I have once or twice used the space atop my bed platform to carry wide lighter items.

The Rakks part is EH-1416B

My pair of cross supports are simple 1.5" deep AL U-channels that drop over the bench supports without any tools needed. The bifold atv ramp sections have slip-pin hinges and conveniently slip onto the undersides of the overhead shelf sections for storage when I need a clear center aisle.

I have some 15"w 1/4" ply inserts to turn a laddered ramp section into a solid shelf but stopped using them since the open ladders make it easier to load and secure all sorts of odd shapes.

I do have stacking folding crates that fit the atv ramps well for shelf storage use.
 

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Cole

OUTLAW SPRINTER!!!
I'll post a few pictures that might help with some ideas. I too wanted an Outside Van style of versatility.


I picked up this RV jackknife bed that folds up to a seat. Found it on Criagslist.

This is before any of my conversion work was done. I found that a couple of Motorcycle tie down straps worked just fine for supporting it. We used it this was several times. Neat thing is that the bed lifts out easy and the straps don't take up any room.:thumbup:

 

Cole

OUTLAW SPRINTER!!!
I eventually used 80/20 on the cargo walls to replace the e-track. This gave me endless options for mounting a bed! 1,000s of ways you can mount a bed with 80/20. You could even just make 80/20 panels like outside van and set them on top of the 80/20 side rails. (Put some sort of stop to keep them from sliding forward when you don't want)



Upper and lower rails mounted to the van before the insulation and panels





Low mounting position and panels slid into the 80/20 slots.

 
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Cole

OUTLAW SPRINTER!!!
Fwiw, 5 min to pull the bed out. It's in Cargo mode today so I can go pick up a motorcycle.
(Conversion not totally finished)

 

Inertiaman

Well-known member
Wow, lots of good feedback/examples/ideas from everyone. I really appreciate the responses. Keep 'em coming.

I'll share some specific responses/comments later. Right now, I'm rushing to pack for my flight to pick up my van.
 

Whhite Whhale

Another Member
Here's a DIY version of the Outside Van / Van Specialties build to consider. I chose 16g steel tubing, and welded three separate bed panels then screwed on 1/2" ply, and later glued carpet on top. The horizontal wall rails are 1.5"x2" tubing if I remember correctly (over built). They're about 33" off the floor, and 4' longer than the bed, which allows the whole deal to slide forward or backward. Later I added 2 toggle clamps under each panel to keep everything secure and rattle free. Five years later and it still works great, although some powder coating is slowly wearing through. Below are a couple pics from during the build process. Hope this helps.
 

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Ticktok

New member
This was one of the first things I did in my van. I wanted a platform bed in the rear that would be easily removed if I needed the extra space. I liked the bed that rb components sells but didn't like the price for what it was. They do however piece all of there component systems out individually . I bought the aluminum side rails( your choice of height) and built my own frame out of .083 1"X1" square tube. I put a 5/8" ply on top and have yet to do the mattress - I am liking this Froli product mentioned above.
 

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Inertiaman

Well-known member
I chose 16g steel tubing, and welded three separate bed panels then screwed on 1/2" ply, and later glued carpet on top.
WhhiteWhhale, thanks for the example. What was the dimension of 16g cross members? The photos look like 1"x2" with the 2" dimension vertically oriented. Do you get much deflection when you're seated on a single panel (a common scenario when you're climbing onto the bed)?

I bought the aluminum side rails( your choice of height) and built my own frame out of .083 1"X1" square tube. I put a 5/8" ply on top and have yet to do the mattress - I am liking this Froli product mentioned above.
Ticktok, same question to you: how much deflection are you getting when seated on a single panel? The online deflection calculators show pretty extreme deflection for 1x1 .083 steel. With a 65" span using 1x1 .083 and a 100 pound load, the deflection computes to 7.09 inches! With a 200 pound person potentially applying their entire weight to a single panel (an unavoidable scenario when you enter the bed, it seems) the 100 pound load doesn't seem unreasonable. In fact, if you consider someone sitting on the edge of the first panel (again, a reasonable scenario) then the load on the edge tube would likely be > 100 lbs. even when considering the distribution of force via the panel cross members, plywood, etc.

Obviously having some center support is an easy way to reduce deflection, but for my uses I place very high value on a completely unobstructed compartment below the bed. So I won't compromise on the "full span" platform, but I am willing to utilize whatever materials/design is necessary to provide a robust solution.

I'm having a hard time believing the online calculators, but I've tried several, and they are consistent. For example, a 2 inch diameter .083 wall steel tube across a 65" span deflects nearly 3 inches under a 200 pound load? That is much higher than I intuitively expected. I guess that is analogous to hanging by one hand from the center of the span; perhaps I should find more sophisticated calculators using a load that is distributed wider (ie, butt cheek width, or knee width when crawling on, etc).

