Tech Alert-Perform this extra procedure at every oil change

220629

Well-known member
I spoke with my mechanic about this & he asked if he'd need a new gasket when he removes the cover & also tourque specs . I have two vans, an 2002 & a 2006 . Are there any differences we need to be aware of ? Thanks for any help Joe
All you are really doing is removing the plastic "weather" cover. For my 2004 I just needed a 5 mm Allen wrench. The back screws are a pain to get to as the firewall is in the way. After this removal I decided to replace the back ones with some 8 mm machine screws that have a 10 mm hex head next time. It may require a small spacer sleeve to fit the cover recess. That way I can just use a regular 1/4" socket handle and socket. (Does anyone have any 10 mm hex head Mercedes machine screws so I don't reduce the collector value of my Sprinter?:tongue:)

The torque isn't really critical. Make them reasonably tight for the size and it'll be fine. It's a straight forward procedure. If the cover doesn't come up with reasonable force, look for another screw to remove. Hope this does some good. AP/vic
 

sikwan

06 Tin Can
In addtion to what AP has said, the different year covers have a different amount of bolts. I believe the latter year model has 1 less bolt.
 

mkmmcd

Family of 8 going on 9
I am just purchasing our first Sprinter. It is a 2002 and has about 86K miles. I have not seen the vehicle yet, except by pictures. I have talked a lot with the current owner, who gave me this forum to look on. Should I ask him to take pictures of the injectors? I am scheduled to fly there next week to purchase the vehicle, if I find it to my satisfaction (I bought one way tickets, so I hope all is well!). Is there any thing else I should be sure to check before I fly there? Thanks for any help.
 

sikwan

06 Tin Can
Should I ask him to take pictures of the injectors? I am scheduled to fly there next week to purchase the vehicle, if I find it to my satisfaction (I bought one way tickets, so I hope all is well!). Is there any thing else I should be sure to check before I fly there? Thanks for any help.
Well, if you already bought your tickets it'll probably be too late to save any money on them if you find that there is black death underneath the injector cover before you departed.

I guess it's cheaper than to fly there and back. I would ask for the injector pictures if possible.
 

teddydar

New member
Hi to all,

Ive had blow back on a injector recently, thought it was only Renault master/Vauxhall Movano only suffered from this issue.

Any back to the post, i removed my injector eventually, had to drill & tap the holder bolt as i stripped the threads 1st time round.

Used a new copper washer, new socket cap screw & Still got bubbles around the injector, this time i didnt try to further do the m8 socket cap screw, just left it.

I've used MB anti-Sieze paste, so if the inejctor fails its easy to get out.

The question I have is if the engine runs okay is it ok to leave a bubbling injector ????

nb: Re the plastic cover I have just left the cover off so any blow back can escape into the atmosphere.

Whats interseting is the different engineers design's eg Renault just use a rubber cover over injectors with clips for easy access,

They use 2 bolts instead of 1, the new injector bolt down kit is expensive but superb...

Ducato/Relay/Jumper/Boxer use the 2.8 hdi engine use a m8 bolt to hold the injector in, easy to get at and dont snap.. they use a plastic pull off cover to cover all injectors.

All in all Sprinter are the best, but they injector blow back issue/access needs re-design. Wondering what the new ones are like??

Another tip when removing injectors when youve cleared carefully all the crud, is to turn the injector back and forth do not lift to much until you get get or free back & forth movement. Im workign on a clap type tool with extended handle with a screwed rod & hook attachment which will aloow the injectors to be romoved by twisting then lifting at the same time, jsut unhook you pipes & electrical connections - easy.
 

abittenbinder

Doktor A (864-623-9110)
Hi to all,

All in all Sprinter are the best, but they injector blow back issue/access needs re-design. Wondering what the new ones are like??
MBenz has so much confidence in the injector hold down design that the the '07-'10 6 cyl uses the SAME part number bolt, seal washer, and hold down pawl.