Once your weight is distributed across the platforms, the load on any given beam is relatively negligible, so the "sleeping scenario" is easy to design for. But I think that much more severe scenarios are unavoidable. Imagine, for instance, two people sitting together on the edge panel! So part of my solution will likely involve a larger and/or thicker tube at the very edge (van center).
 

Inertiaman

Well-known member
I went through this exercise a couple of years ago so just modified it for the bed panels. I ended up with HDPE for esthetic reasons. If I would need to build bed panels today I would choose:
- 9025 Quick Frame with 2x6mm and 1x8mm double wall polycarbonate filler panels.
- and as a second choice 1010 t-slot profile with 1x6mm and 2x8mm double wall polycarbonate filler panels.
GeorgeRa,
Your deflection calculations w/ the 9025 profile are an order of magnitude less than what I get using online calculators for similar material. If I do a 75 lb load on a 72" span of 1x1 0.60 wall aluminum, the result is 26 inches deflection. Even with a 36 inch length, it computes to 3.33" deflection. The screenshots you posted are less than 0.5 inches.

Am I using the online calculators wrong? Is the load in those calculators a per linear inch load or per linear foot load or something inobvious?

Something doesn't add up here, thanks if anyone can point out what it may be.
 

GeorgeRa

2013 Sprinter DIY 144WB, Portland OR
GeorgeRa,
Your deflection calculations w/ the 9025 profile are an order of magnitude less than what I get using online calculators for similar material. If I do a 75 lb load on a 72" span of 1x1 0.60 wall aluminum, the result is 26 inches deflection. Even with a 36 inch length, it computes to 3.33" deflection. The screenshots you posted are less than 0.5 inches.

Am I using the online calculators wrong? Is the load in those calculators a per linear inch load or per linear foot load or something inobvious?

Something doesn't add up here, thanks if anyone can point out what it may be.
26" deflection on 72" span is called bending. Difficult to comment not knowing who designed the calculator you used. If you plan to use 8020.net profiles I would suggest to use their tool, http://www.8020.net/design-tools-26.asp I have never verified if this tool is correct but trust the company engineering, they have quality product, no reason to believe they have a bad tool. A few times I used it for my designs found that the tool calculations matched actual results.

George.

I remember seeing on this forum someone else using 8020 quick frame for his bed panels, try to search for it. If I recall correctly he had to use a center support in the front panel.
 
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OrioN

2008 2500 170" EXT
GeorgeRa,
Your deflection calculations w/ the 9025 profile are an order of magnitude less than what I get using online calculators for similar material. If I do a 75 lb load on a 72" span of 1x1 0.60 wall aluminum, the result is 26 inches deflection. Even with a 36 inch length, it computes to 3.33" deflection. The screenshots you posted are less than 0.5 inches.

Am I using the online calculators wrong? Is the load in those calculators a per linear inch load or per linear foot load or something inobvious?

Something doesn't add up here, thanks if anyone can point out what it may be.
Can you...

1) Define which / post url of online calculator tools you used.

2) Post a screenshot of the entries in said calculator.




.
 

Ticktok

New member
I weigh 165 and notice a small amount of deflection when seated on the center of a single panel-1/4 to 1/2" maybe. My wife,two kids and I have all slept on the .083 1"X1" frames and it has been fine without a center leg. Originally I had planned to use a clevis pin to fasten the frames together in the center to distribute weight but haven't felt the need
 

Inertiaman

Well-known member
Can you...

1) Define which / post url of online calculator tools you used.

2) Post a screenshot of the entries in said calculator.

I used several and they were all much higher deflection than expected. In reviewing several of them, I've concluded that they are calculating a beam supported only at one end, which would explain the grossly high deflection in some of my cases. But even the calculators which explicitly define the scenario as both ends supported are quite high. One example is here:

http://metalgeek.com/static/deflection.php

On that site, for a 72" span with 1"x1" aluminum .060" wall tubing and 75 pound center load, the deflection computed is:
0.4371" for "ends fixed"
1.7483" for "ends free"

The "ends fixed" numbers are reasonably close to GeorgeRa's 9025 numbers, which on closer inspection were also computed based on fixed ends. I haven't downloaded the 80/20 toolkit to run the "supported ends" numbers, but presumably the deflection on those is much higher.

All of which raises an obvious consideration about what constitutes a "fixed end". I would consider many of the examples I've seen in this thread to be supported, not fixed.

Fascinating stuff. Makes the $3000 RB panel bed look more attractive by the minute! :thinking:
 

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