The primary design criteria is toughness and resistance to fatigue failure. Doktor A
 

parkerbarrow

New member
Thanks for the thread!
My 2002 Freightliner was doing the hard start in cold weather thing but was always fine otherwise. Being in Texas that's been OK. I've known I need to not forget about addressing the issue but had to get through spring. Now that I'm in a position to work on it it has reversed - easy to start if cold but doesn't want to start if she's been driven some. On a trip to see a friend who lives about an hour away she died as if the fuel cut out, though we were fine on fuel.
I've gotten under the cover and found that there is a fair amount of the hardened fuel and varnishing, tho not as bad as the "bad case" photos here. I am surprised to find that it's not gummy or hard to break up... is that normal? While it's not a job I'd do if it wasn't necessary, it's nothing like what I was braced for. Of course, that's just breaking up the lava - I haven't tried any bolts yet!

My immediate question is how to check for leaks on the injectors to identify positively which injectors are leaking? I've seen a post about clear tubing to catch the diesel and one about filling the injector indentations with oil & looking for bubbles. Neither had a response saying these techniques were reliable or not, or whether there was a standard procedure aside from taking it to a Dodge dealership (NEVER AGAIN) or freightliner shop).

Also, is there a way to read the codes without a reader? Most of my other vehicles have been able to do some voodoo with the key, count beeps or blinks, & match to a key.

Finally, the foam on the underside of my plastic cover is dry and even looks charred in one section. It will need to be replaced but I'm pretty sure the gasket I got from Freightliner is not correct. After reading Doktor A's post that the foam is glued in place & should be fine for years I'm guessing they gave me a cylinder head gasket or something.

Does anyone have the link to a reliable injector leak check bookmarked if its been posted? I've done several searches and while always interesting, none of the links have provided a detailed procedure.
Does anyone know of what foam to use on the cover if Mercedes isn't making replacements? (or if they're making them but are crazy expensive compared to equal alternatives)

Thanks in advance!
d
 

220629

Well-known member
...

Also, is there a way to read the codes without a reader? Most of my other vehicles have been able to do some voodoo with the key, count beeps or blinks, & match to a key.
You need a code reader. Some codes can be read with an OBDII generic reader, but it's not the best. To really read the codes you need the dealer type DRBIII scan tool with Sprinter cable and card or a DAD.

There's a little more info at the beginning of this post.
DTC Light Trouble Code DRB OBD List Info
https://sprinter-source.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5369


Does anyone have the link to a reliable injector leak check bookmarked if its been posted? I've done several searches and while always interesting, none of the links have provided a detailed procedure.
...
Thanks in advance!
d
Soapy water should tell you more.

There's some recent discussion over at Yahoo Sprintervan
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/sprintervan/

You need to join to get into the posts.

Re: black death
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/sprintervan/message/55984

Text here:
****
Doktor A is the man.

I guess it needed to come out sooner or later. I'm in the Injector Leakage Black
Death Program.

I've been through the denial stage. I hoped that the smells getting into my 2004
Sprinter cabin weren't injector leakage. If you never remove the cover it isn't
happening.... right?

I removed the cover and found a sticky varnish like coating on the inside of
that. That was my anger stage. Why me? Well, not really angry, I was a bit
miffed. I suppose it is inevitable with over 200,000 miles. Soapy water verified
the leak. It looked like a frickin' Mr. Bubble bath suds commercial.

The inside of the cover cleaned up rather easily with my favorite cheap trick
full strength GOJO Orange Hand Cleaner. I decided not to replace the cover until
after the injector(s) is repaired. My theory is that the tight fitting plastic
cover contains the fumes and acts like an oven to burn onto the hot surfaces.
Those fumes also condense on the inside of the cool cover. I wrapped my injector
electrical connectors with a triple layer of tin foil. I then covered the
injectors themselves and other parts with multi-layered tin foil. Finally I
loosely tented the entire assembly with tin foil. That was about 2 weeks ago. A
few visual inspections have shown no further appreciable build up of gook. A
side benefit is that the smell in the cabin is virtually gone.

I am now in the acceptance stage. Scheduling a quick repair is not possible at
this time. I have been assured that as long as the injector bolt is not broken
and the engine continues to run smoothly there is no reason to panic.

Being that I live on the east coast the only person I would trust for this
non-warranty repair is Doktor A.

Good luck. vic
****

There are some specific tools available for rental that are mentioned if you read posts following my Sprintervan post. Good luck. vic
 

kkanuck

LUV my T1N
What can be done to prevent problems with the injector hold down? That's a good question. The original hold down bolts have a sealer/locking agent pre-applied to the threads. Unlike the glow plugs-removal and application of antisieze is not recommended.

It can be argued that improving fuel quality (especially cetane levels) may help reduce the cyclical stress on the bolt/cyl head threads. Some failures occur spontaneously. Sometimes bolt failures occur when a technician is replacing a problematic injector.

Is it advantageous to pre-emptively install my carbon steel thread inserts and Superbolts? Unless you have all the injectors out for replacement or the cylinder head on the workbench for repair/rebuilding, I would say probably not. Use the best fuel/additives you can-keep an eye on the injectors and act when leakage is occurring. Doktor A


Dr. A,


I am not sure if you have posted this in the past, but what fuel additive do you personally use on your own Sprinter to address cetane levels etc?


Cheers,


Tibor
 

flman

Roadrunner, Genius of Birds ALWAYS WINS! NO FAILS!
We had the cover off our T1N a month ago to replace the CMP sensor, and all looked well at 80K:thumbup:
 

sachiel

New member
First time posting, but this forum is amazing.

Read this thread and just bought a used 2005 3500 @ 132k. Here's what they look like:

#1: CIMG1256 (800x600).jpg
#2: CIMG1257 (800x600).jpg
#3: CIMG1258 (800x600).jpg
#4: CIMG1264 (800x600).jpg
#5: CIMG1266 (800x600).jpg

Thoughts? Is the #1 having issues or it it just close to the front and dirty? Cause for concern?
 

Jinx

New member
Everyone is welcome to send me Sprinter cylinder heads for rebuilding and hold down bullet proofing.

But for those who want to save time and big $$, I make house calls. Doktor A
Good Evening Doktor

How do I go about making an apointmrnt with you? I have the "Black Death".

Jinx
 

sssprinters

New member
Doktor A, I just found that on my 2003 Sprinter, the #2 injector is leaking bad and has the carbon residue covering the hold down bolt. How much do you charge to do the repair on this if I can get it to you from Alabama?
 

abittenbinder

Doktor A (864-623-9110)
Doktor A, I just found that on my 2003 Sprinter, the #2 injector is leaking bad and has the carbon residue covering the hold down bolt. How much do you charge to do the repair on this if I can get it to you from Alabama?
Call me on my Sprinter Hot Line 412-366-6165

We'll discuss all the options available to you.

Doktor A
 

Fred2

New member
First time posting, but this forum is amazing.

Read this thread and just bought a used 2005 3500 @ 132k. Here's what they look like:

#1: View attachment 28847
#2: View attachment 28848
#3: View attachment 28849
#4: View attachment 28850
#5: View attachment 28851

Thoughts? Is the #1 having issues or it it just close to the front and dirty? Cause for concern?
over all it looks VERY clean under there, I've had black death twice now.... once it starts leaking you will know it.... lots of carbon type deposits, oily residue all over the place. Also a good clue will be exhaust smell in the cab, and possibly a phenumatic type sound coming from engine
 

Fred2

New member
Doktor A, I just found that on my 2003 Sprinter, the #2 injector is leaking bad and has the carbon residue covering the hold down bolt. How much do you charge to do the repair on this if I can get it to you from Alabama?
Your in good hands with Andy, he fixed a black death leak for me, 60.000k later it is still running strong.
Fred
 

alfredo

New member
I like Andy's suggestion to inspect under the plastic cover. The area underneath is the first place you will find any clue about impending failure of injector hold down bolts.

This Ladies and Gentlemen, is what you would hope not to find:
to late one of the three sprinters is gone, i havent had the time to look at it, a mechanic come to look at it, and because the engine noise like piston #1 is broke, and without remove the plastic cover i can see all the gunk comming out of the plastic cover. i wish i would read this info before... now it is to late. i will post pics whenever i rmove the engine:frown:
 

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